‘Castle doctrine’ law forces shooter’s release, prosecutor says - Page 2

‘Castle doctrine’ law forces shooter’s release, prosecutor says

This is a discussion on ‘Castle doctrine’ law forces shooter’s release, prosecutor says within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by 1911PKR Craig made two mistakes...he used a .25 for SD and he didn't empty it. Should have used one of these Lemme ...

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Thread: ‘Castle doctrine’ law forces shooter’s release, prosecutor says

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911PKR View Post
    Craig made two mistakes...he used a .25 for SD and he didn't empty it. Should have used one of these
    Lemme see, He was attacked, defended himself, the threat stopped. I do not see any mistakes in his actions.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcon View Post
    That's fine for you, if that's what you've experienced. I certainly do not treat every encounter as a "shoot first" situation. If I get punched, my first reaction WILL NOT be to shoot the guy. I'm not willing to take a life until I've exhausted ALL of my options. I'm just giving my viewpoint on this. Based upon how this is written now, they make it sound like his first option was shooting...that may or may not be true. I'm simply going off my interpretations of the events.
    I understand, however consider this, once extreme force (300lb guy punches 150lb in the face) has been used on you, and you are laying on your back,....your reactive options may be VERY limited at that point. Would YOU try and call a truce w/ the attacker and talk it over with him?? No...and ANY good SD course would teach you to be proactive at that point. Not my opinion, MY Training.
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911PKR View Post
    I understand, however consider this, once extreme force (300lb guy punches 150lb in the face) has been used on you, and you are laying on your back,....your reactive options may be VERY limited at that point. Would YOU try and call a truce w/ the attacker and talk it over with him?? No...and ANY good SD course would teach you to be proactive at that point. Not my opinion, MY Training.
    I'm not saying call a truce. I'm saying there are other NON-LETHAL options to stop a threat. It seems like most people think that because they have a gun, that's what they should use. I don't know what the guy had on him, but I would bet he had other things around him to use as weaponry. Why should the first instinct be to kill when there were tools all around that could simply be used to end a confrontation?
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcon View Post
    I'm not saying call a truce. I'm saying there are other NON-LETHAL options to stop a threat. It seems like most people think that because they have a gun, that's what they should use. I don't know what the guy had on him, but I would bet he had other things around him to use as weaponry. Why should the first instinct be to kill when there were tools all around that could simply be used to end a confrontation?
    Uhhh!....All that other "NON-LETHAL" stuff is wonderfull. I'm old, don't punch ME in the face...I'll shoot ya! NOT w/ a .25 and not just once. Only one of us will be showin' up in court if that's even needed.
    "Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom" Gen. George Patton

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911PKR View Post
    I understand, however consider this, once extreme force (300lb guy punches 150lb in the face) has been used on you, and you are laying on your back,....your reactive options may be VERY limited at that point. Would YOU try and call a truce w/ the attacker and talk it over with him?? No...and ANY good SD course would teach you to be proactive at that point. Not my opinion, MY Training.
    With the obvious disparity of force, at this point Pepper and Pistol would be out, Pepper in face already and making him very aware that this stops now. If pepper has not stopped him (Unlikley or I wouldn't use it in the first place) then the .45 is already out and ready to end the situation.

    BTW I am 180lbs and I would not go hand to hand with a 300 pound man straight to pepper.
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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcon View Post
    Why should the first instinct be to kill when there were tools all around that could simply be used to end a confrontation?
    Why not enlighten us of all the tools around that could simply be used to end the confrontation? What should have been done by the 150 lb person that has just been floored (and is now laying on his back) with a punch in the face by a 300 lb aggressor?

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  7. #22
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    What no one is getting is the guy out weighs you by 150 lbs and is 20 yrs younger and hits you first and now your on the ground.

    I'm 50 and if some 30yr old guy pegs me and I fall to the ground he's getting shot!
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  8. #23
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    I don't think the shooter or shootee will be working for Walmart anymore,if it's like most workplaces they have 0 tolerance for any violence.
    I'm kinda like rick 51 disabled by incomplete quadriplegia due to spinal cord injury,some punk hits me it's a deadly threat
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  9. #24
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    getting fired for defending my self..

    and from other threads here, it is wallmarts polacy to "fallow the laws of the state they are in". to me that reads not fired for self defence. BUT Mr Lira gets fired.
    "I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution, which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents." -1792, James Madison
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  10. #25
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    Jeez. It was only a .25 just say your sorry and call it even.


    Okay, really. It sounds like there was a dispute over "I'm leaving" and then "NO you're not." Smack! That would be "kidnapping" or some such charge for perp #1 and justifiable self defense.
    "Words can be as lethal as bullets; Choose them carefully, Aim them well & Use them sparingly."

  11. #26
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    Personally, I think I would at least have waited to see if the guy was going to continue the attack before I shot.

    I wasn't there, and I'm not going to judge his actions either. I see disparity of force possibly coming into play as well as being down on the ground, but I think some people are having issue with the fact that he shot him after only getting punched one time. I think some people are seeing that as "jumping the gun" a little bit, so to speak and pardon the pun.

    I am not going to judge one way or another but just say for me... I would probably have waited to see if he was going to continue to pummel me or kick me with a shod foot while I'm down on the ground, and can't retreat or roll with the punches. Then, I think "disparity of force" is a lot more obvious and easier to articulate as a defense.

    If he continued the fight, then without question, I would shoot him!
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  12. #27
    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911PKR View Post
    Uhhh!....All that other "NON-LETHAL" stuff is wonderfull. I'm old, don't punch ME in the face...I'll shoot ya! NOT w/ a .25 and not just once. Only one of us will be showin' up in court if that's even needed.

    Couldn't agree more. Things are a lot different today than when I was 25 or 30 (or even 40). Age, deteriorating physical condition, infirmities, etc. are sometimes hard for the young guys to understand. Give 'em time. They'll get there.

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  13. #28
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    I'm confused

    This doesn't sound like Castle Doctrine,

    It's "Stand Your Ground" law.

    Castle is defending yourself in your home and stand your ground is defending yourself without first having to attempt to flee. It didn't sound like it took place anywhere near his home - unless I missed something.
    "Run for your life from the man who tells you that money is evil. That sentence is the leper's bell of an approaching looter. So long as men live together on earth and need means to deal with one another-their only substitute, if they abandon money, is the muzzle of a gun."

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  14. #29
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    Montana's CD says 'anywhere you are legally allowed to be'

  15. #30
    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinkerinWstuff View Post
    I'm confused

    This doesn't sound like Castle Doctrine,

    It's "Stand Your Ground" law.

    Castle is defending yourself in your home and stand your ground is defending yourself without first having to attempt to flee. It didn't sound like it took place anywhere near his home - unless I missed something.
    Most of these state's laws are referred to as "Castle Doctrine" laws even though they apply to much more. Simpler than passing a Castle Doctrine law that only applies to your home and a separate "stand your ground" law. In reality, I think most of the are more aptly described as stand your ground laws as they apply to more than just your home. Could be that by referring to them as Castle laws, they are an easier sell to the sheep than invoking an image of Dirty Harry by using terms like "stand your ground" or "make my day" laws.

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