Self Defense - Machete Attack

This is a discussion on Self Defense - Machete Attack within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Details still not completely in. Two men were shot, one killed. Guy #1 went knocking on a neighbor's door to ask about a car parked ...

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Thread: Self Defense - Machete Attack

  1. #1
    Member Array Midnight412's Avatar
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    Self Defense - Machete Attack

    Details still not completely in. Two men were shot, one killed.

    Guy #1 went knocking on a neighbor's door to ask about a car parked in his assigned parking space. The person who he spoke to gave him static about it and there were harsh words.

    (Missing details)

    Guy #1 gets attacked by two guys, one with a machete. Guy #1 takes machete to back of head and then a second cut which removes some flesh from right arm. Guy #1 (armed and a MA valid LTC holder) draws to defend himself. In his haste and (probably due to adrenaline rush) he mistakenly releases his magazine from his pistol. Realizing the error, he retrieves his spare magazine, reloads and then opens fire on attackers.

    One is dead, the other is shot in the buttocks and lower leg.

    Guy #1 survives the attack and is brought to hospital for treatment.

    Even though it is pretty clear this guy was defending himself, he was still "in custody". He may have been released by now - (lack of details)
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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Being taken into custody after a shooting is SOP, in MA.

    Do you have a news link to this?
    What city or town was this in?

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  4. #3
    Member Array cz2075bd's Avatar
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    Sounds like clear-cut justifable shootings.

    Around here, MS-13 has been responsible for some pretty ugly machete slayings.

  5. #4
    Member Array Midnight412's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    Being taken into custody after a shooting is SOP, in MA.

    Do you have a news link to this?
    What city or town was this in?

    - Janq
    Police at scene before fatal melee - Sentinel & Enterprise

    I got the orignal info from someone who was involved with the aftermath.
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  6. #5
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    Hmm, it doesn't read like self defense. The guy with the machete wounds died, according to the report.

    Pedro Genoa, 17, of 137 Meadowbrook Lane, a junior at Fitchburg High School, died at UMass Medical Center in Worcester after suffering several injuries, including a gunshot wound to the abdomen.

    Nelson Geraldino, 18, of 15 Crestview Lane, was stabbed multiple times and died at HealthAlliance Hospital/Leominster.

    Genoa's brother, Ronny Genoa, 18, of 137 Meadowbrook Lane, who graduated from Montachusett Regional Technical High School in Fitchburg this year, suffered multiple gunshot wounds, Early's office said. He was in UMass Medical Center, but his condition was not available Monday evening. Early's office said he was in stable condition Sunday.

    Orville Carrion, 22, and Jose Carrion, 27, both of 96 Mechanic St., Unit 3, were treated and released at HealthAlliance Hospital/Leominster, then charged with murder.

    Ronny Genoa is charged with assault with intent to murder and mayhem.

    All three men were held without bail.

    The Carrions are scheduled for arraignment at Fitchburg District Court today.
    I read something else from Fitchburg in the same area (same street?) from just a few days ago. Sounds like a happening place.

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Upon read of the news report this is yet another report of criminal acting persons preying on criminal acting persons.

    Nelson Geraldino was not possessing nor carrying a firearm lawfully.
    Further the Genoa and Carrion brothers were not acting lawfully either.
    This is without regard to how the two unlawful acting groups came to be into contact with each other and who harmed whom at what instance over whatever.

    One other thing...What is is with people now days having parties with and even for (!) children at dawn?!
    This all went down "Sunday about 4:40 a.m."

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  8. #7
    Senior Member Array mojust's Avatar
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    Morons + brawl with machetes and illegal handguns = pointless death, wounding and long term incarceration.
    Sig 226, 228. Glock 19, 23. Smith Model 60,and 1911. XD45 Tactical. Mossberg 930 SPX.

    How we behave as gun owners is important. Posturing and threatening does not serve us well in the public eye.

  9. #8
    Member Array J Bowen's Avatar
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    crazy stuff
    I am picturing this incident was like a
    scene from Gangs of New York.

  10. #9
    Member Array Defensive Arms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mojust View Post
    Morons + brawl with machetes and illegal handguns = pointless death, wounding and long term incarceration.
    Not all the handguns were illegal. From the article:

    A gun recovered from the scene belonged to Orville Carrion, who had a license to carry the weapon, Early said.
    "I've run across shooting after shooting where the defender shot a violent aggressor with a .380 and did little to immediately stop his depredations. A good hollow point load in 9mm or .38 Special will, historically, end lethal assaults more quickly."

    ~ Massad Ayoob

  11. #10
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Even as one of the _BG_ individuals had an LTC of some sort* he still was amongst the aggressors, wielding machetes and attacking a person, as acting aggressive and _unlawful_.
    Possessing an LTC is not an allowance to act in any manner one might wish.

    * Further in MA we have different grades of permit allowing _possession_ of a firearm. It is called here a "License To Carry". Carry as in possess not necessarilly nor exclusively carry on ones person.
    In MA having an LTC type 'A' (All Lawful Purposes) in specific allows carry of a firearm on body...But many places and persons even in possession of this top level type permit are limited with a caveat of 'Sporting Purposes Only' which negates street and/defensive carry purposing.
    Then there is the LTC type 'B' which allows possession and purchase of a firearm as well as ammunition, BUT does not allow actual 'carry' of a "loaded" firearm. Loaded being a firearm with a round in the chamber, and/or having a magazine that has ammunition in it -AND_ being within functional proximity of the firearm though not specifically nor exclusively inserted or connected to the firearm. Very similar to other notorious states such as NY.

    Though the handgun itself may not have been illegal it's 1) As applied felony use and quite possibly 2) Having been carried outside of the home as into the street where it was found is criminal...as by a criminal acting person(s). As well use of an otherwise lawfully possessed and/or carried firearm as in commission of a crime is in MA a felony, and itself it's own criminal action.

    In MA unlicensed and/or unlawful (wrong LTC type) 'carry' of a firearm on the streets period is a felony never mind use of said carried weapon at all...which as based on the OP in conjunction with the news report very much appears to be a tale of felony assault which lead to murder (a person died as result of the non-defense (!) assault), which is a serious crime.

    - Janq has a MA LTC-A with no caveats/restrictions
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  12. #11
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    Report in the article posted is pretty chaotic at best.

    I'm going to have to default to Janq's position on this one.

    On it's surface, it does not look like a clear case of self defense.

    One of the parties involved may have had a legally owned weapon, and a valid ccw permit, but on it's surface, it appears he was more than eager to be involved in reckless behavior and showing extreme indiscretion.

    It does not look good for the ccw holder who is being charged with murder.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

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    Senior Member Array lance22's Avatar
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    Good thing it wasn't in Chicago, or he'd have to apologize to the people who tried to kill him.

  14. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by mojust View Post
    Morons + brawl with machetes and illegal handguns = pointless death, wounding and long term incarceration.
    Over a parking space?
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  15. #14
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    On a side note... this event answers the question, "why carry a spare magazine"!

    Just one of many reasons!
    ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!

    "A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
    judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
    superior skills."

  16. #15
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    Good point Thumper!

    To the heart of a lot of folks around here!
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

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