U.S. Border Patrol has resources to worry about a handful of hikers... - Page 2

U.S. Border Patrol has resources to worry about a handful of hikers...

This is a discussion on U.S. Border Patrol has resources to worry about a handful of hikers... within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by ctr You keep saying I don't have a clue, care to enlighten me? Got something specific, put it out there. If I ...

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Thread: U.S. Border Patrol has resources to worry about a handful of hikers...

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctr View Post
    You keep saying I don't have a clue, care to enlighten me? Got something specific, put it out there.

    If I had it my way...

    ...I would let the officers pre-emptively defend themselves.

    ...there would be zero illegal border crossings.

    ...I would round up all the illegals and send them home.

    ...we would have returned fire into Mexico for the shots that hit the US building.

    ...the illegal problem would have been dealt with a long time ago.
    I do agree with you.But at the start, thought you were coming at this in irresponsible way or just blowing smoke.Your list looks good to me.
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  2. #17
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    BTW -- the following was just posted on another list.

    The US has gotten very touchy about people crossing into the country
    anywhere other than an official crossing. They are actually building
    barriers in Derby Line,VT that divides the US side of town from the Canadian
    side. Relatives living a few houses apart on the same street can't visit one
    another without going through an official crossing which can take two hours.
    FWIIW -- My has nothing to do with the field agents. What I'm about is why are we doing these things and not building and enforcing a fence where it is needed.

    It's the Washington DC folk who
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  3. #18
    Member Array VTLO910's Avatar
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    I feel bad for the hiker who lost his way and unintentionally crosses the border, hopefully it is just a measure to make more awareness at the border and not so much to punish those with no ill intent. Good management with Border Patrol will likely make the difference in this.

    The Southern border, they get rounded up, printed, processed, and tossed back to Margaritaville.

    But don't sit back and think that the U.S. does not have a problem at the Northern Border Either...

    Heroin, Cocaine, Marijuana are the main drugs coming from the South... Ecstasy and a few other choice drugs are coming from Europe and down through Canada...

    Terrorist also think that using Canadian passports will get them into the U.S. easier. While someone would not typically bat an eye at a Canadian, it is still attempted, and thwarted.

    U.S. Customs & Border Protection, which comprises of the Border Patrol, Field Operations, and the Air and Marine Units must be vigilant on all borders, by land and by sea, North and South. Unfortunately, at times, it makes for inconvenience of U.S. Citizens while in performance of the what they do...

    All anyone can do is be understanding and supportive, knowing they they have our best interest in mind.
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  4. #19
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    You can't have it any other way if you want a secure border.
    I havenít heard any of the journalists who volunteered to be waterboarded asking to have their fingernails wrenched out with pliers, or electrodes attached to their genitals.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agave View Post
    US Citizens can be charged with improper importation of merchandise, but not unlawful entry.
    However:

    TITLE 19 - CUSTOMS DUTIES
    CHAPTER 4 - TARIFF ACT OF 1930
    SUBTITLE III - ADMINISTRATIVE PROVISIONS
    Part II - Report, Entry, and Unlading of Vessels and Vehicles

    Sec. 1459. Reporting requirements for individuals

    STATUTE:

    (a) Individuals arriving other than by conveyance
    Except as otherwise authorized by the Secretary, individuals
    arriving in the United States other than by vessel, vehicle, or
    aircraft shall -
    (1) enter the United States only at a border crossing point
    designated by the Secretary
    ; and

    (2) immediately -

    (A) report the arrival, and

    (B) present themselves, and all articles accompanying them
    for inspection;
    to the customs officer at the customs facility designated for
    that crossing point.


    ....

    (c) Individuals arriving by unreported conveyance
    Except as otherwise authorized by the Secretary, individuals
    aboard a conveyance the arrival in the United States of which was
    not made or reported in accordance with the laws or regulations
    referred to in subsection (b) of this section shall immediately
    notify a customs officer and report their arrival, together with
    appropriate information concerning the conveyance on or in which
    they arrived, and present their property for customs examination
    and inspection.

    (d) Departure from designated customs facilities
    Except as otherwise authorized by the Secretary, any person
    required to report to a designated customs facility under
    subsection (a), (b), or (c) of this section may not depart that
    facility until authorized to do so by the appropriate customs
    officer.

    (e) Unlawful acts
    It is unlawful -

    (1) to fail to comply with subsection (a), (b), or (c) of this
    section;

    (2) to present any forged, altered, or false document or paper
    to a customs officer under subsection (a), (b), or (c) of this
    section without revealing the facts;

    (3) to violate subsection (d) of this section; or

    (4) to fail to comply with, or violate, any regulation
    prescribed to carry out subsection (a), (b), (c), or (d) of this
    section.


    (f) Civil penalty
    Any individual who violates any provision of subsection (e) of
    this section is liable for a civil penalty of $5,000 for the first
    violation, and $10,000 for each subsequent violation
    .

    (g) Criminal penalty
    In addition to being liable for a civil penalty under subsection

    (f) of this section, any individual who intentionally violates any
    provision of subsection (e) of this section is, upon conviction,
    liable for a fine of not more than $5,000, or imprisonment for not
    more than 1 year, or both.
    Hum!
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    I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL.

