CCW'er shot and killed by CCW retired police officer.

CCW'er shot and killed by CCW retired police officer.

This is a discussion on CCW'er shot and killed by CCW retired police officer. within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; I just ran across this on the local tv station. I don't have anytime to really comment at this point as I am at work. ...

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Thread: CCW'er shot and killed by CCW retired police officer.

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array BIG E's Avatar
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    CCW'er shot and killed by CCW retired police officer.

    I just ran across this on the local tv station. I don't have anytime to really comment at this point as I am at work.

    As I was reading I was hoping that the BG was not a CCW holder. He was. Needless to say I am not pleased to find these type of CCW'ers in our community.

    Here is the to the story.

    http://www.wlky.com/news/13436147/detail.html
    Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft!

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  2. #2
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    As far as the story itself goes, when the gun goes on we all need to keep in mind that any dispute could end with lethal force. When we carry, we give up the right to get it stupid disputes over right of way at a stop sign. It's not worth killing someone over.
    Last edited by Blackeagle; June 5th, 2007 at 02:56 PM. Reason: Removed request for an edit of the first post (thanks P95)

  3. #3
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    Sounds like they should have left their ego's at the door when they strapped on their sidearms.

    On a related note, there is a Poll about carry Permits if you go to the news article. Its at 78% in favor and 22 against right now
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    Senior Member Array purple88yj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackeagle View Post
    As far as the story itself goes, when the gun goes on we all need to keep in mind that any dispute could end with lethal force. When we carry, we give up the right to get it stupid disputes over right of way at a stop sign. It's not worth killing someone over.
    Absolutely right. If in doubt, let the other guy pass. I can wait an extra five seconds.

    As for the shooting itself, who drew first? Who fired first? There are way too many details missing to form a solid, third party assessment as to what really happened, though it sounds as if this is not the first complaint that has been filed against Koening.

    Perhaps more details will come in soon.
    "A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want in ... And how many want out." British Prime Minister Tony Blair

  5. #5
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    Need more details - as usual. Surely however totally avoidable had not (seemingly) testosterone entered the quation.

    First post edited to remove unnecessary html.
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  6. #6
    Distinguished Member Array BIG E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by purple88yj View Post
    Absolutely right. If in doubt, let the other guy pass. I can wait an extra five seconds.

    As for the shooting itself, who drew first? Who fired first? There are way too many details missing to form a solid, third party assessment as to what really happened, though it sounds as if this is not the first complaint that has been filed against Koening.

    Perhaps more details will come in soon.
    I know a PO in that area and according to him there was a dispute over a right of way.

    Pickerill blocked in Koening's car (which had his wife inside) and got out to confront him. The two men apparently had words and Pickerill pulled his gun.

    I have also been told that Koening was a competition shooter.
    Pickerill was shot 5 times. 3 in the chest, 1 in the head and 1 in the arm.

    This is all here say, but seems to come from a good source.

    Be sure to vote on that poll.
    Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft!

    -- Theodore Roosevelt --

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    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    78 yes 22% no on the poll.

    Well, certainly 50% (at least) of the ccw'ers in this story did something they shouldn't have. Perhaps the Shooter at first only put his hand on/near his gun in response to feeling threatened buy the shot. (as I likely would've done). The shot guy, who just wanted to be a loud mouth, then saw this as a threat so he pulled. The shooter had his gun drawn quicker and didn't miss. If kayakers story is reasonably accurate, the shot guy maybe didn't have it coming (originally), but shouldn't have been surprised to be facing a gun when walking around like MR tough Guy.
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    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    Sounds like a peeing contest that got out of hand.
    i'll be interested in hearing all the facts.
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    Senior Member Array mark555's Avatar
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    Is it just me or is this poll worded funny?

    SURVEY
    Both the victim and the suspect had a permit to carry a Concealed Deadly Weapon. Kentucky citizens have been able to apply for a Carry Concealed Deadly Weapon license since it became state law in 1996.

    Are you in favor of or against citizens being allowed to carry concealed deadly weapons?
    Yes.
    No.

    Results | Disclaimer


    The way I read it they are asking for a yes or no answer to two different questions. Ether way you answer it you could be wrong.

    Are you in favor of or against citizens being allowed to carry concealed deadly weapons?

    Are you answering yes to in favor or yes to against concealed carry?
    "Hell of a thing, killin' a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have."
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    Sounds like to me, need to ban retired LEOs from carrying if they were under investigation...

    "On Monday, Target 32 investigators confirmed through multiple sources that the City of Jeffersontown was investigating a formal complaint against Koening when he resigned."

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array Fragman's Avatar
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    Killed?

    Where does it say he was killed? Am I misreading the article?

    Yup. guns are for protecting you life, not enforcing your will or proving you're right.

  12. #12
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    Kinda looks like Koenig might have been given an opportunity to quit rather than be fired for cause. That way, the department would avoid the bad press over what he had done.....The rest sounds like mutual testosterone attacks.

  13. #13
    Member Array flmitchell's Avatar
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    It doesn't say if Pickerill had drawn.

    poll is up to 79%

  14. #14
    Distinguished Member Array BIG E's Avatar
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    Yes, we do need more info here. There are many ways that this could have gone down. I'll be watching and will post any new news.
    Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft!

    -- Theodore Roosevelt --

  15. #15
    Member Array General Geoff's Avatar
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    The way the poll is worded, answering "no" means you're unsure. Answering "yes" means you could be for- or against it.
    Discretion is the better part of valour; and a virtue beyond reproach.
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