Store video catches cop bullying woman

This is a discussion on Store video catches cop bullying woman within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by Eagleks Maybe , there needs to be a State or FBI investigation of the Philly PD . Wouldn't be the first time ...

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Thread: Store video catches cop bullying woman

  1. #46
    Senior Member Array TheGreatGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    Maybe , there needs to be a State or FBI investigation of the Philly PD .
    Wouldn't be the first time for Philly PD.
    Gonzo
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  3. #47
    Senior Member Array TheGreatGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbone View Post
    How could the IA dept. find no issues with police trying to destroy what would end up being evidence?
    In my opinion it either means:
    a) A shabby IAD investigation with no real intent to reveal anything; or...
    b) If the IAD investigation was done in a thorough manner and presented to the higher-ups, who then failed to discipline/terminate the officers, it is indicative of a willingness by PPD administrators to overlook criminal activity by their officers.

    Either way, it is very, very troubling.
    Gonzo
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  4. #48
    Member Array grandma4's Avatar
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    I have read these post and I cannot imagine this happening and the police officer not losing his job, being charged with a crime and I can not imagine that the son (jr) was not charged with assault on the girl in this case. Reminds me of some of the old cop movies in the "olden" days when crime was committed as often with cops as with badguys. This is just unbelievable. I hope they set her up for life and that she uses the money to live a good and wonderful life.

    Sheesh
    2 Chronicles 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

  5. #49
    VIP Member Array varob's Avatar
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    The evidence is right there on the tape. Had this been a civilian holding a gun on that girl, they would have used the tape to put him away for 10 years.
    Don't believe what you hear and only half of what you see!
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  6. #50
    Senior Member Array Chevy-SS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGreatGonzo View Post
    ....What about dinner breaks and trips to the bathroom? Are these on tape as well? .....
    LOL, gimme a break man.




    Quote Originally Posted by TheGreatGonzo View Post
    ....And, if you are going to put police officers on 24/7 record......
    No, I did not say to put them on 24/7 video. I said ONLY WHILE THEY ARE ON ACTIVE DUTY (bathroom breaks, meals, etc excluded), and most especially when they ARE INTERACTING WITH JOHN Q. PUBLIC.



    As it stands, the police mostly do a good job, but when the SHTF they will stick together and fabricate/coordinate whatever stories are necessary to win the case, much to the detriment of civilians. A video recording will even out the playing field for a lot of these "disputes".

    Record it all, then decide later exactly who gets to peruse the tapes, but get all active-duty interactions recorded.

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  7. #51
    Senior Member Array TheGreatGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    Record it all, then decide later exactly who gets to peruse the tapes, but get all active-duty interactions recorded.

    -
    Chevy-SS,
    Again, I have to ask if you would want an initial, on-the-scene sexual assault interview with one of your famale (or male, for that matter) relatives on video? I'm telling you, it is not nearly as good an idea as it sounds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    As it stands, the police mostly do a good job, but when the SHTF they will stick together and fabricate/coordinate whatever stories are necessary to win the case, much to the detriment of civilians. -
    I did not take your initial post as being "anti-police" at all. However, the "...they will stick together and fabricate/coordinate whatever stories are necessary to win the case..." remark is an insulting generalization. You are, in esssence, calling me and everyone I work with a liar. You are very plainly making the accusation that I (and other LEO's) are willing to lie to protect each other, and I find that very insulting. It is no more accurate for you to say that than for me, as LEO, to say, "...when the SHTF CCW permit holders will all lie to protect each other..." or "...when the SHTF citizens will all lie to make the police look bad...". Or, "All insurance brokers are thieves. Insurance adjusters and companies all lie to keep from having to pay your claims.". Very few generalizations are accurate. You must not have read all the remarks by law enforcement officers who think these guys should be prosecuted and put in jail.
    Gonzo
    Last edited by TheGreatGonzo; July 23rd, 2009 at 09:34 PM.
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  8. #52
    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    I hope we get to see the followup on this case. I would like to see how the philly department handles this situation. From what I've read the cop involved should not be carrying a gun. Some body sure was having a bad day. If there is a cover up we will never know. I have met one or two bully cops but the majority are easy going and very professional.

  9. #53
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    Too bad it casts a long shadow over so many good LEO's. It sometimes happens when authority and power mix with human nature. The attempted witness and evidence tampering is most disturbing, indicating a systemic problem. I hope an exposure to the sunlight of public awareness can cause remedial action and prevent future violations.
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  10. #54
    Member Array KralBlbec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    LOL, gimme a break man.






    No, I did not say to put them on 24/7 video. I said ONLY WHILE THEY ARE ON ACTIVE DUTY (bathroom breaks, meals, etc excluded), and most especially when they ARE INTERACTING WITH JOHN Q. PUBLIC.



    As it stands, the police mostly do a good job, but when the SHTF they will stick together and fabricate/coordinate whatever stories are necessary to win the case, much to the detriment of civilians. A video recording will even out the playing field for a lot of these "disputes".

    Record it all, then decide later exactly who gets to peruse the tapes, but get all active-duty interactions recorded.

    -
    Youre also overlooking the fact that if the cops get the feeds first to filter any sensitive data, they also get the feeds first to filter any of their own misdoings. Note how many times they asked this guy to erase HIS tapes. Think they would hesitate if they had it in their hands?

