What's the country coming too?

This is a discussion on What's the country coming too? within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; So what if your family is in an accident and the first responders show up but none of them speak english? Still think having a ...

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Thread: What's the country coming too?

  1. #46
    VIP Member Array rottkeeper's Avatar
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    So what if your family is in an accident and the first responders show up but none of them speak english? Still think having a national language does not matter?

    My father came from Canada speaking only french and indian, he learned english pronto. He was not allowed to go to school on the reservation he grew up on so not only did he not know the language he was uneducated.

    Through hard work, he not only learned english but went on to become a master plumber owning his own business.

    He, being an immigrent, hated those that were too lazy to learn to communicate with the people of the country they came to.

    Unfortunately he passed in April at the age of 83, well respected in his community as a father, neighbor, friend and honest businessman to all.

    So I do feel if anyonewho want to came to this country to reap the goods they yearn for, they should have the respect to learn the english language enough to communicate.
    For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the son of man be. Mathew 24:27

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  3. #47
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    re: Sig35Seven -- US Citizenship tests are in English

    Quote Originally Posted by Sig35seven View Post
    I'm not "catering" to anyone nor did I suggest we do.. I suggested that everyone be required to pass an English test upon citizen testing.
    They are. The citizenship test is administered in English. You don't need to be at the level of proficiency of an average HS graduate (fairly low), but you do need to be able to understand the questions and answer. You do need to be literate in English. And you do nowadays need some level of education in basic civics.* Take a look and see how you do.

    Here are sample questions for US Citizenship exams. I don't see a word of French or Russian or Spanish on the sample questions.

    Sample INS Citizenship Questions

    Also Could you pass the U.S. citizenship test? - Being an American- msnbc.com

    __________________________________________________ _
    Pre and post 2008 questions.

    CURRENT test - Sample U.S. Citizenship test Questions:

    How many stars are there on the US flag?
    How many states are there in the Union?
    What color are the stars on our flag?
    What do the stars on the flag mean?
    How many stripes are there on the flag?
    What date is the Day of Independence?
    The US achieved Independence from whom?
    What country did we fight during the revolutionary war?
    Who was the first president of the United States?
    What do we call a change of the constitution?

    REDESIGNED test - Sample U.S. Citizenship test Questions:

    Name one war fought by the United States in the 1900s.
    What did Susan B. Anthony do?
    What is one thing Benjamin Franklin is famous for?
    There were 13 original states. Name three.
    What is one responsibility that is only for United States citizens?
    What does the judicial branch do?
    Name your U.S. Representative.
    Who makes federal laws?
    What does the Constitution do?
    What is the supreme law of the land?

  4. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by MSteve View Post
    Yes they have to speak english. No PLs, NCOs, etc do not have to be bilingual.
    That was a rhetorical question friend.
    Mark Twain:
    The government is merely a servant -- merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a
    patriot and who isn't. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

  5. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Free American View Post
    Go to another country and demand that they provide all government documents and teach school in YOUR language, let me know how that works out for you.
    I'm on my fifth one doing just that as we speak. It's worked out pretty darned well, thanks.

    Look, I don't think that anyone is suggesting that we replace English as the de facto official language, and I in fact think that we've crossed a line regarding how much "other" language we put out there. I also think that those who come here have a moral obligation to learn as much English as they can. Those who don't learn any English, however, are self-selecting out of much that America has to offer, and they suffer plenty of penalties for their lack of language skills - such as the full benefits of emergency medical care, as posted earlier.

    What I am suggesting, however, is that the last thing we need is MORE government intrusion into what is a deeply personal facet of our lives. Mandating language, even if it my mother tongue, sounds double-plus bad to me, if you know what I'm saying...
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  6. #50
    Senior Member Array gilraen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    double-plus bad to me, if you know what I'm saying...
    And 2 + 2 shouldn't = 5.
    "I pledge allegiance to the war banner of the united states of Totalitaria. And to the Republic, which no longer stands, several bankers, who are now god, indivisible, with Bernanke bucks and credit for all."

