FBI: Justifiable homicides at highest in more than a decade

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Thread: FBI: Justifiable homicides at highest in more than a decade

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array BAC's Avatar
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    FBI: Justifiable homicides at highest in more than a decade

    Source: USA Today

    FBI: Justifiable homicides at highest in more than a decade

    By Kevin Johnson, USA TODAY

    The number of justifiable homicides committed by police and private citizens has been rising in the past two years to their highest levels in more than a decade, reflecting a shoot-first philosophy in dealing with crime, say law enforcement analysts.

    The 391 killings by police that were ruled justifiable in 2007 were the most since 1994, FBI statistics show. The 254 killings by private individuals found to be self-defense were the most since 1997.

    The FBI says a homicide committed by a private citizen is justified when a person is slain during the commission of a felony, such as a burglary or robbery. Police are justified, the FBI says, when felons are killed while the officer is acting in the line of duty. Rulings on these deaths are usually made by the local police agencies involved.

    Some law enforcement analysts say the numbers represent changing attitudes on the streets, where police have felt more threatened by well-armed offenders, and citizens have taken greater responsibility for their own safety.

    Northeastern University criminal justice professor James Alan Fox describes an emerging "shoot-first" mentality by police and private citizens. For several years, police departments have armed their officers with higher-powered weapons to keep pace with criminal gangs. "Clearly there is a message out there that citizens may be able to defend themselves" as well, he says.
    FIND MORE STORIES IN: United States Supreme Court | Wisconsin | Hurricane Katrina | National Rifle Association | Carnegie Mellon University | Second Amendment | Wayne LaPierre | James Alan Fox

    Alfred Blumstein, a Carnegie Mellon University criminologist, says the gun "legalization movement" also may have helped create a "greater willingness" among citizens to act in self-defense.

    Forty-eight states provide various rights to carry firearms. Illinois and Wisconsin do not, according to the National Rifle Association. In a landmark decision, the Supreme Court in June carved out a right to individual gun ownership, ruling that the Second Amendment allows citizens to keep guns in their homes for self-defense.

    The NRA and other analysts say most laws allowing gun possession have existed for years and would not likely account for a recent spike in self-defense killings.

    Instead, Wayne LaPierre, the NRA's executive vice president and chief executive officer, says the Sept. 11 attacks and the widespread looting and violence after Hurricane Katrina spurred some people to take more responsibility for their own safety.

    Immediately after those events, LaPierre says the group's gun-safety trainers reported "big increases" in NRA-sponsored courses. "Americans are simply refusing to be victims," he says.

    Florida State University criminologist Gary Kleck says the FBI underestimates self-defense killings by citizens because the ones that are not precipitated by felony crimes may not get counted. "Less than a third of (citizen killings) are reported," he says.

    -B

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  3. #2
    Senior Member Array rolyat63's Avatar
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    This is the kind of data that should be on billboards. I'd also like to the extrapolated cost savings on society, the judcial, and prisons. One could also make some inferences about the reduction of crimes due to this. Made be hard to make the corollary but I'm sure there is one and especially if this data are focus on the "correct" demographic and agressively advertised.
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    VIP Member Array PatrioticRick's Avatar
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    citizens have taken greater responsibility for their own safety.
    "Clearly there is a message out there that citizens may be able to defend themselves"
    the gun "legalization movement" also may have helped create a "greater willingness" among citizens to act in self-defense.
    people to take more responsibility for their own safety.
    "Americans are simply refusing to be victims,"
    Music to my ears.
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    VIP Member Array miklcolt45's Avatar
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    Alfred Blumstein, a Carnegie Mellon University criminologist, says the gun "legalization movement" also may have helped create a "greater willingness" among citizens to act in self-defense.

    Forty-eight states provide various rights to carry firearms. Illinois and Wisconsin do not, according to the National Rifle Association. In a landmark decision, the Supreme Court in June carved out a right to individual gun ownership, ruling that the Second Amendment allows citizens to keep guns in their homes for self-defense.
    A 'greater willingness?' How about a greater ability because the law does not limit the right to own weapons of self-defense?

    'Carved out' a right to gun ownership? How about the Supreme Court noted what the nation's founders had long known, that gun ownership was a right given by our Creator, and that that right should not be curtailed by those who think they are our 'betters?'
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliott

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    VIP Member Array raevan's Avatar
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    A good indication that things are back on the right track. Now we need headlines that read "Victim defends self, 5 gangbangers dead". Lets put some fear into the Felons.

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    VIP Member Array BAC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rolyat63 View Post
    I'd also like to the extrapolated cost savings on society, the judcial, and prisons.
    Good idea.

    One could also make some inferences about the reduction of crimes due to this.
    Bad idea. If there's no proof, there's no proof, even for a correlational link between the two. Gun control has been correlated to a rise in crime, but lack of gun control or reduced gun control has not been shown conclusively to reduce crime; it simply has no apparent effect on crime.

    miklcolt45, I noticed that too, and cringed, but it is USA Today. I'd say it did pretty good.


