Arizona Immigration Bill Poll

This is a discussion on Arizona Immigration Bill Poll within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Phoenix, Arizona (CNN) -- Sue Schwartz says she's been called a racist so many times she doesn't mind the label anymore. If wanting immigrants to ...

View Poll Results: Do you support the Arizona Immigration Bill?

Voters
259. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, illegal immigration is a drain on the economy

    239 92.28%
  • No, This is based on bigotry

    14 5.41%
  • No opinion

    6 2.32%
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Thread: Arizona Immigration Bill Poll

  1. #76
    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
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    Phoenix, Arizona (CNN) -- Sue Schwartz says she's been called a racist so many times she doesn't mind the label anymore. If wanting immigrants to enter the country legally, like her great-grandparents from Mexico, and obey the laws of the land makes her racist, then so be it, she says firmly.

    "I'm getting to the point I wear it with pride," says Schwartz, a lifelong Arizonan who has warily watched the growth of the illegal immigrant population in the state over the course of her life.

    Some Hispanic Americans hope law deters illegal immigration - CNN.com
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  3. #77
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    Geronimo

    Quote Originally Posted by pgrass101 View Post
    Well I think we should hear what a true American has to say about this whole immigration issue.

    So let's ask Geronimo
    How many of those true Americans will get mistaken for illegal Mexicans under the new law?

  4. #78
    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    How many of those true Americans will get mistaken for illegal Mexicans under the new law?
    Looks like they want to take their chance to get rid of the illegal immigrants.They seem very upset with illegals as are we.The legal immigrants have work hard for long time the legal way to be American.
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  5. #79
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    re: Sat Cong

    Quote Originally Posted by SatCong View Post
    Looks like they want to take their chance to get rid of the illegal immigrants.They seem very upset with illegals as are we.The legal immigrants have work hard for long time the legal way to be American.
    You didn't answer the question!!!! "How many of those true Americans will get mistaken for illegal Mexicans under the new law?"

    And another one for you. How many of those mistaken will be jailed by mistake?

    When I can be assured that whatever system is established for catching and removing illegal aliens ASSURES that citizens and lawful residents are not harassed, and when I am assured that everyone regardless of their appearance will have to carry the same sort of documents--or not--so everyone is treated equally, I'll back the law.

    We have already established in this thread that the law is flawed because it relies on a DL-- which means nothing at all about status.

    Are you willing to carry a passport with you 100% of the time just in case you get stopped for a minor traffic offense?

    If your answer is, "I don't need no freakin passport because I look American," you don't understand the problem.

    If your answer is, "I won't be forced to carry a passport in my own country, and no one will make me do it," then put yourself in the shoes of all of the millions of citizens and lawful immigrants who also resent being put in that position.

    No one is denying there is a huge problem and that the problem needs solving. The discussion here is whether or not the AZ law is
    an appropriate approach to the problem. It isn't.

  6. #80
    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    You didn't answer the question!!!! "How many of those true Americans will get mistaken for illegal Mexicans under the new law?"

    And another one for you. How many of those mistaken will be jailed by mistake?

    When I can be assured that whatever system is established for catching and removing illegal aliens ASSURES that citizens and lawful residents are not harassed, and when I am assured that everyone regardless of their appearance will have to carry the same sort of documents--or not--so everyone is treated equally, I'll back the law.

    We have already established in this thread that the law is flawed because it relies on a DL-- which means nothing at all about status.

    Are you willing to carry a passport with you 100% of the time just in case you get stopped for a minor traffic offense?

    If your answer is, "I don't need no freakin passport because I look American," you don't understand the problem.

    If your answer is, "I won't be forced to carry a passport in my own country, and no one will make me do it," then put yourself in the shoes of all of the millions of citizens and lawful immigrants who also resent being put in that position.

    No one is denying there is a huge problem and that the problem needs solving. The discussion here is whether or not the AZ law is
    an appropriate approach to the problem. It isn't.
    First line address that, a few is crying, but lot of them are for it in my area.
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  7. #81
    Distinguished Member Array Guardian's Avatar
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    "How many of those true Americans will get mistaken for illegal Mexicans under the new law?"


    I'm love it when someone puts this into the debates. It's neither a here nor there position to take, but nevertheless, it always pops up. So be it. When we came to this land, it was not known as the United States of America as it is today, when we were the 13 colonies, it was not known as the United States of America as it is today, when the soldiers fought the "True Inhabitants" of this land, it was not known as the United States of America as it is known today, so that argument holds very little value in this debate and if that's all anyone has to stand on, I would look for better footing, that ground is giving way.

    That's just my view on it, not always right, not always wrong, just my view.

    I still agree it needs tweaking to straighten out some of those minor problems, but overall, it was a long time coming.
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  8. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guardian View Post
    "How many of those true Americans will get mistaken for illegal Mexicans under the new law?"

    I love it when someone puts this into the debates.... When we came to this land... when we were the 13 colonies... when the soldiers fought the "True Inhabitants" of this land, it was not known as the United States of America as it is known today, so that argument holds very little value in this debate and if that's all anyone has to stand on, I would look for better footing, that ground is giving way.
    My friend, Guardian, mind your collective terms. "We" was not a part of history 'cause we are sitting right here on the internet talking about it. So who do you mean, "we", my friend? Remember, a valid tribal enrollment card or other valid tribal identification passes as proof of citizenship.

    Quote Originally Posted by sigmanluke View Post
    I agree with others that the best way to help deter illegal immigration is to give LARGE penalties and fines to the employers who hire them. No more jobs, much less illegal immigration.
    What about the illegals who create their own businesses? No large penalties for those who contribute to our economy, eh, Sigman?