  7. #51
    Senior Member Array hudsonvalley's Avatar
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    .......we have gone from melting pot to salad bowl......
    Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives.
    ---Ronald Reagan

  8. #52
    VIP Member Array cmdrdredd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1 old 0311 View Post
    Really. My ancestors HAD to learn English to work here, and the kids HAD to learn to attend school. Somewhere along the line that became WAY too much to ask.
    Precisely! There was a time where you had to know English, Ellis Island anyone? They even changed some people's names because they were hard to pronounce.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.
    -Thomas Jefferson

    Laws are restrictive but sometimes necessary to maintain a civil society. Rights are nonrestrictive but are always necessary to maintain a free society.

  9. #53
    VIP Member Array cmdrdredd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig35seven View Post
    These opinions seem to raise the question...'what does it mean to be a FREE country?

    My solution would be to make English a requirement on getting your citizenship. Once you're an American you can speak any language you want. You can not force people to speak English.

    Don't forget...these ethnic groups are consumers also. Capitalists will want to cater to these groups. For example, if I were trying to expand my insurance business you can be damned sure I'm going to advertise in Chinese if I want to get the business in Chinatown or Italian in 'Little Italy' and so on. This can be news paper or TV. As a Capitalist American I am fortunate to be able to exercise this freedom of speech.

    America is feeling some growing pains. By opening our doors to freedom we allow many diverse groups of people to enter. They are different than the original settlers of this country. They don't speak the same, they don't look the same, they don't dress the same, they don't worship God the same.

    This is what it's like in a free country and it may be uncomfortable to adjust to these changes in culture. But I believe the worst thing you can do is to become a 'Hater' because things aren't the way they used to be. Times are changing and we need to adapt or you'll become a very unhappy person and will make everyone around you unhappy.

    I am darn happy to live in this great country and feel blessed every day. I don't let some occasional Spanish ads ruin my day or Chinese or Italian or German or....

    Glad to be an American!!
    Really? Then how come in many countries they can't communicate with me because I do not know their language and they ignore me as a result? Hm? Explain THAT one.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.
    -Thomas Jefferson

    Laws are restrictive but sometimes necessary to maintain a civil society. Rights are nonrestrictive but are always necessary to maintain a free society.

  10. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    I'm on my fifth one doing just that as we speak. It's worked out pretty darned well, thanks.

    Look, I don't think that anyone is suggesting that we replace English as the de facto official language, and I in fact think that we've crossed a line regarding how much "other" language we put out there. I also think that those who come here have a moral obligation to learn as much English as they can. Those who don't learn any English, however, are self-selecting out of much that America has to offer, and they suffer plenty of penalties for their lack of language skills.

    What I am suggesting, however, is that the last thing we need is MORE government intrusion into what is a deeply personal facet of our lives. Mandating language, even if it my mother tongue, sounds double-plus bad to me, if you know what I'm saying...
    This is a well written and nicely articulated argument and I agree with you in many ways. I just wonder where the madness will end if we don't draw a line in the sand. Once it is in writing that English is the official language of the US we can put to rest allot of unneeded hullabaloo. I will concede to you though that there are always unintended consequences to more government legislation.
    Mark Twain:
    The government is merely a servant -- merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a
    patriot and who isn't. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

  11. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmdrdredd View Post
    Precisely! There was a time where you had to know English, Ellis Island anyone? They even changed some people's names because they were hard to pronounce.
    And you think this is a GOOD thing? Seriously? I swear, this site is full of people who resent the census (about as Constitutionally sound a procedure as there is these days) and yet don't bat an eye at the government forcibly changing someone's name?!?
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  12. #56
    VIP Member Array cmdrdredd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    And you think this is a GOOD thing? Seriously? I swear, this site is full of people who resent the census (about as Constitutionally sound a procedure as there is these days) and yet don't bat an eye at the government forcibly changing someone's name?!?
    Yes it's damn good. You want to be here, then YOU must make the effort, NOT ME!

