Think before you shoot!

Think before you shoot!

This is a discussion on Think before you shoot! within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; I didn't post this to start an LEO bashing thread so please keep it civil. I did however, post this as an example. This same ...

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Thread: Think before you shoot!

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Think before you shoot!

    I didn't post this to start an LEO bashing thread so please keep it civil. I did however, post this as an example. This same incident could have been started by one of us.

    PLEASE make absolutely sure you know what's going on in a third party situation before you decide to just jump right in without all the information... At the very least a call out to the party that APPEARS to be having difficulty is in order...ala DO YOU NEED ASSISTANCE?

    The "Oh Crap...someone's getting attacked...POP POP POP....oops sorry..." is NOT a plan.

    Officer Shoots Woman, Pit Bull Playing - Houston News Story - KPRC Houston
    Officer Shoots Woman, Pit Bull Playing
    Woman, Dog Expected To Survive

    POSTED: Thursday, October 8, 2009
    UPDATED: 7:00 am CDT October 8, 2009
    LA MARQUE, Texas -- A police officer shot a woman and a dog that were playing when she thought the dog was attacking the woman, witnesses told KPRC Local 2.

    WATCH IT: Woman, Pit Bull Shot While Playing

    Witnesses said a La Marque police officer was driving along 5th Avenue near Walnut Street at about 7:15 p.m. Wednesday, after she helped a person around the corner.

    The officer heard people playing and screaming, witnesses said. A 23-year-old woman and her friend were playing with a pit bull.

    Witnesses said the officer got out of the car and fired several shots toward the dog.

    "The young lady started hollering and just at that time a police officer was coming down and thought the dog was attacking the lady," witness Dennis Wallace said. "I can't say that I would do anything different. The lady (the officer) drew down and started shooting. I couldn't say I wouldn't have done that."

    The woman suffered a gunshot wound to the chest. She was taken by helicopter to Memorial Hermann Hospital in stable condition.

    The dog was also wounded. The dog's owner took it to a vet and it is expected to recover.

    La Marque police declined to comment about the shooting. The Galveston County District Attorney's Office and the Galveston County Sheriff's Office are investigating.
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  2. #2
    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    Wow. That's one of those, " You had to be there" kinda moments. I'm sure she honestly felt that the dog was attacking, but I'm trying to figure out how the woman was shot?
    "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luke 22:36

    "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." Thomas Jefferson

  3. #3
    Member Array nova83tx's Avatar
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    I was not in that officer's shoes, but I have to think shooting an attacking dog while it is on top of it's victims would be a recipe for problems.

    Doesn't a taser work on dogs? Doesn't OC/Mace work on dogs? If she had non-lethal rounds for her shotgun, doesn't that work on dogs? All of these seem more viable solutions that keep the officers distance from the attacking animal, and none should be lethal to the woman that she thought was being attacked.

    I don't know if many people think like I do, but in situations like this I have been taught to Stop, Think, and then Act.

    If the officer had taken just 2-3 seconds and hollered out to the woman, this might have been avoided. I understand that 2-3 seconds might be life or death in rare situations, but the most of the time, these few extra seconds may keep you out of trouble.

    I am just thinking to if I found a loved one underneath a dog . . . I think I would be leading in with a long blunt object striking the dog while I keep my distance, or I would try to deploy my OC. If the dog was running at us ready to attack, and I had no one in the background, then I would be taking a shot.

    And the OP was exactly right, it is imperative that we has CHL holders don't go gallivanting in to situations where we don't have all the information. An easy example I can think of is all the stories I have heard about bystanders trying to break up a fight between a husband and wife . . . then to be rewarded by both the husband and wife turning on the person who was trying to help!
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  4. #4
    Distinguished Member Array PastorPack's Avatar
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    Ooops!

    Bad shoot, bad shot!
    God is love (1 John 4:8)

  5. #5
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    would not at least ASK the woman if she needed help? Or at least yelled you were gonna shoot and give her a chance to yell NO??
    again..... I just posted this in another thread....
    we are all emotional, irrational human beings.....

    PS...please dont turn this into a I am / am NOT emotional or irrational.....
    start a new thread.......... :)
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  6. #6
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Wow,regardless of intent she shot an innocent civilian,I bet they fire her,her judgment is lacking
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  7. #7
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Craziness.

    I can excuse her thought of thinking the person was being attacked.
    But I cannot excuse her for firing and not thinking of background, before pulling the trigger.

    A better thought would have been to deploy OC/CS, first.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

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  8. #8
    Member Array BaserRonin's Avatar
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    un-freaking-believable. That woman needs to be fired immediately.

    There is a long list of reasons I came up with, but the bottom line is this woman lacks judgment, is not aware of her surroundings, and does not know how to effectively use the tools necessary to do her job. She is dangerous and will end up costing the city a lot of money in the future.



    Edit: I got fired up and forgot the point of the thread. Knowing the situation before you open fire, under any circumstances, is a great idea!

  9. #9
    Member Array KralBlbec's Avatar
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    I am just thinking to if I found a loved one underneath a dog . . . I think I would be leading in with a long blunt object striking the dog
    I find fists & knives a much more suitable weapon against dogs than firearms. No way in heck I would ever consider shooting a handgun at a dog on top of a person, even if I knew it was attacking. For starters, I'm not nearly that good of a shot... yet.

  10. #10
    Member Array tabraha's Avatar
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    Wow, not only a lapse in judgement and failure to asses the situation but just plain stupid to shoot into the middle of a tussle. Guess she didn't have a taser she could've deployed?

    She needs to be canned if she can't think to ask "Ma'am do you need help?" King-sized liability. Hope the lady that was shot in the chest recovers fully.
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  11. #11
    Member Array CJ810's Avatar
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    reminds me of the story Candide I read in college. The two main characters see two monkeys chasing two naked women. They kill the monkeys to rescue the women only to infuriate the women because the monkeys were their lovers.

    SO fiction is still stranger than life, but not by much.

    I hope the woman and the dog make it.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array HKinNY's Avatar
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    Heat of the moment I can see it happening, I think retraining over firing would be in order. Here we are rushing to judgement. Tunnel vision?

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array havegunjoe's Avatar
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    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by gottabkiddin View Post
    Wow. That's one of those, " You had to be there" kinda moments. I'm sure she honestly felt that the dog was attacking, but I'm trying to figure out how the woman was shot?
    What was Rambolina doing shooting anything other than the dog? Thinking the dog was attacking someone I can understand but how did the woman get shot?
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    "My bad..."
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  15. #15
    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    LOL
    "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luke 22:36

    "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." Thomas Jefferson

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