UGLY: Illegal Immigrant Stops Robbery - Mercedes, TX

This is a discussion on UGLY: Illegal Immigrant Stops Robbery - Mercedes, TX within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; News: Sheriff: Immigrant shot burglar teen | immigrant, burglar, sheriff : TheMonitor.com MERCEDES - An illegal immigrant tasked with guarding a convenience store shot and ...

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Thread: UGLY: Illegal Immigrant Stops Robbery - Mercedes, TX

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array CT-Mike's Avatar
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    UGLY: Illegal Immigrant Stops Robbery - Mercedes, TX

    News: Sheriff: Immigrant shot burglar teen | immigrant, burglar, sheriff : TheMonitor.com

    MERCEDES - An illegal immigrant tasked with guarding a convenience store shot and killed a teenager who attempted to burglarize it, Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Treviño said Monday.

    Silvestre Delgadillo, 28, remained on the run and authorities had "no idea" whether he fled to Mexico, Treviño said.

    Delgadillo, who was convicted in 2005 on a felony drug charge, has been charged with unlawful possession of a firearm by a felon, a third-degree felony.

    But the actual homicide is complicated by Texas' castle law, which allows people to use lethal force to defend themselves and their property.

    Delgadillo is accused of shooting Roberto Garcia, 17, late Friday night.

    "He is there to protect his residence - protect the business - under the direction of the owner," Treviño said.

    He said he will submit the case to the District Attorney's office, which will then present it to a grand jury. The grand jury will determine whether to charge Delgadillo in connection with the homicide.

    Delgadillo, who was deported after being released from prison earlier this year, could also be charged with a felony for illegally re-entering the country.

    The shooting occurred late Friday or early Saturday, Treviño said, when Garcia and Ramiro Garza and Eloy Santana, both 17, tried to burglarize Valeria's Drive Thru convenience store by breaking through its roof.

    Delgadillo was living inside the business, though, and had been told by store owner Olivia Lopez, 34, to guard it with a gun she provided, Treviño said. Delgadillo shot Garcia during the burglary, hitting him in the lung and artery, Treviño said. The wound killed Garcia within minutes.

    Lopez, the storeowner, will be charged with failure to report a felony because she was not candid with police about the shooting, Treviño said. A grand jury would also have to decide whether she could face any sort of homicide charges.

    "Ms. Lopez gave a convicted felon a firearm," Treviño said. "That's against the law. She lied to us from the onset of the investigation. That's against the law."

    Garcia's accomplices will also be charged with burglary, Treviño said.

    I feel that Ms. Lopez should be charged with the murder under the felony murder law. I am not saying that the teen did not need shooting, and under Texas Castle doctrine this probably would have been a good shoot. I also hope that Delgadillo is caught and brought to justice as well.
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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Guns and more's Avatar
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    Well, what a fine mess we create when we allow illegals to run anywhere. He's just out of prison (?) the sheriff doesn't know where he is. I wonder if the perps were illegals also. Sadly, the next President has no intention to close the border either.

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    Senior Member Array Shizzlemah's Avatar
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    Hmn, interesting.

    Illegal possession of a firearm is definite, illegal transfer of a firearm is probable.

    Seems legal under Texas law - esp after the Horn case really put light on the fact that you have much more leway to shoot those robbing your neighbor than yourself.

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    That is such a mixed up messy soup that I don't even know what to say about it.
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    If the homicide is justifiable, then the killing itself is not a crime. If the shooter stays on the run, though, he might get indicted because he is not around to present his defense. IMHO Felony Murder does not apply because the felony (giving the gun to a known felon) was not proximate to the killing.

    As much as things went wrong here, it sounds like the shoot itself is a good one, at least in Texas. I have no problem calling self-defense when I see it, even if the the shooter shouldn't have had a weapon in the first place. Get him on the charges that apply, and the owner too, but I don't think anybody should be charged with murder or manslaighter here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shizzlemah View Post
    Seems legal under Texas law - esp after the Horn case really put light on the fact that you have much more leway to shoot those robbing your neighbor than yourself.
    Actually, according to Ayoob (who does breakdowns of shootings in his Ayoob Files columns), Horn shot the two burglars on his own property, and at least one of them was advancing on Horn with a crowbar at the time. News coverage notwithstanding, it was a pretty straightforward self-defense shoot for Horn---which he could have avoided by staying inside, something he know probably wishes he had done.
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    That is such a mixed up messy soup that I don't even know what to say about it.
    That pretty much sums it up. It's a good shoot, but...