    -B

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    VIP Member Array JAT40's Avatar
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    "shoot-first" mentality - That's whats it all about, our lives or theirs. I prefer it be theirs, God bless America and our 2A rights. Good article.
    While people are saying "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, ... and they will not escape. 1Th 5:3

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    Senior Member Array jeephipwr's Avatar
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    very good read

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    Like Ted Nugent says, "No repeat offenders, just dead offenders."

    That's exactly as it should be...time to start making the dirtbags fear the 'working conditions'.

    Stay armed...no repeat offenders...stay safe!
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    Member Array Fmr18z's Avatar
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    Florida State University criminologist Gary Kleck says the FBI underestimates self-defense killings by citizens because the ones that are not precipitated by felony crimes may not get counted. "Less than a third of (citizen killings) are reported," he says.
    SoMr. Kleck......do you know where some dead bodies, that weren't reported, are buried that no one else knows about??? How would you know who killed these people and that they were actually private citizens...or do you have associates that the American people should know about...you don't happen to have friends in Acorn, do you?
    The first time you aren't armed and prepared may be the last time you wished you were.

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    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Did the math, that's 61% LEO v. 39 % citizen, or roughly 4 out of every 10, and for the ambitious, almost half.

    The numbers do say a lot, don't they?
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

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    I think the average "Joe" needs to start showing less restraint like the LEO's so we can close the gap on this statistic.

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    Member Array kohburn's Avatar
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    whats this? 40% of justified shootings are done by average citizens? I thought the Police were always supposed to be there to protects us and that we didn't need guns to protect ourselves? :sarcasm:
    "An armed society is a polite society" - Robert A. Heinlein

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    VIP Member Array LongRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fmr18z View Post
    SoMr. Kleck......do you know where some dead bodies, that weren't reported, are buried that no one else knows about??? How would you know who killed these people and that they were actually private citizens...or do you have associates that the American people should know about...you don't happen to have friends in Acorn, do you?

    He would know because Dr. Kleck is one of the worlds foremost researchers of the effects of guns and gun control on our society. Dr. Kleck began his research as a firm believer in gun control. But in a speech delivered to the National Research Council, he said while he was once "a believer in the antigun' thesis," he has now moved "beyond even the skeptic position." Dr. Kleck is a professor in the school of criminology and criminal justice at Florida State University. His book "Armed Resistance to Crime" won Dr. Kleck the prestigious American Society of Criminology Michael J. Hindelang award. This award is given for the book published that makes the most outstanding contribution to criminology. As an unbiased researcher he has become one of the foremost adversaries of gun control. His studies and books are a major asset to those who support the right to bear arms by educating the public, police, politicians and academia about the fallacies and ineffectiveness of gun control. His studies have repeatedly exposed the anti gun bias of the media and the lies perpetrated by the Brady Bunch. Despite repeated attempts to discredit him and his studies, his research has proven to be above reproach. His integrity and the excellent methodology employed by Kleck has won over many other researches who used to advocate gun control. Many of whom have come full circle and now support private gun ownership and the use of guns for self defense. You might be familiar with some of these facts about guns, that are now common knowledge because of his studies:

    *Guns are used 2. 5 million times a year in self-defense. Law-abiding citizens use guns to defend themselves against criminals as many as 2. 5 million times every year or about 6,850 times a day 20. This means that each year, firearms are used more than 80 times more often to protect the lives of honest citizens than to take lives.

    * Of the 2. 5 million times citizens use their guns to defend themselves every year, the overwhelming majority merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers. Less than 8% of the time, a citizen will kill or wound his/her attacker. (Kleck and Gertz, "Armed Resistance to Crime)

    * As many as 200,000 women use a gun every year to defend themselves against sexual abuse. (Kleck, Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America,)

    * Armed citizens kill more crooks than do the police. Citizens shoot and kill at least twice as many criminals as police do every year (1,527 to 606) (Kleck, Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America,)

    Some of the books he has written about Guns and control are

    Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America by Gary Kleck

    Armed: New Perspectives on Gun Control by Gary Kleck and Don B. Kates

    Targeting Guns: Firearms and Their Control (Social Institutions and Social Change) by Gary Kleck

    The Great American Gun Debate: Essays on Firearms & Violence by Don B. Kates, Gary Kleck, John K. Lattimer, and Gary Kleck

    Stopping Power: Why 70 Million Americans Own Guns by J. Neil Schulman and Gary Kleck

    The Great American Gun Debate : Essays on Firearms and Violence by Don B.; Kleck, Gary; Boen, James R.; Lattimer, John K. Kates

    Point Blank, Guns & Violence in America by Gary Kleck

    Stopping Power: Why 70 Million Americans Own Guns by Gary; Schulman, J. Neil Kleck

    TARGETING GUNS by Gary Kleck

    Contrary to your apparent misinterpretation of his statement Klecks statement was pro gun. He was saying that private gun owners are more effective at stopping violent criminals than what the FBI are willing to reveal
    Abort the Obamanation not the Constitution

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    VIP Member Array raevan's Avatar
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    One of the things that don't show up in the FBI report are the justifiable killings that happen because of a domestic dispute. Not listed as being caused because of a Felony. There are others that don't fit the criteria set by the FBI for their study.

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