Country's most violent city...again

Country's most violent city...again

This is a discussion on Country's most violent city...again within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Welcome to my world... reigning champs since 2003. FBI stats designate Saginaw the most violent city per capita in America | Saginaw News - - ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array Saltydog's Avatar
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    Country's most violent city...again

    Welcome to my world... reigning champs since 2003.


    FBI stats designate Saginaw the most violent city per capita in America | Saginaw News - - MLive.com

    FBI stats designate Saginaw the most violent city per capita in America
    By Gus Burns | The Saginaw News
    January 03, 2010, 4:00AM

    It was October when 150 protesters took to the streets of the city’s East Side, demanding an end to violence in Saginaw.

    Angry after shootings led to the death of 9-year-old Devin Elliott and injuries to Jewel Lee, 11, and a 6-month-old infant in September, they marched on the sidewalks of East Genesee, passing businesses advertising motel rooms, shoes and cell phones, carrying signs and chanting.

    Federal Bureau of Investigation statistics indicate a ruthless nature lurking in Saginaw, a city that once boomed with industrial prowess and attracted workers from across the nation but now watches as its population ebbs while the violence stays.

    Even as Saginaw lost more than 10 percent of it citizens — more than 7,000 moved away since 2000 — violent crime continues to climb, up more than 50 percent in 2008 compared with 2000, FBI statistics show. The annual violent crime statistics stretching back to 2000 expose the troubles.

    The 2008 numbers released in September — the most recent available consolidating crime statistics for more than 8,700 communities — show that once again, as it has each year since 2003, Saginaw ranked as the No. 1 most violent city in America. The ranking is based on violent crimes per person in the nearly 850 cities with populations greater than 40,000.

    Occurrences of murder, non-negligent manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery and aggravated assault comprise the categories the FBI uses to gauge a city’s proclivity to violence.

    Despite an overall increase in violent crime through 2008, the number of recorded homicides this year, 13, is the third lowest number recorded this decade.

    In Michigan, Flint ranked sixth, Detroit 10th and Pontiac 11th based on the 2008 statistics. You have to go back to 2002, a year when Irvington, Calif., topped the list, to find the most recent year Saginaw wasn’t No. 1.

    “Our 30-year crime history is appalling,” said Saginaw County Prosecutor Michael D. Thomas, a Freeland Democrat. “You can’t do more with less.”

    Thomas identified reductions in police, more lenient state sentencing guidelines and a disproportionately low number of prosecutors in Saginaw County versus similar cities as key factors in Saginaw’s crime rate.

    The Saginaw Police Department has 105 sworn officers; it had 136 in November 2000, said Personnel Generalist Beth Church of the city’s Employee Services Department.

    Kalamazoo has 40 percent the incidents of violent crime compared to Saginaw, according to 2008 FBI figures, and employs 30 prosecutors. Saginaw County has nearly 20 prosecutors, Thomas said. And statistics show, he said, if you’re tougher on criminals who commit minor crimes, you can reduce the number of major crimes they’re likely to commit in the future.

    Christina Jones, 75, a lifelong East Side resident and Houghton-Jones Neighborhood Task Force board member said she’s noticed that “it’s gotten worse” over the last 10 years.

    “Hearing the reports, you’re not even safe walking out your door,” she said, “And that’s a scary feeling.”

    In the past, she said, violence seemed confined mainly to gang conflicts, but today “these little thugs” are unfocused with the crimes they commit, she said.

    The key, Jones said, is reaching youths before they turn 14, after which they “sometimes become hardened and kind of hard to reach.

    “We need to try and educate our young people and instill in them some sort of morals,” she said.

    Surrounded by lottery, gambling, drinking, smoking and cursing, “they see nothing wrong with it, and most of the parents are involved in all of that. .. They think wrong is right.”

    March organizers followed the demonstration with four months of meetings uniting key public figures, service providers, community organizers and residents in a quest for a solution. The sessions promoted synergy between police officers, educators, clergy, youths and government officials.

    This month, a “steering session” is planned to complete a “five-point strategic plan,” said Larry D. Camel, the co-founder of Parishioners on Patrol, the group that coordinated the march and meetings.

    Law enforcement is key to protecting the public, Thomas said. But even if the court system had the resources to fully prosecute all criminals, legislators still sometimes render impotent the system’s potential to enact justice.

