UGLY: Student Expelled For Fake Guns -

This is a discussion on UGLY: Student Expelled For Fake Guns - within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; "The law doesn't make any distinction between a genuine weapon and a facsimile," said Cherry Creek Schools spokeswoman Tustin Amole. Amole says federal and state ...

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Thread: UGLY: Student Expelled For Fake Guns -

  1. #16
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    "The law doesn't make any distinction between a genuine weapon and a facsimile," said Cherry Creek Schools spokeswoman Tustin Amole.

    Amole says federal and state laws mandate expulsion
    , and that school districts only have discretion to determine the length of that expulsion.
    Want to bet they can't produce a federal law that says that?

    Asked who had the discretion to deem the props "dangerous weapons," Amole said school administrators and police made the decision based on state law that defines a "dangerous weapon" as "a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or a firearm facsimile that could reasonably be mistaken for an actual firearm."
    Well it is quite obvious that the police didn't make the determination. If they had, they wouldn't have allowed her to come down to the station to reclaim the props. If the police had determined they were dangerous weapons she would have been arrested on the spot.
    This was a decision made by school administration and now they won't even confess to their own stupidity.

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  3. #17
    Distinguished Member Array tinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    Want to bet they can't produce a federal law that says that?



    Well it is quite obvious that the police didn't make the determination. If they had, they wouldn't have allowed her to come down to the station to reclaim the props. If the police had determined they were dangerous weapons she would have been arrested on the spot.
    This was a decision made by school administration and now they won't even confess to their own stupidity.
    Well if that's true, then maybe she should get herself a new lawyer. Because, as I said above, even her lawyer says they have no choice but to expel her. Now I haven't seen too many lawyers back down from a chance to argue something in court.

    Now I agree the law is irresponsible and frusterating. However, I don't feel, after watching a week of television coverage and interviews of people involved with the issue, that this is a case of the school just trying to "stick it" to the straight A honor student. I find it hard to believe that someone, somewhere, doesn't have the power to step in on her behalf. But I have to go back to HER lawer saying she's stuck between a rock and a hard place.
    "Run for your life from the man who tells you that money is evil. That sentence is the leper's bell of an approaching looter. So long as men live together on earth and need means to deal with one another-their only substitute, if they abandon money, is the muzzle of a gun."

    Who is John Galt?

  4. #18
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    please try to live in the real world at least part of the time teachers....sheees
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  5. #19
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    Stormbringerr wrote: "please try to live in the real world at least part of the time teachers...sheees."

    Spot on. These school officials seem like they have a weirdo "fantasy" land view of reality they are projecting onto the kids themselves.

    The young lady needs a different lawyer; or perhaps s/he (the attny) needs a hormone injection. (Unless there is something more going on we don't know about.)

    Was or is it the school that authorizes and condones and supervises the drill team?

    Is it a school official (teacher) who runs the drill team?

    Does the drill team use school property for practice?

    What culpability does the school itself have for creating the situation in which the young lady allegedly violated the state's school code?

    Were the replica training guns sold in some way through a school sanctioned activity?

    IF the answer to any of this is yes, the school officials are bigger dummies than they appear right now, and should immediately cover their behinds by dropping the matter and issuing a profuse apology.

    UNBELIEVABLE

    (But then we live in a society that sometimes can't tell the difference between an ordinary baby picture and child porn. Or between a spanking and abuse. Or between a child's free play and endangerment.)

  6. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    But then we live in a society that sometimes can't tell the difference between an ordinary baby picture and child porn. Or between a spanking and abuse. Or between a child's free play and endangerment.
    That right there is hitting several nails on the head in a single sentence.
    "Don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." - Theodore Roosevelt

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  7. #21
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    Hopy:
    The answer to all your questions, from what I've seen in the news reports, is "no".
    "Run for your life from the man who tells you that money is evil. That sentence is the leper's bell of an approaching looter. So long as men live together on earth and need means to deal with one another-their only substitute, if they abandon money, is the muzzle of a gun."

    Who is John Galt?

  8. #22
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    Jury nullification, anyone?

    Sometimes a prosecutor will move a dismissal.

    Does anyone know if judges in in this State qualify a dismissal with terms such as with or without prejudice?

    If so, I hope all this is a build up to a dismissal with prejudice.

    If true, everyone would have done their job and she'd be off the hook.

    If not, I hope a jury of her peers believes in jury nullification.
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  9. #23
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    Most schools have Rifles on their color guard. My girlfriend spun rifle for our high school.
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  10. #24
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    Expelled? Best thing that could have ever happened to her!

    Seriously: the only reason I can think of for going back would be social, and the type of social she's likely to find there ain't worth much in my opinion. And the amount of true learning she'll get between now and June could be done in a week or two. Instead, her folks should:
    • Arrange GED testing to take care of the diploma (probably could pass it cold);
    • Help her invest the rest of the year lobbying for sensible laws.
    • Buy dinner for a WWII vet to talk to her about the War;
    • Buy dinner for a Viet Nam vet to talk to her about that war;
    • Take her to court a few times to get a feel for the legal system;
    • Do a police ride-along for an introduction to that system and the part of society they work with;
    • Do volunteer work with her at the local soup kitchen or crisis center;
    • Let her attend a few lectures at a well-respected Seminary to get some feel for church history;
    • Hire a writing tutor and put her through her paces so she can express herself;
    • Have her join Toastmasters so she can speak;
    • Find her a community theater group to foster teamwork and show how work brings results;
    • Help her write a book on her experience;
    • Buy a copy of some homeschool math text (Saxon is good) or Schaum's College Outlines, and Euclid's Geometry and have her work through them;
    • Hire the neighbor who sews to teach her how;
    • Buy her a real rifle and ask the press to put it out that she want ammo so she can learn to shoot: want to bet on how much she would get?

    <rant on - so far I was just warming up>
    I taught high school biology for 13 years, trying to rescue kids who didn't want to be rescued. My wife taught, too. Knowing what we did about the public school system, we homeschooled our daughter (most teachers, at least in California, had their kids in private school or homeschooled - tell you something?). If a single mom is working and needs child care, public school may keep them all fed... but the social and ethical fallout from such an education makes me shudder.

    I honestly believe that most teachers are upright, hardworking saints, trying to rescue kids. Rather, I object to the age-segregated, peer-focused system and its philiosophical/theological biases. We're surprised at this episode? And no need for anyone to add, "My kid is turning out OK!" - I believe you, but I believe that any success is because of God's grace through your parenting and in spite of the school rather than because of the school.
    <rant off>

    I wish her the best.
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  11. #25
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    Well said, Paymeister.

  12. #26
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    And I suppose when she is allowed back in school, they will make her drink the Kool-aid?
    Disclaimer: The posts made by this member are only the members opinion, not a reflection on anyone else, nor the group, and should not be cause for anyone to get their undergarments wedged in an uncomfortable position.

  13. #27
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    Paymeister, you're probably right. Leave the system to what it wants: the dregs, which this student probably is not. It's a wake-up call that the system is what it is. So, time to leave the system and, for a bit of hard work and discipline, learn far more than what could be learned in the same amount of time in that public hole.
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