    All I know is I hope Garcia goes to jail for a long time. Giving a felon/illegal alien a firearm, harboring an illegal/fugitive, interfering in an investigation...I'd say she's up the creek without a paddle.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kazzaerexys View Post
    If the homicide is justifiable, then the killing itself is not a crime. If the shooter stays on the run, though, he might get indicted because he is not around to present his defense. IMHO Felony Murder does not apply because the felony (giving the gun to a known felon) was not proximate to the killing.

    As much as things went wrong here, it sounds like the shoot itself is a good one, at least in Texas. I have no problem calling self-defense when I see it, even if the the shooter shouldn't have had a weapon in the first place. Get him on the charges that apply, and the owner too, but I don't think anybody should be charged with murder or manslaighter here.
    Well said, I don't think self-defense (or castle-defense or whatever you want to call it depending on the state and laws) changes due to other circumstances. While he may not have the right to possess a gun, that doesn't mean that he cannot defend himself with said illegal gun. Should he face charges for possession, flight, parole violation, etc? Absolutely. But after Joe Horn --- I just don't see this coming close to anything other than justifiable homicide at all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by matiki View Post
    Well said, I don't think self-defense (or castle-defense or whatever you want to call it depending on the state and laws) changes due to other circumstances. While he may not have the right to possess a gun, that doesn't mean that he cannot defend himself with said illegal gun. Should he face charges for possession, flight, parole violation, etc? Absolutely. But after Joe Horn --- I just don't see this coming close to anything other than justifiable homicide at all.
    The sticky part is that in Texas you have to have had a right to be there in the first place. An illegal alien/prior felon taking up residence in somebody's restaurant holed up with a gun is on the very shaky edge of having any sort of right to be there.
    There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil.

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    Interesting stuff

    Quote Originally Posted by Kerbouchard View Post
    The sticky part is that in Texas you have to have had a right to be there in the first place. An illegal alien/prior felon taking up residence in somebody's restaurant holed up with a gun is on the very shaky edge of having any sort of right to be there.
    This one is a mess. Interesting as heck, and it will be interesting to see what happens.

    One real problem here is that the people involved, owner, illegal teen guard, are both probably fairly unsophisticated people for whom the more complex issues are inaccessible. Owner may not have known she shouldn't give a teen a gun, least of all one with a felony charge. Kid should have been wiser that take it, but is a kid in desperate straights needing to make some money.

    And we should protect our border so he wouldn't have been here in the first place, not the perp--- who at least won't be a problem in the future.

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    this will most likey be a very long case, with appeals to who knows where......

    owner of business broke the law by giving the firearm to the felon....period

    shooter broke the law by being in possession of the firearm within 5 years of release from confinement (and after that its only allowed where they live, which in this case is supposedly at the store)

    shooting itself should be justified under Chapter 9 of penal code, defense of one's own property (since he lived there) and defense of other person's property since burglary was being committed

    of course, the media is wrong in all this, the new "Castle" law has absolutely nothing to do with this situation, everything relating to shooting someone committing burglary was already justfied in chapter 9 before the Castle law...just FYI
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    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    Charge Delgadillo with posession of the weapon, and immigration issues.
    Charge Garza and Santana with felony murder and the burglary.
    Charge Lopez with giving a weapon to a felon and making the false statements.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    Charge Delgadillo with posession of the weapon, and immigration issues.
    Charge Garza and Santana with felony murder and the burglary.
    Charge Lopez with giving a weapon to a felon and making the false statements.


    Garza and Santana will only be charged with burglary....they didn't kill anyone

    Lopez will be charge with several things including providing a firearm to a know felon, and several other possibilities

    Delgadillo should be charged with the immigration and felon in possession ofa firearm,but IMO the shooting was justified
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    Quote Originally Posted by 64zebra View Post
    Garza and Santana will only be charged with burglary....they didn't kill anyone
    They don't have to have killed anyone to be charged with felony murder: Felony murder rule - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    Charge Delgadillo with posession of the weapon, and immigration issues.
    Charge Garza and Santana with felony murder and the burglary.
    Charge Lopez with giving a weapon to a felon and making the false statements.
    Agreed. I think it would be silly to say that an illegal immigrant should be charged with murder for something that was clearly justifiable for a non-illegal... yes, weapons and immigration charges, but the shooting was justified.

    And, yes, felony murder for the cohorts.
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    I am not sure who I should root for. Well actually I do. NEITHER. Throw them both in jail.

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