Close Call

This is a discussion on Close Call within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; I just have had my license about 3 weeks now and have already had to pull out my gun to stop some guys from beating ...

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Thread: Close Call

  1. #1
    Member Array harley91's Avatar
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    Close Call

    I just have had my license about 3 weeks now and have already had to pull out my gun to stop some guys from beating the hell out of me. To start off, my wife, father in law and my self were arriving at a friends house to view the Oscar de lay hoya fight. I parked infront of the house across the street. When my wife crossed first I followed and a car was coming behind us. The driver started yelling obscenities to my wife and being disrespectful. So I yelled at them and told them to shut the F@#$ Up. Well the driver did not like that so he said he was going to kick my A$&. Well he parked in the street about 2 car lengths in from of my pick up and got down while I was standing in the drive way of my friends house. When the driver got down so did the passenger. I was thinking to my self well I can probably take on both of them and be o.k. cause my sister inlaw and boyfriend were parking a few cars ahead down the street. But anyways, the driver of the car took his keys out and went to the trunk and pulled out an aluminum bat. Then started towards me, I then pulled up my shirt and pulled out my XD 9mm SC and racked a round in the chamber. When they saw me do that the gangsters eyes just opend wide. They ran back to their car yelled some words like you P^&&y you wont use it. But, all I did was hold it by my side and they left. Later the cops showed up, I explained the situation and they asked for my license took down my name and left. It was a close call but, I know I would have been in the right. The only thing that kept me from firing was that the guys were too far from me about 50ft.
    Harley 91
    "For those who fight for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know"!
    Kimber Ultra CDP II .45, Kimber Custom II
    XD 9mm sc, XD 40 sc, .357 Colt King Cobra,
    .22 Berreta Bobcat

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
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    Very close call, and you're fortunate it did not end in a bad incident.
    Since you've said you're interested in learning, I'll just make a few comments.

    1) You didn't help the situation by getting into a verbal confrontation. You'd be better off just ignoring the name calling and go inside the house. Call the police if they continue to create a disturbance, or make threats. Most likely, it would have ended if you'd just gone inside. By choosing to escalate the situation, you almost turned an insult into a deadly encounter. If they'd gotten a shotgun out of the trunk instead of a bat, you'd have been in deep trouble, and your family with you. When you're carrying a deadly weapon, it's of the utmost importance to keep your emotions in check.

    2) You're carrying a weapon and it's not ready to use. If you have to rack the slide to chamber a round, you're already way behind the curve should it be a situation that actually requires deadly force. I recommend getting some training and doing some study on effective methods and techniques for concealed carry.

    And once again, stay cool, and keep your emotions out of it!
    Cheers,
    Rod
    "We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded!" Dick Winters

  4. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by harley91 View Post
    So I yelled at them and told them to shut the F@#$ Up. Well the driver did not like that so he said he was going to kick my A$&.
    Welcome to the Forums and I have to say that right there was your Now that you are Carrying Concealed your life has now changed and must follow the Three Precepts of an Encounter:

    Avoidance

    De-escalation

    Deterrence

    You are not longer allowed to have an easily bruised ego. You will put your pride away and let the other guy cuss you and spit you. You will walk away from any avoidable confrontation possible. The weapon is the LAST option you have and only when there is a reasonable threat of death or grave bodily harm and you did nothing to escalate the situation. You cussing at the guy was not only a tactical mistake but a legal one. Any prosecurto can succesfuly present to a jury that you were not defending yourself but looking for a fight because you believe yourself to be some sort of Walker Texas Ranger with a gun strapped to your side.

    Sorry, I did not mean to chastise you in our first exchange, but you must be aware of the immense responsibility of carrying a concealed weapon and consequences that come from its misuse.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  5. #4
    Senior Member Array mzmtg's Avatar
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    You can carry a gun OR an attitude.

    Not both.

    Also, carry with a round in the chamber, always.

  6. #5
    Senior Member Array joleary223's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mzmtg View Post
    You can carry a gun OR an attitude.

    Not both.

    Also, carry with a round in the chamber, always.
    +1 Remember the sticks and stones ryme. Talk is cheap keep walking but keep BG's in sight. You don't want a gunfight with loved ones in the open.

  7. #6
    Distinguished Member Array Stetson's Avatar
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    Sticks and stones will break my bones but names will never hurt me!
    You were willing to get into a gunfight over name calling be real!
    You shouldn't have a permit!If you continue down this path you are
    going to kill someone or get yorself killed.GROW UP!Carrying a firearm carries a huge responsiblity and to be used as a last resort
    to protect yorself and loveones after all other avenues have been exhausted.Remember pride kills!

  8. #7
    Ex Member Array Pete's Avatar
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    This forum is a very useful resource, filled with wise words from experienced people who not only 'walk the walk' but in some cases have walked it to hell and back.
    You would be very well served to learn from the advice given here, we aren't 'chairborne rangers' or 'xbox wannabes'... and we are trying to help you and our cause when we tell you that you acted rashly.

    Don't respond to verbal abuse.
    Don't escalate situations that you can walk away from.
    Don't get into fights over honor.
    Don't draw your weapon to intimidate.

    I hope you get it.

  9. #8
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    Damn.. and I thought I was being mean
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  10. #9
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    As a wife checking into this I'll give you my take.

    I know that a punk calling a good man's wife any kind of names ignites a fire in a his sense of protection and care that is both healthy and respectable. You feel you have a duty to defend your wife and her honor and so you feel you should confront those morons who would disrespect her.

    If anyone insulted or said anything derogatory about me in my husband's presence he would have a very hard time being silent.

    This is a GOOD thing but in need of control and should never lead you to do something rash.

