Man Shoots Burglars: PASADENA, TX: MERGED

This is a discussion on Man Shoots Burglars: PASADENA, TX: MERGED within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by OPFOR dang.45, if you come across that post/info that suggested hotile acts by the burglars, or that they were on Mr. Horn's ...

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Thread: Man Shoots Burglars: PASADENA, TX: MERGED

  1. #166
    Member Array dang.45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    dang.45, if you come across that post/info that suggested hotile acts by the burglars, or that they were on Mr. Horn's property, please direct it to me - I don't remember seeing any actual evidence of either of those things on this thread, but then again there have been 17 pages of posts and I might have missed something! Thanks.
    http://www.click2houston.com/news/14698578/detail.html

    Toward the bottom of the story, there is mention that the BGs were on Horn's property, and that at least one of them made a "lunging motion" toward him. It looks to me like this is Mr. Horn's account, so I don't know how much credence I place in it given his prior statements to the 911 call taker. But hey, "I report, you decide", eh?
    "It is only as retaliation that force may be used and only against the man who starts its use. No, I do not share his evil or sink to his concept of morality: I merely grant him his choice, destruction, the only destruction he had a right to choose: his own." - John Galt, from Atlas Shrugged

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  3. #167
    VIP Member Array edr9x23super's Avatar
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    Just heard this on WOAI radio.....

    WOAI is the clear channel station here in san antonio, please moderators, if this information needs to be merged, do so, because I could not find a related thread.

    On the radio news today I heard that the latest development in the case of the Houston area man who defended his neighbors' property with a shotgun (we probably have all heard the 911 tape a gazillion times); Apparently, one of the would-be burglars of the neighbors residence was an illegal alien and a reputed member of the Columbian MS-13 gang. Reportedly, the case is now being investigated by the Texas DPS and they hint at the Texas Rangers taking over the case. they also said that the perpetrators had crossed onto the gentleman's property and were approaching him when he confronted them, prompting him to shoot them.

    And I remember everyone at work vilifying this guy for killing someone over property.... I guess when the truth comes out, perceptions change.
    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry

  4. #168
    Member Array dang.45's Avatar
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    This may get merged here eventually, but this was just posted regarding Mr. Horn's case...

    http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...ad.php?t=36870
    "It is only as retaliation that force may be used and only against the man who starts its use. No, I do not share his evil or sink to his concept of morality: I merely grant him his choice, destruction, the only destruction he had a right to choose: his own." - John Galt, from Atlas Shrugged

  5. #169
    Senior Member Array Herknav's Avatar
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    Michael Smerconish (conservative radio host) played the transcript on his show this morning. Mr. Horn did himself no favors on that 9-1-1 tape. It should be noted, however, that he said on the tape they were in HIS yard and coming after him when he shot. One could argue that if he hadn't gone out of the house, he wouldn't have shot them. You could also argue that if the burglers hadn't been there, they wouldn't have gotten shot.

  6. #170
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    Thanks dang.45 and Herknav. It might sway my opinion if, in fact, the burglars were on Mr. Horn's property and coming towards him. Hard to prove their actions, of course, because he killed them (as he told 9-1-1 he was going to), so now we only have his word.

    And yes, they wouldn't have been killed had they not been burglarizing, that point is beyond dispute. What is in dispute is whether or not the theft of a virtual stranger's property is worthy of summary execution. Also in dispute is whether or not Mr. Horn's intent was to be a good neighbor and attempt to detain, or to kill regardless of the burglar's actions... Mr. Horn's statements lead me towards the latter conclusion on that count, and I think I've been pretty clear on whether or not I want anyone to kill over a bag of my things.
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  7. #171
    Senior Member Array Herknav's Avatar
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    OPFOR,

    I hear you, brother. I 'd like to think he went out there to detain the guys and things went sour. That's going to be hard to argue in light of his statements to the dispatcher.

    A can of Coke says the neighbors who own the break-in house don't contribute one thin dime to his defense fund.

  8. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by edr9x23super View Post
    WOAI is the clear channel station here in san antonio, please moderators, if this information needs to be merged, do so, because I could not find a related thread.