    I oppose the AZ law on principle and voted "bigot" because that's the closest choice to "small-minded". 97% of you are a drain on the American Dream - and it's the darkest drain any tyrant dictator monarch ever tried to social engineer. Ya'll really need a night out at the museum or fine arts center, symphony, ... see how people of the world share some core values. Not all of the best business people are American - not by a long shot.

    People have a right to cross the Arizona border from New Mexico and work without bureaucratic red tape. International governments should respect the same human right. If you want smaller government, shutting down the borders and labeling hard workers as, "illegal" isn't the way. Be libertarian about it, and open the borders.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daddy Warcrimes View Post
    Immigration (illegal or otherwise) is not the problem.

    The problem is
    a) employers needing unskilled labor
    b) minimum wage and benefits laws discourage employers from hiring legitimate residents
    c) Americans would rather collect welfare than perform manual labor
    d) Illegal immigrants tend to use more of the government welfare programs without contributing as much in taxes.
    The solution to our problems do not lie in immigration reform, but in eliminating the socialist programs....
    Most of us can agree on ending "socialist" programs and between us could probably slash the budget just fine. But what is the basis of your "d)" statement? I think it is a fiction: Many illegal immigrants contribute via payroll deduction; but illegals can't get "welfare" except for public education and emergency room care. And, yeah, where there are large percentages of illegals, emergency rooms are overburdened (25% of uncompensated due to illegals). However, nationally, illegal immigrants represent about 15 percent of the uninsured, but for various reasons (they're younger, they lack access to government programs) they don't represent 15 percent of uncompensated care; it's more like 10 percent. You see, many illegals own private health insurance.

    This debate isn't new. Since its birth, America has been a beacon, a boon, and a boot to immigrants. I'm grateful to live in a country where at least a core minority knows its history and knows that freedom is the best engine for economic prosperity and domestic peace and tranquility.

    Quote Originally Posted by MSteve
    We need to really watch what rights we willingly give up "for the greater good." Eventually, someone else's "greater good" might involve taking our rights.
    +1
    Last edited by Pistology; May 2nd, 2010 at 03:35 AM.
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  9. #83
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    For thoes who havent heard the Gov of AZ has just signed into law her approval for the state no license needed any more for anyone carring concealed, this brings AZ on line with VT. & Alaska nice yes ?

  10. #84
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    Hey, let's stay off topic, here. ;) She's not all bad.
    Americans understood the right of self-preservation as permitting a citizen to repel force by force
    when the intervention of society... may be too late to prevent an injury.
    -Blackstone’s Commentaries 145–146, n. 42 (1803) in District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008)

  11. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pistology View Post

    What about the illegals who create their own businesses? No large penalties for those who contribute to our economy, eh, Sigman?

    Absolutely penalize them, If they are illegal, they are illegal. Shut the business down.

    People have a right to cross the Arizona border from New Mexico and work without bureaucratic red tape. International governments should respect the same human right. If you want smaller government, shutting down the borders and labeling hard workers as, "illegal" isn't the way. Be libertarian about it, and open the borders.

    I disagree with this completely. I do think it should be made easier/faster to immigrate legally, but don't open the border.

    This debate isn't new. Since its birth, America has been a beacon, a boon, and a boot to immigrants. I'm grateful to live in a country where at least a core minority knows its history and knows that freedom is the best engine for economic prosperity and domestic peace and tranquility.
    I have no problems with those who come the legal way. I know many of them, and all but one of them support this new law.
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  12. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by REDTAIL View Post
    For thoes who havent heard the Gov of AZ has just signed into law her approval for the state no license needed any more for anyone carring concealed, this brings AZ on line with VT. & Alaska nice yes ?
    Wake up America.......all states need this.

  13. #87
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    Question ...

    will they be stopping white ppl and asking them if they are here legally from Canada,Europe?


    papers please!!!
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  14. #88
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    Originally Posted by MSteve:
    "We need to really watch what rights we willingly give up "for the greater good." Eventually, someone else's "greater good" might involve taking our rights."

    MSteve's comment is the most perceptive of all so far in this thread. There are too many here who scream bloody murder at the slightest affront to their 2A rights but simply can't see the loss of rights inherent in the new AZ law. Or rather, they may see it but since it doesn't affect them directly they don't care.

    That's about the same way most people view 2A rights. They aren't necessarily anti, they just don't really care because as they themselves won't or don't choose to carry they don't bother themselves with our concerns. Also, not choosing themselves to carry, and being fearful of crime, they are willing to take our 2 A rights.

    Well fear of illegals as fear of street crime brings about lousy laws from emotional politicians trying to make hay in the heat of the moment.

    Every right given up puts us on a slippery slope. And there are always people wanting to take rights whether it is , 2A, 4, 5, 14th equal protection. Every time someone wants a quick fix for a complex problem and willingly takes someone else's rights we go further down the slippery slope to a kind of "we did it to ourselves" totalitarianism.

  15. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pistology View Post



    What about the illegals who create their own businesses? No large penalties for those who contribute to our economy, eh, Sigman?

    +1
    But they had their chance to become a legal citizen and said no, they have to live with it.We all make choice's in life, good or bad and live with it.They made a poor one and didn't want to become a American so back to where they came from.
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  16. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by ErnieNWillis View Post
    We have seen the Rasmussen Poll showing that 70% of Arizona residents support this bill. I'm curious to see what the national consensus is.
    Well, I didn't like your choice of answers.
    Yes, it is a drain on the economy. How about it's against the LAW?
    Illegals are criminals, and we don't need criminals.
    We have to decide if we are a nation of law and order or not.

    By the way, if you travel to Mexico, be ready to show your papers.
    You need a passport, and if working, you need a visa.
    You MUST carry identification.
    Whoa! I guess they're not all warm and fuzzy!

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