November 8th, 2008 04:20 PM
I've got to echo a lot what others have already said. It is not without reason that bows were used with great effect as weapons for hundreds of years.
"...bad decisions that turn out well often make heroes."
Gary D. Mitchell, A Sniper's Journey: The Truth About the Man and the Rifle, P. 103, NAL Caliber books, 2006, 1st Ed.
November 8th, 2008 04:30 PM
Great, just what we need, a reason for BOW control.......Argghh, and I was planning on purchasing one of those in the near future too and taking up archery again.
Kids are ridiculously cruel these days, and I blame that on bad parenting. When I was growing up, which was not a long ago mind you (80's and 90's), it seemed to me that for at least awhile, the good parents drilled it into your head that weapons are not something to fool around with, and that the consequences for a murder, accidental or intentional, are life altering, and as an added deterrent, life threatening (don't think an LEO is going to stop at shooting an armed 13 year old who MAY shoot back). If I had shot anyone with anything as a kid, my mom would have disowned me and had me thrown in jail right there. Unfortunately, this conditional treatment is no longer enforced, so these kinds of things happen. It's quite sickening.
Last edited by ReticentXD40; November 8th, 2008 at 04:32 PM.
November 8th, 2008 04:32 PM
Don't even joke about that. It'll happen.
Originally Posted by GWRedDragon
Here in Seattle they outlawed most knives, bows, arrows, slingshots, bbguns, paintball guns, etc. They can't outlaw guns because the state preempts, but they're working on getting that overruled.
I hope the kid pulls through.
"Wise people learn when they can; fools learn when they must." - The Duke of Wellington
November 8th, 2008 04:37 PM
I had a customer who owns a Archery Range, I always said never get him mad because the last noise you would hear is..........nothing.
Would never hear it coming. He is an excelent shot you think grouping with bullets is hard try arrows. He has arrows that the tip of the arrow has a 4wings of razor sharp blades that open after contact. Small hole going in big hole going out. Bad news.
November 8th, 2008 04:49 PM
I need an explanation
Retsupt-- If I understand your background correctly, you are a retired school superintendent? Is that correct?
Originally Posted by retsupt99
In this thread and in others you have typically been rather harsh in my opinion toward young people who do stupid things.
I'm puzzled by the harsh quality of your reaction considering that you worked with kids (no?).
Children aren't little adults and they (and we when young) did all manner of stupid things for kicks, fun, by accident, thoughtlessness, which could have and sometimes did go badly wrong. (I knew a family where one brother accidentally shot the other. In today's world it would have been treated as criminal instead of an accident, and the second child would have been lost too. Is that a preferred outcome?)
My question to you, why the strong insistence on harsh treatment for juvenile offenses, even for the very young?
Man, in today's world, I wouldn't have been able to stay out of the clutches of juvenile court.
In my view we need to love our kids unconditionally, even when they screw up badly, and I am referring to "our kids" as all the kids in our community. Yes, at some point harsh adult penalties are needed. There comes a time and an age, and a time when a malicious act is done which must be punished.
But, as others pointed out in this thread, kids have hurt each other playing with bow and arrow since time began. Kids used to play with knives and sometimes really bad accidents happened. Boys fought with each other in play, and sometimes not so much in play, and once in awhile there was a busted collar bone or nose.
Surely we as adults can (should) put ourselves back into the childhood years when passing judgment.
I have to tell you that I thought the Lionel Tate case back a few years ago was extremely poorly handled by Florida, and that the kid was salvageable until the courts and the justice system made him unredeemable.
Anyway, that is my perspective, and I look forward to hearing why you feel differently.
November 8th, 2008 06:16 PM
Greetings my friend in weaponry...
Originally Posted by Hopyard
Yes, I was the top dog in a MI school district for many years. I retired years ago, but after driving my wife nuts, I took a teaching position at a rural FL high school.
I have years of comparisons to form my opinions on the educational communities of today. As I see it, we have lowered standards to the point of being almost 'without standards'. There is very little accountability, except for on paper......yes, the paperwork looks good, but today's average student lacks a work ethic, expects little accountability for behavior, and has a view of the future that is located about six inches in front of each individual student's face.
Our schools are only a reflection of the communities that they serve. One only has to look around at society to notice the lack of human compassion, a much lowered value of life, a work ethic that stinks, and certainly few individuals who express a desire to take responsibility for their actions.
Every problem discussed with students or their parents is almost always someone else's fault...seldom do today's students claim responsibility for much of what they do...and the schools go right along with that thinking.
I ran a tight ship, I held students and teachers responsible and accountable for their actions. There were rules and guidelines for everything we did and the expectations we worked towards.
Today, that is all gone. Perhaps that is the reason that in my prior educational world our dropout rate was 1-3%...today it's 30-40%...it's a sad state of affairs.
I have seen much younger trouble makers, and gangs that influence very young kids...some of these youngsters would kill you for two dollars and laugh about it.
My hardened attitude is what makes it possible to save some or these youngsters, but I am also cognizant of the fact that sometimes you have to cut some loose to the world in order to save the group.
I base my reactions to some of these threads upon both past and present experiences.
In the case of the boy with the bow, it could have been an accident, but an appropriate punishment is still required. Partially to teach the young man that our actions have penalties...learn early about the world. It is also a message to others who, hopefully, can grasp from the failures of others.
In the case of the other young boy who shot and killed two people...it was no accident. Prison and punishment is not (in my opinion) meant to rehabilitate and teach, but to protect the rest of society from those whose actions show that they lack judgement or personally hold no value for basic human needs.
The young Mr. Tate you speak of was a thug prior to his first trial...they should have put his butt away for the entire 30 years the first time! So they gave him a break and let him out...the thug learned nothing from his 'saving grace'...he merely continued his crime spree and went on to bigger and better things. Do I seem harsh? Perhaps, but if some honorable citizen had put his lights out during one of his 'armed robbery' attempts, society would have been much better off.
I might be one of the few in my thinking of 'punishment that fits the crime...served on a regular basis', but the thinking that has prevailed in today's world does not seem to be working as I view it.
Last edited by RETSUPT99; November 8th, 2008 at 11:38 PM.
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November 10th, 2008 06:27 PM
You're absolutely right, Hitch, arrows are bad medicine! I've been a bowhunter for much longer than I've shot pistols regularly, and know many who can pull a "Robin Hood" shot (or at least touch the arrows) routinely. I'm not that good, but can still group 3 arrows in a 3" group at 35-40 yards with no problem. I shoot a compound bow that moves the arrow out at over 300 fps, and deploys two blades on impact for a 1.5" cutting path. When shooting deer in the 120-140 lb range, it goes all the way through and sticks in the ground on the opposite side of the animal. So, imagine an arrow delivering the impact of a .22 but the cutting path of a spear, and that's what modern bows can do. If this victim is still breathing, I'd wager that junior didn't have a compound bow!
Originally Posted by HITCH KING
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