    Not to mention that going over them would mean a dramatic increase in the number of manhours on the department. Then who watches those watching? Are they being recorded too? Better IMO for public and private recordings by individuals of their own property and dealings.

  11. #55
    Senior Member Array Slim_45's Avatar
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    This story makes me sick but unfortunately i believe things like this happen more than we realize. Iam glad camera's are everywhere now. For the life of me i cant see how he got out of this our so called "justice system" needs a serious overhaul & iam hoping she wins her lawsuit case
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  12. #56
    Distinguished Member Array jumpwing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ppkheat View Post
    That video ought to be shown at every police academy as in "what NOT to do" ?
    Only if this episode ends with consequences. Otherwise the video becomes a lesson in what you can get away with.

    The fact that this man is back on duty is a glaring testament to the failure of the system. Not only are people like this a danger to those around them, they also seriously damage the credibility of the entire profession. Are relations so rosy between the police and the public that a department can afford to let this go as is?

    People who exercise poor judgment in the application of authority should not continue to have that authority, PERIOD. No officer is EVER "entitled" to continue being an officer. Cops aren't superhuman and I don't expect them to be perfect, but this particular abuse is far too egregious to qualify as a simple mistake.

    I have some extremely close friends in law enforcement and examples like this clown make their job much harder than it already is. Give him a severence check and send him on his way. There's a young PD applicant somewhere waiting for the chance to be a good cop.
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  13. #57
    Senior Member Array TheGreatGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jumpwing View Post
    I have some extremely close friends in law enforcement and examples like this clown make their job much harder than it already is. Give him a severence check and send him on his way.

    It certainly does. However, I disagree that he deserves a severance check. All he deserves is a back-seat ride to prison.
    Gonzo
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  14. #58
    Senior Member Array Chevy-SS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGreatGonzo View Post
    ....However, the "...they will stick together and fabricate/coordinate whatever stories are necessary to win the case..." remark is an insulting generalization. You are, in esssence, calling me and everyone I work with a liar. You are very plainly making the accusation that I (and other LEO's) are willing to lie to protect each other, and I find that very insulting. .....

    I apologize for any unintended insult, and no intent to call all LEO's liars. But I stand by my statement. It is my opinion. I believe (and have seen with my own eyes and ears) that there is a brotherhood mentality whereby LEO's will tend to protect one of their own and do/say pretty much whatever is necessary. This attitude puts civilians at extreme peril.

    Witness the latest case in the news: 'Disgraceful': Cops Angry After Obama Slams Arrest of Black Scholar Cops are all sticking together and saying the officer was right to arrest Professor Gates. Huh? The guy was on his own porch trying to get into his own house. Professor Gates showed his ID. The cop should have left at that point.

    And please realize, I'm not bad-mouthing LEO's. Our society absolutely needs LEO's. I know some admirable LEO's, with impeccable ethics. However, I think it's simple human nature for LEO's to protect one another. I happen to think that sometimes civilians need protection too. It is my opinion that constant video recording will help vindicate those civilians who get bullied or wrongly charged.

    Bottom line - there needs to be a balance. The system needs to be fair and equitable. That's all I'm looking for.

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  15. #59
    Senior Member Array TheGreatGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    I apologize for any unintended insult, and no intent to call all LEO's liars.
    I sincerely appreciate the clarification. Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    I believe (and have seen with my own eyes and ears) that there is a brotherhood mentality whereby LEO's will tend to protect one of their own and do/say pretty much whatever is necessary. This attitude puts civilians at extreme peril.
    I believe the same applies to any group or profession. Again, I cite the insurance industry. Following Katrina, the insurance industry circled the wagons lickety-split and colluded to do whatever was necessary to avoid paying claims, to include falsifying documents and lying under oath. As a result, thousands of victims did not recieve the insurance benefits they had spent years paying premiums for. I saw it with my own eyes, as you say. However, I am not going to indite the entire insurance industry and everyone who works in it because of that experience.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    Witness the latest case in the news: 'Disgraceful': Cops Angry After Obama Slams Arrest of Black Scholar Cops are all sticking together and saying the officer was right to arrest Professor Gates. Huh? The guy was on his own porch trying to get into his own house. Professor Gates showed his ID. The cop should have left at that point.
    Entirely separate case, which I won't go into here since I dont' want to hijack the OP's thread anymore than I already have. My apologies to the OP.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    It is my opinion that constant video recording will help vindicate those civilians who get bullied or wrongly charged.
    I am a huge believer in dashcam videos in patrol cars and I think they should come on automatically whenver the emergency lights are activated. I also believe you should be free to take pictures of video of me when I'm doing my job (as long as you are not interfering or putting me, or someone else, in danger). I have never tried to prevent someone from filming me. I do my job to the best of my ability with the intent to follow the law and treat everyone fairly, so I have no issues with being on camera. We will just have to agree to disagree on the "constant" video recording. But I see your point and respect your opinion, even if I disagree.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy-SS View Post
    Bottom line - there needs to be a balance. The system needs to be fair and equitable. That's all I'm looking for.
    I agree 100%! What you may not realize it that the vast majority of LEO's feel exactly the same way. We want nothing more than for the system to be fair and equitable to us and we want to provide fair and equitable treatment to the citizens we serve. Are there criminals amongst us? Unfortunately, yes, just like any other segment of society. We want to see them gone just as much as anyone else. They tend to make life suck for the rest of us.

    Thanks for an enjoyable discussion.
    Gonzo
    "Skin that smokewagon!".

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