This is a discussion on BAD-Man AD's at airport within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; ...
If there is one place in the whole world you want to make sure that you walk in with a gun that has the chamber empty It would be the Airport,I wonder if dufus walked in carrying and upon declaring his gun, unholstered and was clearing it prior to putting it in the gun case
"Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
--Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .
I'll bet a dollar to a donut the owner pulled the trigger to decock the firearm after he removed the clip. Totally forgetting about the sneaky one hiding in the chamber.
What you bet he didn't remember to slide the action back and look for that little one hiding in that little bitty hole in the gun?
Who put that round in the chamber?
"That I cannot do."
"Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks."
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
It should be ADs not AD's because AD's shows possession. I was kind of confused when I read the title. Anyway, I agree that it's a negligent discharge; not an accidental discharge.
That's how 'Magic Bullets' are made...By worn and dirty extractors and/or worn casing bases.
What is proper is to _open the action_ and to VISUALLY as well as PHYSICALLY check the chamber for a round.
Also when storing/shipping a firearm it's most proper to use a 'Chamber Flag'.
A ten second moment of physical action as along with a ten penny piece of plastic can save a lifetimes worth of regret.
A properly fitting extractor as against a case base.
Source - Light vs
A generic 'Chamber Flag'
Source - Kleen-Bore Chamber Safety Flags 9mm to 45 Caliber Pistol Nylon Orange Package of 2 - MidwayUSA
A gun that is in a SAFE condition as was/is to be cased with 'Chamber Flag' installed and highly visible making it impossible to 'accidentaly' load or leave loaded a chambered round
I've got five or six of these on hand that I keep in my range kit for just this sort of firearm transport application.
Any gun that I'm not carrying on my person gets cased and is either cable locked through the open action and/or have a chamber flag installed. I double up on both with my rifles in specific.
Use of this easy, fast and cheap method as a rule makes it physically impossible for any such item as this event to occur.
Cheap insurance by my book...And should be by everyone else who transports/travels with firearms not carried on body.
Worn extractors and brass with worn bases (from being loaded and unloaded often) very well can result in this scenario regardless of how many times a person might stroke the slide wrongly thinking they are good to go.
Never ever forget this lesson as by proxy (listen to him off camera stroke the slide thinking it's been cleared)...
'DEA Agent Shoots Himself'
YouTube - DEA Agent Shoots Himself
You get very many chances to fail, and pass.
You only get one chance to pass, and fail.
This is yet another discharge as borne in handler negligence (in this case the person who packed that firearm be it the owner or some other person on his behalf), and is not an 'accident'.
- Lee Paige, Former DEA Agent...The only person in a classroom "qualified" to handle a 'Glock Forty'
Hm. Procedure calls for unloading and showing clear while standing in a safe area that's protected from the public, that protects any unintentionally-fired bullets from escaping the area, and which allows people to "show clear" prior to buttoning up the firearm in the case for baggage, yeah? Yes??"It has to be in a hardened, locked case and obviously the weapon should be cleared and the ammunition stored separately," he said. "In this case, the procedure was not followed correctly."
Doubtful. By "skycap" being mentioned, apparently the unloading/clearing is done outside the doors before approaching the ticketing counter. At small airports in "gun friendly" areas, I've seen exactly this, strange and dangerous as it sounds.
At my airport, the ticketing agents are at the booths immediately inside the doors from where you exit your vehicle. That's where you declare your arms for travel. Since it's perfectly legal to be armed outside of the "secure" zones, it seems to me there needs to be some sort of safe area for showing clear. At minimum, there should be a barrel of sand with a bulletproof barrier between that area and the public, for purposes of unloading and showing clear, or something similar. Can't imagine that sort of thing being done right there at a ticketing counter, without one.
That whole mess as you describe CCW9 can very easily and _safely_ be avoided if travelers use their noodle and pack their firearm(s) at home as they should AND lock them up inside the TSA compliant case as with at the very least a chamber flag but better yet a cable lock as through the open action.
A human could handle and money with this gun all day long (TSA) and they won't ever get it to fire, not even by slam fire or droppage.
As well it would be incredibly easy to verify with great degree of accuracy whether the guns receiver/frame and/or chamber has any loaded rounds within it. So easy that literally a blind person could detect as much with close to no training at all.
There is no good excuse not to do so when many guns now days come from the factory with chamber flags in the case as shipped AND free cable locks too. Never mind that cable locks are given away fro free by most every police station everywhere (just walk in and ask for one!) never mind that they cost like $2 at WalMart.
It's almost silly not to have one as related to travel transport.
Never mind the senselessness in going through all that garbage at check in...Which only increases chance to fail, rather than pass.
P.S. - This applies to not just handguns or SA but revolvers (cable through the cylinder) and longguns too.
Only kind of longgun I couldn't apply a cable lock to for storage and transport thus far was a side ejecting lever action Marlin. But that is no excuse to not use cable locks at all on anything.
We as gun owners need to know this stuff and act right so as to not add fuel to the anti gun fires such as stories like this are apt to do.
+1 on the Cable lock Janq. I keep one every firearm I own except while at the range (use flags), or my carry pistol (which is either attached to me or in a safe). No firearm is ever unsecured.
Not only do cable locks prevent the gun from "accidentally firing", it also prevents the gun from being loaded and intentionally fired by an unauthorized person.
Would you trust some lame TSA agent to start fooling around with your firearm at the check in counter without a cable lock? I don't...
An ounce of common sense and ten seconds of time is all it takes.
"a reminder that no law can replace personal responsibility" - Bill Clinton 2010.
I do exact same on every firearm I have in my house, with exception of the Marlin (a loaner) which won't accept a cable lock by design...Even as _all_ of my guns are ept locked secondarily in lockable durable cases and safes.
Agreed they also prevent idiot moron accidental firing, too.
Very very cheap insurance.
As you say, ensuring the firearm is clear PRIOR to ever leaving one's home is by far the safest method to check, double-check and ensure the gun is satisfactorily and clearly labeled, locked and boxed. Cable lock is so visually obvious, that too should be a no-brainer.
A person need only accept the simple fact that since being on the airplane will require being disarmed, then being just outside the airport a person should be disarmed as well. If a person has such a problem with being disarmed in this situation, another armed person should be driving and dropping you off. Either way shouldn't be difficult.
From the perspective of safety, it's the only way to go.
I did a lot of traveling last year with my pistol, and not ONCE did I have to actually show my gun as being clear when I declared it.
I always unloaded in the car prior to going into the terminal. During the 1st half of the year, I would leave my two magazines loaded and put the +1 round into the foam padding of the case. (I use a pelican case with the perferated foam inserts that can be removed to "custom fit" the contents) That was a simple way to account for all 21 of my rounds, 10 in each mag and 1 in the foam. Check the gun, put a trigger lock on it and then lock it in the case.
Later in the year, I ended up having to unload all the magazines and put all the ammo in a seperate box (not because TSA, but becuase of airline policy)
I do like Janq's idea of using the chamber flag too though. I will be using one of those from now on in my travels.
Member - NRA, IDPA
Don't ask a question you don't know the answer to
I always just pop the slide off my Glock before putting it in the case. The agent does a double take at the pile o' gun parts, but it's never been a problem - and that way even the ignorant can see at a glance that the gun is defanged.
My website: Cornered Cat