Walmart shopper slaps crying child? - Page 6

Walmart shopper slaps crying child?

This is a discussion on Walmart shopper slaps crying child? within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by Defensive Arms The guy who slapped the child is a sleazeball, but his crime doesn't warrant execution via vigilantism. The child's life ...

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Thread: Walmart shopper slaps crying child?

  1. #76
    VIP Member Array wmhawth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Defensive Arms View Post
    The guy who slapped the child is a sleazeball, but his crime doesn't warrant execution via vigilantism.

    The child's life wasn't in danger, so deadly force wasn't justified. The mother did exactly the right thing by calling the police.

    .
    A two year old child being attacked by a large violent and out of control animal is not in danger?? What planet do you live on? The idea isn't to take vigilante vengeance after the fact, the idea is to protect the child by STOPPING THE IMMEDIATE THREAT. I'd pity your wife or child if you are incapable or unwilling to do that.


  2. #77
    Senior Member Array RemMod597's Avatar
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    Had that been my child:
    1. I would have taken the discontented child out of the store.
    2. Anyone slapping my child would suffer multiple broken bones (for a start).


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  3. #78
    Member Array Defensive Arms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmhawth View Post
    A two year old child being attacked by a large violent and out of control animal is not in danger?? What planet do you live on? The idea isn't to take vigilante vengeance after the fact, the idea is to protect the child by STOPPING THE IMMEDIATE THREAT. I'd pity your wife or child if you are incapable or unwilling to do that.
    There's no evidence the perpetrator was an "out of control animal", nor that the child was in danger of serious bodily harm.

    He slapped the kid a few times, told the mother in a matter of fact way "See, I told you I could shut her up", then began walking away.

    The child only suffered some redness to the face, and was released at the scene.

    Judging by the article and the remarks of the mother afterwards, who has already forgiven him---this event definitely did NOT warrant deadly force.

    The last thing we need is an over-emotional concealed handgun carrier opening fire with a handgun in a crowded Wal-Mart, over an incident that could have been easily stopped by simply tackling the perpetrator and holding him for police.
    "I've run across shooting after shooting where the defender shot a violent aggressor with a .380 and did little to immediately stop his depredations. A good hollow point load in 9mm or .38 Special will, historically, end lethal assaults more quickly."

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  4. #79
    VIP Member Array wmhawth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Defensive Arms View Post
    There's no evidence the perpetrator was an "out of control animal", nor that the child was in danger of serious bodily harm.

    He slapped the kid a few times, told the mother in a matter of fact way "See, I told you I could shut her up", then began walking away.

    The child only suffered some redness to the face, and was released at the scene.

    Judging by the article and the remarks of the mother afterwards, who has already forgiven him---this event definitely did NOT warrant deadly force.

    The last thing we need is an over-emotional concealed handgun carrier opening fire with a handgun in a crowded Wal-Mart, over an incident that could have been easily stopped by simply tackling the perpetrator and holding him for police.
    To each his own my friend. As for me, if someone is assaulting my two year old child I'll have to assume he is a dangerous animal and he's going down. I may not need a gun to accomplish the task but, believe me, he's going down.

  5. #80
    Member Array sirdarksoul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Defensive Arms View Post
    The guy who slapped the child is a sleazeball, but his crime doesn't warrant execution via vigilantism.

    The child's life wasn't in danger, so deadly force wasn't justified. The mother did exactly the right thing by calling the police.

    I think ninety days in jail, a couple hundred hours of community service, and mandatory anger management classes would suffice as punishment.

    Hopefully the mother of the child now realizes that there are a lot of people walking the streets who aren't coping real well emotionally, and will better control her screaming child in the future, which would include removing the child from the store if a tantrum lasts for more than a couple minutes.
    Mebbe not execution but broken bones and loss of consciousness...yeah.

  6. #81
    Member Array Defensive Arms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmhawth View Post
    To each his own my friend. As for me, if someone is assaulting my two year old child I'll have to assume he is a dangerous animal and he's going down. I may not need a gun to accomplish the task but, believe me, he's going down.
    I clearly stated that in this particular incident, tackling the perpetrator and holding him for police is the correct choice.

    It easily accomplishes the task of stopping the attacker, without endangering the lives of others by opening fire in a crowded store.

    At 210 pounds and having done some wrestling in my time, as well as being quite a few years younger than the assailant---I can assure you that if I tackle him, he's DEFINITELY "going down", to borrow your phrase.

    That's appropriate use of force, whereas shooting him would clearly not be.
    "I've run across shooting after shooting where the defender shot a violent aggressor with a .380 and did little to immediately stop his depredations. A good hollow point load in 9mm or .38 Special will, historically, end lethal assaults more quickly."