    “Our sentencing guidelines tie some of our judge’s hands behind their backs,” he said, removing the judge’s leeway in imposing a sentence and often resulting in shorter sentence benefiting the convict. Thomas said first-offense felons go to prison less than 10 percent of the time in Michigan.

    Based on the number of parolees Thomas’s office prosecutes, many convicts are released from prison early, Thomas said.

    Midland, a city with about 10,000 fewer people than Saginaw, had only 50 violent crimes in 2008 and ranked as one of the safest cities in the nation at 766 out of about 850 cities in the United States with 40,000 people or more, according to federal statistics. Saginaw Township, with fewer than 40,000 people, recorded 102 violent crimes the same year.

    “That tells you what you already know, that Midland is quite a fine town,” Thomas said.

    Saginaw started the decade ranked 14th among violent cities with populations over 40,000 in 2000 and moved to 11th place in 2001 before surging to second in 2002 and first in 2003, where the city has remained since.


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array Guns and more's Avatar
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    Saginaw?
    Better than Compton, Detroit, East St. Louis, Oakland, and South Central?
    Saginaw started the decade ranked 14th among violent cities with populations over 40,000 in 2000 and moved to 11th place in 2001 before surging to second in 2002 and first in 2003, where the city has remained since.
    I can see your government officials won't settle for second any more.

  3. #3
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    Pitiful.
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  4. #4
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    Gee, I thought it was Camden, NJ.

    We have to many contenders for 1st place. Sad.

  5. #5
    VIP Member Array grady's Avatar
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    I demand a recount.





    Oh, alright. I grudgingly acknowledge your status, given your long reign.

    How is it in your area? Any plans or option to move?

  6. #6
    Senior Member Array Old Sarge's Avatar
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    Ha, Grady. I had to laugh at your remark. I travel from the Ozarks sometimes up to the upper midwest, and have gone thru your neck of the woods, many times. Too many, probably. But well aware of your crime rates. My little bro came down to visit one time, and stopped in one of your better motels. Next morning, came out and didn't have any license plates.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Sarge View Post
    Ha, Grady. I had to laugh at your remark. I travel from the Ozarks sometimes up to the upper midwest, and have gone thru your neck of the woods, many times. Too many, probably. But well aware of your crime rates. My little bro came down to visit one time, and stopped in one of your better motels. Next morning, came out and didn't have any license plates.
    Which were most likely used in a crime the next day...

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  8. #8
    VIP Member Array Patti's Avatar
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    Sounds like "no-man's land".
    Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy. — Winston Churchill

  9. #9
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    Wow I thought #1 was NOLA maybe that was for most murders per year.
    Proud houlder of a Texas Open Carry License.

  10. #10
    Distinguished Member Array GunGeezer's Avatar
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    What happened to Chicago? I thought it had to be in the top ten at least.

  11. #11
    Distinguished Member Array tiwee's Avatar
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    Notice how the article focused on what they can not afford. That is more police and prosecutors. I have a clue for the good folks in government in Saginaw - losing 7,000 people from your city means revenues are going down.

    How about a little love for the one program that has been proven to work but probably has not been tried. Greatly expand the number of armed citizens with conceal carry endorsements and self defense skills. This would be cost effective and has the best chance of all alternatives of actually lowering crime.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array zacii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GunGeezer View Post
    What happened to Chicago? I thought it had to be in the top ten at least.
    I heard that Chicago's crime went down a little, since their biggest crime boss moved to D.C.
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

    "A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    Any speculation as to why your city is a repeat winner of this distinction?
    Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
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    Guns are like sex and air...its no big deal until YOU can't get any.

  14. #14
    Distinguished Member Array Guardian's Avatar
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    You know the statistics that I find disturbing other then these rankings is they always point out the loss of LEOs, but they never point out how many of those LEO jobs were patrol, out of 105 Sworn Police Officers, how many are Patrol and how many are office, traffic or some other desk, office job when it's patrol officers that are needed desperately out there. We have the same problem here and someone finally took notice.

    The Police Dept 2 years ago was complaining of manning, so one of our city councilors (finally someone with guts and brains) did a audit and found out that they could cut office and desk jobs and put an additional 26 officers out on the streets and assign to those cushy office/desk to other support personnel, guess what, the griping stopped. I just wonder, don't you?
    "I dislike death, however, there are some things I dislike more than death. Therefore, there are times when I will not avoid danger" Mencius"

  15. #15
    New Member Array INSULATION T's Avatar
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    Welcome to Haitisomaliaamerica.

    Make sure that you celebrate "their" day tomorrow.

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