    In other countries if I wanted to live there I would have to change my ways to fit in. People should have to make the effort to fit in properly. Not this BS of "Ok i'm here, where do I sign to get my check in the mail? My name is Jose Raul Gomes Gonzales Sanches Louise"
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.
    -Thomas Jefferson

    Laws are restrictive but sometimes necessary to maintain a civil society. Rights are nonrestrictive but are always necessary to maintain a free society.

  13. #57
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    Well, as a govt employee, I hereby change your name to Backwards McCloseminded. I assume you're good with that - send me all your official documents so that my omnipotent and infallible colleagues can rectify your unfortunate misnomer.

    Man, for a forum dedicated to the preservation of one freedom, there are many here that are extremely rabid about taking away the freedoms of others...
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  14. #58
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    re: atctimmy - on official language

    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    This is a well written and nicely articulated argument and I agree with you in many ways. I just wonder where the madness will end if we don't draw a line in the sand. Once it is in writing that English is the official language of the US we can put to rest allot of unneeded hullabaloo. I will concede to you though that there are always unintended consequences to more government legislation.
    I don't have a strong view on whether or not English should be our "official" language, but that is because I don't really know what that means in practical terms.

    I don't think making English our official language would change what folks speak in their homes.

    Our corporations would still be free to publish (free speech) and advertise however they saw fit. If they wanted to address an audience of "hearing impaired" individuals, they would still be able to use sign language.

    Our teachers would still have to somehow deal with kids who don't speak English. We can't just kick them out and let them remain uneducated because they come devoid of English skills.

    Last year I was in Holland. Most everyone there spoke English. Most spoke it very very well. No one seemed offended that I wanted to speak in English because I haven't a clue about their language. So, let's say Dutch is their "official" language (I'm just guessing, I don't know if they have designated it that way). What does that mean when I get to Immigration and Customs? Would it mean that because it is their official language they can't find someone to speak with me in my language as a visitor? Would we stop finding translators at international ports of entry if English was our "official" language?

    I am unaware of any US trial courts (maybe somewhere small claims) in which the proceedings are conducted in any language other than English. Maybe that is the way in which English should be our official language (all laws must be written in English and all trials must be conducted in English), but even then, our courts do provide translators. We can't get away from the necessity for translators.

    Similarly, I don't see any legislatures legislating in any language but English. I suppose it wouldn't hurt to legislate that legislation must be written in English.

    So, I don't really know what designating an official language would accomplish.

  15. #59
    Distinguished Member Array 21bubba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    Well, as a govt employee, I hereby change your name to Backwards McCloseminded. I assume you're good with that - send me all your official documents so that my omnipotent and infallible colleagues can rectify your unfortunate misnomer.

    Man, for a forum dedicated to the preservation of one freedom, there are many here that are extremely rabid about taking away the freedoms of others...
    I see your location listed as Bogota.I assume that is Bogota, Columbia? If it is I wonder in all seriousness you would answer one question. Have the natives changed their way of life to suit you or have you had to adapt to their customs and cultures?

  16. #60
    Senior Member Array AlexHassin's Avatar
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    Yes knowing passable English really helps you out in this country, look at all those ads in Spanish and Chinese dialects that ask do you want to learn/improve your English? people know that. Most people I have met make an attempt to learn it to a level where they can get by. However do I think its wrong for people to speak their native language to their peers, absolutely not,. Also why should some twit at immigration change your name. Seriously not like Mr. Smith there has an interesting name. In your own time you find a suitable name that you like and that fits the culture and people call you that. sometimes it comes to you but often someone else gives it to you in a strange way. I will admit being asked to name a person that got off a plane less than 48 hours ago is an interesting experience. I got the name Alex under very similar circumstances when I was traveling.

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