Miami cat killer caught

This is a discussion on Miami cat killer caught within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by Hopyard I'm not a big fan of animal cruelty laws. It isn't that I think cruelty is O.K., I don't. And it ...

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Thread: Miami cat killer caught

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Patti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    I'm not a big fan of animal cruelty laws. It isn't that I think cruelty is O.K., I don't. And it isn't that I don't think some of the perpetrators are Dahmers in the making. I do. What I have problems with is that these laws somewhat overvalue animal life at the expense of human life.

    What I mean is that a felony conviction and 2 years jail time is a serious big deal. It will destroy the future of the person so convicted. A dead cat (or dog) or sparrow, is still just another dead animal which was, per predominant religious beliefs, not born with a soul.

    We almost all eat meat. Many hunt. Is there really much of a moral difference between taking a deer* and shooting a stray dog? Or perhaps poisoning a stray cat? The latter is certainly a crime where I live. We bring stray animals to "shelters" to be
    "put to sleep." Strikes me as somewhat equivalent wanton killing without the perverted "thrill" aspect to it.

    I think the thing we need to concern ourselves with is not the criminal aspect of what was done but the psychological aspect, the question of whether or not the involved individual is a budding serial killer of humans, or merely foolish.

    I'm not interested in spending my tax dollars punishing a foolish act which does not harm another human; I am interested in protecting ourselves from a serial killer in the making. I'm not so sure the criminal justice system can effectively accomplish the latter goal.

    Personally, I would not rank this behavior above that of a moderately serious misdemeanor.
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    *This comment isn't a shot at hunters. Let's not go in that direction with the
    discussion.
    Do you feel empathy towards the young man who tortured and mutilated the animals?
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  3. #32
    Ex Member Array GreenHorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patti View Post
    Do you feel empathy towards the young man who tortured and mutilated the animals?
    My exact question! Any one who does this deserves punishment not some emo sympathy.

  4. #33
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    THe punishment should fit the crime

    Quote Originally Posted by Patti View Post
    Do you feel empathy towards the young man who tortured and mutilated the animals?
    There have been quite a few comments here where folks have said something along the lines that we punish people because we are mad at them, not because they did something wrong.

    In this case, something wrong was done, we are rightly mad at the guy as well.

    He might indeed be a budding serial killer.

    None which raises the crime (in my opinion) beyond the seriousness level of a misdemeanor.

    Will we make it a crime to fish? What about
    whacking a snake with a rake? Anyone here ever feed mice to a snake? They are mammals not different in basic structure from a cat? Ever trapped a rat? Ever burned moles out of the ground? All mammals that feel pain the same way a cat would? Are we going to criminalize these activities? How about a man who knowingly works his horses too hard? Will we criminalize that? Our "shelters" I'm told put dogs in boxes and evacuate the air, suffocating them to death. Are we going to criminalize common animal control practices?

    The crimes I see here that should be focused on are property crimes if the animals were stolen.

    Animal cruelty laws are relatively new in our society. They are needed. But as many other laws passed when emotions run high, there is sometimes an element of overkill. We shouldn't be putting animals above people.

    It isn't uncommon around here for ranchers to shoot strays, for farmers to neglect their animals if not outright starve them. Sometimes the former is fully justified, as might be the poisoning of stray cats that can't be caught but are a nighttime nuisance. We don't need to have to look over our shoulders when acting in good faith.

    Animals aren't people and they don't deserve, nor were they endowed with, the full range of human rights. (And for the religious here, I am quite certain that scripture states clearly that man has dominion over the animals, not that I think this is a good excuse for some of our human activities.)

  5. #34
    Distinguished Member Array tinkerinWstuff's Avatar
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    Sounds like general crime and not a personal defense story.
    "Run for your life from the man who tells you that money is evil. That sentence is the leper's bell of an approaching looter. So long as men live together on earth and need means to deal with one another-their only substitute, if they abandon money, is the muzzle of a gun."

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  6. #35
    Ex Member Array PNUT's Avatar
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    I disagree Hopyard, The why and how of torturing an animal to death is far different from a hunter killing food, animal control euthanizing a dog, or a farmer controlling nuisance animals. Your own post from another thread is a fitting reply. It follows.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Motivation for committing a crime does have something to do with the level of culpability, and the degree of punishment. We all know this intuitively when we sympathize with the main character in Les Miserable, jailed for stealing a loaf of bread.

    It also goes the other way. We want to add to the punishment when we think
    the motive for a crime was particularly evil.

    Theft of a dog may be common low level theft. But if you take a blind man's seeing eye dog from him on the bus, you have stooped to a different level of low, and deserve a greater punishment.

    In Texas, juries decide the punishment within very broad bands of time. This both results in disparities in punishment and the giving out of severe punishment to the truly deserving. It also allows a modicum of mercy when the jury feels it appropriate.
    I think it is the nature of the evil that justifies enhancements.

  7. #36
    Senior Member Array Rustynuts's Avatar
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    I say let the cat's owner's have a go at him.

  8. #37
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    We have laws against animal cruelty...what this clown did falls under animal cruelty. He will get what he deserves, whether I am mad at him or not is irrelevant. The question was asked whether the punishment is too harsh - I don't think it is...and I think the life difficulties a conviction will bring to this moron are quite fitting.
    "I'm a big, hairy, American winning machine!" - Ricky Bobby

  9. #38
    Member Array Erich1B's Avatar
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    Perhaps this was addressed in an earlier post, but a certain percentage of people who abuse animals go on to commit crimes against humans. Jeffrey Dahmer is but one example.

    Below is from this website: Pet-Abuse.Com - Abuse Connection - The Link Between Animal Cruelty and Interpersonal Violence

    "According to a 1997 study done by the Massachusetts Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (SPCA) and Northeastern University, animal abusers are five times more likely to commit violent crimes against people and four times more likely to commit property crimes than are individuals without a history of animal abuse.

    Many studies in psychology, sociology, and criminology during the last 25 years have demonstrated that violent offenders frequently have childhood and adolescent histories of serious and repeated animal cruelty. The FBI has recognized the connection since the 1970s, when its analysis of the lives of serial killers suggested that most had killed or tortured animals as children. Other research has shown consistent patterns of animal cruelty among perpetrators of more common forms of violence, including child abuse, spouse abuse, and elder abuse. In fact, the American Psychiatric Association considers animal cruelty one of the diagnostic criteria of conduct disorder."
    Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, and beat you with experience.

  10. #39
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    Dang! After reading the police files, it sure does suggest this young man is very dangerous and may very likely kill humans as he evolves.
    Regards,
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

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