Where it helped?

This is a discussion on Where it helped? within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Ok, I know there have got to be threads out there on this, but given the time left in the workday I need responses from ...

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Thread: Where it helped?

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Where it helped?

    Ok, I know there have got to be threads out there on this, but given the time left in the workday I need responses from folks off the cuff so to speak.

    The Concealed topic came up in conversation with one of the guys I've started going shooting with. My email response to him was, I thought, effective. He disagreed. Part of my response I credited and linked to one of Lima's responses over at her Blog here: Am I Paranoid, Afraid, or Unhappy?.


    Needless to say his response was still on the lacking logic side:
    Dude ... you are not a female nor are you living in south Baltimore anymore.

    Where you work and live and the space you travel is reasonably safe.

    Situation awareness ...... if you feel unsafe in a situation, leave.

    Let me know if you can find news where an armed person, not in a liquor store, used a gun they were caring to protect them or somebody else.

    Unsafe situations do not count.
    So...have at it. I'm particularly interested in the incidents in the "reasonably safe" parts of town.

    edit:
    Oh yeah...thanks to Lima. Although this is the one person that Lima's blog hasn't seemed to affect in any way...odd.
    Last edited by packinnova; May 6th, 2008 at 03:20 PM. Reason: thanks
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the **** out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by packinnova View Post
    Ok, I know there have got to be threads out there on this, but given the time left in the workday I need responses from folks off the cuff so to speak.

    The Concealed topic came up in conversation with one of the guys I've started going shooting with. My email response to him was, I thought, effective. He disagreed. Part of my response I credited and linked to one of Lima's responses over at her Blog here: Am I Paranoid, Afraid, or Unhappy?.


    Needless to say his response was still on the lacking logic side:


    So...have at it. I'm particularly interested in the incidents in the "reasonably safe" parts of town.

    edit:
    Oh yeah...thanks to Lima. Although this is the one person that Lima's blog hasn't seemed to affect in any way...odd.
    Also, I'm lost on the logic of safe versus unsafe situations. Clearly he recognizes that a liquor store tends to have an elevated level of unsafe situations associated with it. So when does a safe situation become unsafe and at one point will he recognize this difference? When does one become cognizant of the differentiating forces between a situation turning from safe to unsafe and vice versa?

    We're also talking about a rocket scientist here so usually everything he does is very methodical and logical which is why his response is rather baffling coming from him.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the **** out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

  4. #3
    Member Array CCWINNC's Avatar
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    What about the church shooting in Colorado awhile back. Not a unsafe place as far as I would be concerned.
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    Member Array Benthic's Avatar
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    Here's a whole list of stuff for you. I don't know how credible this information is...I turned it up with a Google search.

    Civilian Gun Self-Defense Blog


    Brian

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    Distinguished Member Array kazzaerexys's Avatar
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    Ummm, how about Jeanne Assam, at the Colorado Springs church? Or the off-duty officer at the Trolley Square Mall in Utah? Or the vice principal in Pearl, Missisippi? Or the law students at Apalachian?

    And ditto on benthic's recommendation---all those stories are from the newspapers, and plenty of them do not involve liquor stores or stop 'n' robs.
    “What is a moderate interpretation of [the Constitution]? Halfway between what it says and [...] what you want it to say?” —Justice Antonin Scalia

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    So he believes where you work, live and you travel is "reasonably" safe? I don't think reasonably safe is the same as completely safe. Does he?

    And then we always have the obvious question. How does your carrying harm him?

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    VIP Member Array deadeye72's Avatar
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    You should be prepared that no matter how much proof you provide him, you still may be unable to change his mind.
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  9. #8
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadeye72 View Post
    You should be prepared that no matter how much proof you provide him, you still may be unable to change his mind.
    Yeah, we've already agreed we may end up not agreeing, but that isn't preventing us from getting along or still planning range trips. He did leave the door open however, in his last message which I quoted in the OP.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the **** out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

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    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    There was that family in Connecticut? i think. Great upscale neighborhood, prominent doctor. He was beaten in front of his wife and 2 teenage daughters (home invasion). Then he was tied up while his wife and older daughter were reaped and beaten. Then the place was doused with gasoline and set ablaze with the whole family in it. I do believe that some fuel was poured directly on the mom and older daughter. Dad was the only to survive. I'd rather be dead myself.
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    VIP Member Array havegunjoe's Avatar
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    It is easy to say if you feel unsafe “leave”; it is just hard to do sometimes. Also by the time you feel that tingling feeling the attack has often started. It is easier to find where unarmed people in what they thought were a safe place end up being attacked and could have used a gun to save themselves. Take the Doctor’s family in CT last summer. They were in an affluent neighborhood in a town where things like this never happen. Guess what, the unthinkable happened. Or how about Dru Sjoden in a crowded shopping mall parking lot, in daylight, at Christmas time, talking on her cell phone. She I am sure felt completely safe. Her mother once made a profound statement when she said, “Dru could not conceive of such evil in the world”. That is your friend’s problem. He believes that if you don’t live in a gang neighborhood you are safe. He just might be surprised to find out who some of his neighbors really are.
    DEMOCRACY IS TWO WOLVES AND A LAMB VOTING ON WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH. LIBERTY IS A WELL ARMED LAMB CONtestING THE VOTE.

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Some people are to smart for their own good "my mom use to say that a lot"
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    Ex Member Array TacticalCompact's Avatar
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    This reminds me of the conversation I had the other day with a fellow from New York City. He wouldn't let me talk, and told me that I'm not convincing him no matter what, so we shouldn't have this conversation... after he said his part of course.

    He even said that the only thing I can present him is with "over-the-top doomsday scenarios that will never happen."

    This is what people have become -- complacent. They don't think anything bad can or will ever happen to them. Those things only happen to other people, and they are fine with that. He doesn't need a gun and neither do you, because these things won't happen to you. Therefore, nobody should carry a gun because that only increases the chance that something bad WILL happen to him or you.

    I'm sorry, but if this person is truly a rocket scientist, he should be brave enough to register here at DC.com and discuss the matter. Should he decide to do so, I would hope everyone would welcome the opportunity and treat him with repect!

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    Senior Member Array HowardCohodas's Avatar
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    I wonder if he removed the spare tire from his car. Saves weight, therefore saves gas. Tires hardly ever blow out. I wonder...
    Howard
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    Ex Member Array rube's Avatar
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    Sometimes, more often than not the best reply is no reply. People are going to do what they decide is the thing to do or the way to be. Your friend's perception is his take on reality and the best you can do is hope for his sake that his dream of reality never becomes a nightmare. Wonder does he believe in locking his doors at night?

  16. #15
    Senior Member Array press1280's Avatar
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    Many of the defensive "success stories" are home break-ins. I don't think they all took place in crappy areas.
    Besides, what matters is that bad stuff happens everywhere, like VA TECH. I'm sure a gun or 2 in one of the hands of the victims could have made a HUGE difference.
    "The right of the whole people, old and young, men, women and boys, and not militia only, to keep and bear arms of every description, not such merely as are used by the militia, shall not be infringed, curtailed, or broken in upon, in the smallest degree..."
    Nunn v. State GA 1848

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