    ~ Massad Ayoob

  7. #82
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Walmart shopper slaps crying child?
    That's nothing new in redneckville. Wal Mart was born here in Redneckville. There will always be rednecks in Wal Mart no matter where. It's all part of the WM experience. What less can we expect? Nothing done in front of you as full witness in society should surprise you. Realize the demeanor and the abilities of your fellow human being. Deep down they are evil unless they make the choice not to be. For some of them, making that choice is hard work they are not willing take upon themselves. It's a good thing that breathing is an autonomic response in the human body...otherwise we would be walking over dead bodies all day long.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ram Rod View Post
    That's nothing new in redneckville. Wal Mart was born here in Redneckville. There will always be rednecks in Wal Mart no matter where. It's all part of the WM experience. What less can we expect? Nothing done in front of you as full witness in society should surprise you. Realize the demeanor and the abilities of your fellow human being. Deep down they are evil unless they make the choice not to be. For some of them, making that choice is hard work they are not willing take upon themselves. It's a good thing that breathing is an autonomic response in the human body...otherwise we would be walking over dead bodies all day long.
    That's a pretty pessimistic outlook on the human condition. However, I'm finding it hard to shoot any holes in it.

  9. #84
    VIP Member Array nedrgr21's Avatar
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    Before the slapping was initiated there's no way to know how hard this jerk was going to hit the kid. It'd be all too easy to break a 2yr old's neck - he was definitely out of control. How is a woman supposed to take down a guy that big when dealing with her kid as well? She's not "210 pounds and having done some wrestling in my time".

  10. #85
    Senior Member Array InspectorGadget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedrgr21 View Post
    Before the slapping was initiated there's no way to know how hard this jerk was going to hit the kid. It'd be all too easy to break a 2yr old's neck - he was definitely out of control. How is a woman supposed to take down a guy that big when dealing with her kid as well? She's not "210 pounds and having done some wrestling in my time".
    The same first step I would probably use, Pepper in the face. Preferablly with a sidearm in hand in case he attacks again. Tasers are also an option "With sidearm in hand". While neither are a last line of defense, they are both pretty good first steps.

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  11. #86
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    We'll see how tough he is in jail - if he gets the guilty verdict and is sentenced. I'm not sure if our judicial system will see this through to the end. Mom already forgave the guy. I'd like to think GA will bury the guy, but.........
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  12. #87
    Member Array Defensive Arms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedrgr21 View Post
    Before the slapping was initiated there's no way to know how hard this jerk was going to hit the kid. It'd be all too easy to break a 2yr old's neck - he was definitely out of control. How is a woman supposed to take down a guy that big when dealing with her kid as well? She's not "210 pounds and having done some wrestling in my time".
    I wasn't suggesting the woman tackle him. She handled the situation perfectly, AFTER THE FACT. She shouted to draw attention to what was happening, then after the scumbag walked away, she very appropriately called the police. He was NOT out of control.

    Some members here have commented that they would've opened fire on him, which is sheer insanity in a crowded Wal-Mart.

    I was merely explaining to another member what could be done by a person wishing to intervene on the mother's behalf in this particular situation---WITHOUT playing Rambo and opening fire in a Wal-Mart store with other children and shoppers present.

    Concealed carry of a firearm is a serious matter, and it is the legal and moral obligation of all carriers to only use their firearm when it is clearly justified to save somebody from SERIOUS BODILY HARM OR DEATH, and in a manner that will not endanger innocents.

    Sorry, but the child ended up with nothing more than slightly red cheeks, and was released at the scene. The situation was NOT serious enough to warrant deadly force.

    A concealed carry permit is NOT a police badge, nor does it allow you to make "preventive" shootings on people. You cannot shoot somebody because you think they MIGHT slap a child too hard, BEFORE they've actually even touched the child.

    I would strenuously suggest that the more trigger-happy individuals on this forum consult a good lawyer in their state, who is highly experienced in the area of laws regarding deadly force. Have the attorney explain the laws regarding deadly force in their state, and be sure to ask the attorney any questions they might have.

    It might save somebody a prison sentence and/or civil suit.
    "I've run across shooting after shooting where the defender shot a violent aggressor with a .380 and did little to immediately stop his depredations. A good hollow point load in 9mm or .38 Special will, historically, end lethal assaults more quickly."

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  13. #88
    Member Array Defensive Arms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InspectorGadget View Post
    The same first step I would probably use, Pepper in the face. Preferablly with a sidearm in hand in case he attacks again. Tasers are also an option "With sidearm in hand". While neither are a last line of defense, they are both pretty good first steps.
    Definitely better choices than just up and shooting the guy.

    I'm not too sure about pepper in the face, because if he was still in close proximity to the child, you might accidentally spray the kid. There are a lot of flaky people around these days, and the mother might decide to turn around and sue you. Weirder things have happened.

    The taser would be the better option in this particular situation, assuming you had one.
    "I've run across shooting after shooting where the defender shot a violent aggressor with a .380 and did little to immediately stop his depredations. A good hollow point load in 9mm or .38 Special will, historically, end lethal assaults more quickly."

    ~ Massad Ayoob

  14. #89
    Senior Member Array InspectorGadget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Defensive Arms View Post
    Definitely better choices than just up and shooting the guy.

    I'm not too sure about pepper in the face, because if he was still in close proximity to the child, you might accidentally spray the kid. There are a lot of flaky people around these days, and the mother might decide to turn around and sue you. Weirder things have happened.

    The taser would be the better option in this particular situation, assuming you had one.
    I was answering what the mother should have done, and I agree you have to determine how close to kid etc but that would be a call she would have to make. Accidentally hitting the kid w/pepper vs kid being attacked by adult.
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  15. #90
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    All I can say is this guy would not have escaped without a few stab wounds. You don't ATTACK someone's child.

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