    On the radio news today I heard that the latest development in the case of the Houston area man who defended his neighbors' property with a shotgun (we probably have all heard the 911 tape a gazillion times); Apparently, one of the would-be burglars of the neighbors residence was an illegal alien and a reputed member of the Columbian MS-13 gang. Reportedly, the case is now being investigated by the Texas DPS and they hint at the Texas Rangers taking over the case. they also said that the perpetrators had crossed onto the gentleman's property and were approaching him when he confronted them, prompting him to shoot them.

    And I remember everyone at work vilifying this guy for killing someone over property.... I guess when the truth comes out, perceptions change.
    Many say that someone's life is not worth 'property'...well that's sort of true!
    These illegals were (according to early reports)...'dirtbags' through and through, and they got what they deserved.

    In TX, and unfortunately not in ALL states, an individual CAN defend live AND PROPERTY with deadly force.

    I believe that this Texan will get through this 'home defense' (defending his neighbor's house) without being charged...I hope!

    No mercy for thiefs...it's aboiut time that B&E's became a VERY DANGEROUS occupation...

    Call me 'Mr. Tunnel Vision', but these criminals were already WAY over the line with long records and 'back again' after being put out of the country...they deserved the 'dirt nap' that they both earned.

    Some day I'll tell you all how I really feel...

    Stay armed...stay safe!
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  9. #173
    Senior Member Array jframe38's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    Bill O'Reilly had a couple of lawyers on tonight, defense & prosecuting, talking about Horn's shooting. The BGs were illegal immigrants and after the lawyers were making their cases O'Reilly simply stated, if they weren't here the shooting would not have never happened/taken place.
    Why didn't we think of that?

  10. #174
    Distinguished Member Array CT-Mike's Avatar
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    Well,

    O'Reilly and I agree on that point. I don't feel that an illegal alien should have all the protection of the constitution that a citizen enjoys. Basic rights sure, but the ability to bring civil suits should definitely not be allowed, among other things.
    "The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield, and government to gain ground."

    - Thomas Jefferson

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  11. #175
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    So, had someone murdered my grandparents (who were here illegally for a short while), it would have been good to go? Again, I am very much against illegal immigration, but it's not a capital crime. And Horn had no way of knowing their immigration status in any case...

    And wait a minute - were they black, or were they Honduran? Both, perhaps? Maybe the wrong group of protesters were out there!
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  12. #176
    Distinguished Member Array CT-Mike's Avatar
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    I am not saying that just because someone is in the country illegally makes it open season, far from it. Like I said I have no problem with someone being afforded the basic protections of the constitution, I just don't feel that a child born in this country to an illegal should be afforded automatic citizenship, shouldn't be given ID cards allowing them to open bank accounts, get free healthcare, etc (New Haven, CT).
    "The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield, and government to gain ground."

    - Thomas Jefferson

    "I'm the arrow, you're my bow, shoot me forth and I will go"

    "Do not let any individual posts put a knot in your Big Boy Under-Roos"

  13. #177
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    I was responding to jframe38, CT-Mike - you slipped in while I was typing! Actually, I was responding to Bill O'... I wonder how he'd have liked it if Grandma O'Reilly had been executed, and the judge said, "Well, she shouldn't have been here."
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  14. #178
    Senior Member Array jframe38's Avatar
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    Hey guys it was not my intention to start anything. I was just stating O'Reilly's point of view. Two lives were taken. Maybe for their food money or their drug money but they were loved by somebody.
    I personally am not in favor of this shooting and that doesn't change because they are illegal.
    Heck my last girlfriend was illegal from Europe. (Very sweet lady by the way.)
    I have a few friends "w/o papers" who are some of the nicest, respectful, hardest working people I've ever met.
    The government has made the process to become a citizen a lot harder since 9/11.

  15. #179
    Member Array abuttermilk's Avatar
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    But this didn't start out as a thread about illegal immigration but as a thread about breaking and entering thieves!!! The illegal immigration and MS13 and long list of priors is just more fuel for the fire. Also, they were on his property and their brazenness shows a total disregard for the law and other humans.
    "It does not take a majority to prevail,,,,,,but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." Samuel Adams

  16. #180
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    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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