Donít bring a knife to a coffee fight

This is a discussion on Donít bring a knife to a coffee fight within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Great job and thanks for the stylized report. I'll be adding a hot cup o joe to my arsenal....

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Thread: Donít bring a knife to a coffee fight

  1. #16
    Distinguished Member Array PastorPack's Avatar
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    Great job and thanks for the stylized report.

    I'll be adding a hot cup o joe to my arsenal.
    God is love (1 John 4:8)

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  3. #17
    Distinguished Member Array ArmyCop's Avatar
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    Thought you might like this:

    Tactical Coffee Claymore Mug from Zazzle.com
    For God, Family and Country!

  4. #18
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    Well I guess there is a good use for Starbuck's. Drinking their crap isn't one of them!

  5. #19
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    Great job. Your style of writing makes for an entertaining read as well.

  6. #20
    Member Array Chiller2's Avatar
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    The author Caleb at Gun Nuts Media has .45 and 9mm weapons he shoot IPSC,Steel Challenge and IDPA.He recently won the Indiana State Steel Challenge in the revolver division.
    Here is some his answers to some questions and comments he has gotten about the encounter


    In the comments, there have been a lot of good, reasonable questions asked, and I want to do my best to answer those questions here where everyone can see them. Most of the questions have centered around the same general topics, so hopefully by hitting the broad strokes I’ll be able to answer the big questions. Here goes!

    * Why a .25 ACP and not something bigger? The Beretta Jetfire (my everyday carry gun) has been riding in my pocket for a year and a half now. It goes everywhere I go as long as it’s legal to carry a gun. It’s light, doesn’t take up a lot of weight, and most importantly I can shoot it very well. Which is why I don’t carry a Kel-Tec .32 or a Ruger LCP in .380 – the triggers on those guns are horrid and mushy, and I just don’t shoot them as well as I shoot the .25. Out of a 2 inch barrel, we’re not exactly talking “hammer of Thor” ballistics for any of those rounds, so I’d rather carry the gun that I can get lead on target fastest.
    * What kind of pocket holster do you use? - A very basic Blackhawk nylon pocket holster. It’s been in my pocket as long as the Jetfire. I use a pocket holster for the .25 primarily because it keeps the gun oriented correctly in the pocket, with the butt of the gun facing up like it should.
    * Do you practice with it? – Most certainly. I shoot the Jetfire once or twice a month, but my usual practice with the gun is dry fire practice coming from the holster. In practice I usually hit about 2.00-2.5 seconds on the draw with my hands starting outside of the pocket. I would imagine that was about where I was on Saturday for my draw time as well; it just felt ridiculously slow due to the effects of adrenaline dump and time dilation.
    * What about the coffee? - It was in a standard Starbucks cup with the lid on. I did hit him with the coffee, and I assume the lid came off when the cup hit him. I don’t know this for a fact, but can infer it from the fact that after the event, the cup and the lid were both on the ground in separate locations.
    * What did you see? – Well, to be honest I don’t remember seeing all that much. It’s sort of like my memory is a slide show: I remember seeing the knife, then I remember seeing my gun in the middle of the “A” in Indiana (yes, he was wearing a Hoosiers’ sweatshirt, that I remember) and the next thing I remember is him running.
    * Why didn’t you shoot? That’s the most complicated question, and it’s something I’ve been mulling over myself. My previous experiences with situations like this have primarily been in uniform, so as a civilian there’s a different calculation going on. Based on input from others and prior experiences, the best guess as to why I didn’t shoot is that I perceived my assailant dropping his weapon and turning to flee, even though I don’t remember seeing it or hearing the weapon hit the deck. That perception was enough to halt the “SQUEEZE TRIGGER” impulse.
    * How long did it take? I have no idea. Best guess from start to finish is 5, maybe 10 seconds. It certainly felt like an eternity.
    * Will you be switching carry methods? – No, I plan on sticking with the Jetfire. Did I wish for a bigger gun in an easier to access holster? Yes, but not until after the event. But since I can’t carry a bigger gun in an easier to access holster at the office, the Jetfire will continue to ride shotgun.

    Probably the most common comment I’ve received in light of recent situations (aside from “glad you’re okay”) has been “ditch that .25 and get a “real gun”. I’m not going to argue that the .25 is lacking in the terminal punch category, however I want to debunk a couple of common arguments I’ve heard about the .25 vs. other pocket sized guns. Remember, I carry in a pocket because belt carry with a reasonably sized pistol just isn’t feasible for me right now.

    * A .22 would be better! – No, it wouldn’t. The ballistics figures you see for hot .22s are usually from rifles or pistols with at least a 4 inch barrel. When you shrink the gun down to the same size as my Jetfire, the ballistics are pretty much the same. Plus, you have the issue with rimfire cartridges not being as reliable as the centerfire .25 ACP cartridge.
    * A .25 has no stopping power! – And yet, despite everyone that’s said that, no one has volunteered to stand downrange and catch Gold Dots out of my mousegun. :)

    People seem to forget that carrying a defensive firearm is a personal decision, and that solutions that work for one person may not be the best solution for everyone. That’s why if you’re happy with your Kel-Tec or Ruger pocket gun, I’m not going to tell you to switch to a gun that holds more ammo and has less recoil. Out of my 2 inch gun, the Speer Gold Dot rounds I use are going about 900-950 fps, which as established beats the pants off a knife fight or a sharp stick.

  7. #21
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    A minor point in your ordeal... at the price of Starbucks, that would constitute "grand theft"!

    I think you demonstrated very well that "action is always faster than reaction" by forcing your would be aggressor to react! Well done!
    ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!

    "A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
    judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
    superior skills."

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