    That being said, I do agree with what is stated above.

    When you carry you put your pride completely aside. That means ignoring any manner of insults that are hurled at you or your family.

    Sometimes it's actually easier to ignore the insults directed at yourself than those directed at someone you love and have vowed to defend.

    Avoidance is your VERY BEST FRIEND when it comes to carrying a gun...

    Drive 10 miles out of your way to avoid a bad area of town.
    Be 10 times as courteous as you would normally be to avoid being being angry with you.
    Be a polite and considerate driver.
    Don't walk down that dark ally when you could take a main road.
    Don't insult other people.
    Watch what you say and how you act.
    Don't wear derogatory clothing that might encourage a fight or have insulting stickers and signs on your car.

    If you think any one of these things is unreasonable, well, then I'd ask you to reconsider your choice to carry.

    I also agree with what else was said. It would be best to get comfortable learning to carry your weapon how it was intended... with a round in the chamber.. When you need it, you'll need it.

    Welcome, and good luck!

    P.S. The only other thing I would have done would be to call the police before the bad guys did. Whoever talks first, wins.
    Last edited by limatunes; May 9th, 2007 at 02:11 PM.

  11. #10
    Member Array OfClanMcnab's Avatar
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    Quite unfortunate. Listening to your story made me feel how angry you must have felt when those guys yelled at your wife. In your shoes I'm sure I would have been enraged and want to respond, but carrying a gun requires you to have a 'paradigm shift'. This means completely changing your way of thinking. You don't walk around with tunnel vision any more, you don't assume everyone around you is filled with happy thoughts and will never hurt you, and you have to practice extreme (some might say 'unhuman') self control.

    When you are carrying a gun, you carry extremely heavy responsibility. Carrying a gun means you are willing to sacrifice your life, because drawing that firearm and shooting it out with another person(s) could mean you wind up dead. Carrying a gun means you can't defend your honor or even your wife's honor. If someone starts cursing you or your loved one or even threatening you, you have an obligation to ignore them, thereby allowing the scum one more day to live a pain-free existence. Only if they act in a way that threatens your life can you then bring swift and harsh judgement to their hate-filled world. If you act in a way that prompts them to threaten you, then you are both legally and morally responsible for their actions. It is unfortunate, but those are the cold hard facts.

    That being said, welcome to the forum! We are all here to learn more. Nobody here is perfect and every one of us is on a road of wisdom.

    Shoot straight.

  12. #11
    Senior Member Array purple88yj's Avatar
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    Harley, first of all, hello and welcome. Stick around you will learn a lot from these guys and gals here.

    Second, fortunately, your experience turned out fairly positive. As mentioned, you will need to learn to be a little more passive in your verbal responses.

    I see no problem with you staying in the driveway until your family was inside, but once inside, that is where you needed to be as well.

    Not having a round in the chamber is not what I would have considered a wise choice. Law Officers have a round chambered, and you better belive that the bad guys do too. Why put yourself at a disadvantage?

    I, personally, am not one to run from a fight, but I don't look for them either. The antagonist in this picture (the driver) was looking for a fight. Otherwise he would have just shut his mouth and waited for you and your wife to move across the street. His exiting the vehicle proves this. By grabbing the bat did escalate the situation, and would have warranted (in my opinion) readying your weapon.

    But to show you the cowardace of criminals, once he was presented with a force greater than his, he ran, still spouting obscenities.


    Short of addressing his first remarks, I don't see where you did terribly bad. I would have done much the same thing...except my gun would have been loaded.
    "A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want in ... And how many want out." British Prime Minister Tony Blair

  13. #12
    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    Avoidance is better than having to spend a lot of time talking to cops and lawyers. Also, it is no longer a valid defense to say 'he needed shooting', no matter how true that might be.
    "If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan

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    Senior Member Array mark555's Avatar
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    Glad things turned out OK. While racking the slide is intimidating as **** it takes too long and puts you at risk. I have an XDSC .40 one of the reasons I bought it was that it is extremely safe to carry in condition one.

    I don’t know how Texas is but in Kansas if you initiate a confrontation that escalates to deadly force then you are at fault. The theory being that you were baiting the other party in the hopes that they would do something stupid and allow you to put them down. Not that you initiated the confrontation, but it is something to keep in mind.

    I have learned a lot from the good folks in this forum, there are a lot of experienced individuals here and you run into very few participants that are just full of hot air, unlike some of the other pro gun / pro CCW forums out in cyber space. I read a lot more then I post so I probably spend way too much time seeing what folks are up too. Welcome and the best of fortune.
    "Hell of a thing, killin' a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have."
    - William Munny (Clint Eastwood in the Unfrogivin)

    “The graveyards are full of indispensable men.” – Napoleon Bonaparte

    “My Idea of a fair fight is beating baby seals with a club”

  15. #14
    Member Array harley91's Avatar
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    Appreciate the feedback. Reading everyones response puts a different twist or light into what I should actually be doing vice, doing what I know or an extinct. I will practice the loading a round and will have to deal with insults in a different manner. Thanks again.
    Harley91
    Harley 91
    "For those who fight for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know"!
    Kimber Ultra CDP II .45, Kimber Custom II
    XD 9mm sc, XD 40 sc, .357 Colt King Cobra,
    .22 Berreta Bobcat

  16. #15
    Kat
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    Quote Originally Posted by harley91 View Post
    The only thing that kept me from firing was that the guys were too far from me about 50ft.
    too far to hit or too far to be in fear for your life?
    Luke 22:36 And He said to them, "But now, whoever has a money belt is to take it along, likewise also a bag, and whoever has no sword is to sell his coat and buy one."

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