    I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.

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  6. #21
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    Dave H. The section you cited is related to Customs, and is different from Immigration and entry. What Agave was telling us is that a US Citizen can not be prosecuted solely for entering. They can be prosecuted for failing to present themselves for Customs Inspection. It is a fine distinction, and maybe not always an evident distinction, but Immigration and Customs are two entirely different matters, and Immigration law does not apply to US Citizens because they are not immigrating; they are re-entering, or coming home.

  7. #22
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    Well sort of

    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Dave H. The section you cited is related to Customs, and is different from Immigration and entry. What Agave was telling us is that a US Citizen can not be prosecuted solely for entering. They can be prosecuted for failing to present themselves for Customs Inspection. It is a fine distinction, and maybe not always an evident distinction, but Immigration and Customs are two entirely different matters, and Immigration law does not apply to US Citizens because they are not immigrating; they are re-entering, or coming home.
    Individuals arriving other than by conveyance
    Except as otherwise authorized by the Secretary, individuals
    arriving in the United States other than by vessel, vehicle, or
    aircraft shall -
    (1) enter the United States only at a border crossing point
    designated by the Secretary
    is what my OP was about -- enter the United States other than at a border crossing point designated by the Secretary.

    If there is "is a fine distinction" to be made, it's in Agave's distraction/hijack of the OP issue.
    Μολὼν λαβέ

    I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL.

    I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.

    Veni, Vidi, Velcro

  8. #23
    Distinguished Member Array nutz4utwo's Avatar
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    there is a fair amount of drug smuggling from Canada to the USA. There are even some gangs taking hold in Washington State. Still, I doubt they carry the merchandise the loooong way through the forest via hiking trails.

    Most hikers are the nicest people on earth!
    "a reminder that no law can replace personal responsibility" - Bill Clinton 2010.

  9. #24
    Senior Member Array kavity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Thank you. It is always good when we get authoritative responses to misinformation.
    He is mistaken. USC's can get charged with entry without inspection (the same charge that some illegals get sent back on). Everyone has to present themselves to be inspected when entering the United States.

    Also, that story is sensationalist anti-border patrol non-sense. Yes, its illegal to cross without inspection. No, the border patrol isn't going to fine you $5000 dollars. I'd imagine they would tell you "bad usc bad!" and send you on your way after inspecting you, or, at most, take you to the nearest Port of Entry and have you inspected there.

    Though, I am not completely sure how the northern border guys work. Border Patrol Agents are a patriotic bunch and don't make a hobby of harassing US Citizens and charging them $5000 for what amounts to a simple mis-understanding of the law. In this case I am sure something can and will be worked out with regard to the hiking trail.

  10. #25
    Distinguished Member Array Agave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kavity View Post
    He is mistaken. USC's can get charged with entry without inspection (the same charge that some illegals get sent back on). Everyone has to present themselves to be inspected when entering the United States.
    Heh. I'm not mistaken. USCs are not inspected. Aliens are inspected. The above statute applied to aliens, not to US Citizens.

    United States Citizens are subject to "examination." They are never subject to "inspection." And yes, there is a difference.
    The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.

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  11. #26
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    Agave please explain further

    Quote Originally Posted by Agave View Post
    Heh. I'm not mistaken. USCs are not inspected. Aliens are inspected. The above statute applied to aliens, not to US Citizens.

    United States Citizens are subject to "examination." They are never subject to "inspection." And yes, there is a difference.
    Agave,

    Please explain this further. I know Patti posted stuff about this one time but I don't recall the details and it is important stuff for us to understand.

  12. #27
    Distinguished Member Array Agave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Agave,

    Please explain this further. I know Patti posted stuff about this one time but I don't recall the details and it is important stuff for us to understand.
    "Examination" is determining citizenship or alienage of an individual. I show to to a POE and am determined to be a citizen of the United States and from an immigration standpoint, it is done; I'm free to go as I am in my own nation where I have the absolute right to be.

    "Inspection" is determining the lawfulness of the presence of a person after that person has been determined to be an alien. My friend Jose shows up to a POE, is examined and is determined to be an alien to the United States. Then he is inspected to determine that he has permission to be in the United States.
    The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.

    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor, Tennessee Certified Instructor

  13. #28
    Senior Member Array kavity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agave View Post
    "Examination" is determining citizenship or alienage of an individual. I show to to a POE and am determined to be a citizen of the United States and from an immigration standpoint, it is done; I'm free to go as I am in my own nation where I have the absolute right to be.

    "Inspection" is determining the lawfulness of the presence of a person after that person has been determined to be an alien. My friend Jose shows up to a POE, is examined and is determined to be an alien to the United States. Then he is inspected to determine that he has permission to be in the United States.
    You are correct. I misspoke. In my mind the two terms are interchangeable though legally they are not synonyms. Are you a PA?

  14. #29
    Distinguished Member Array Agave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kavity View Post
    You are correct. I misspoke. In my mind the two terms are interchangeable though legally they are not synonyms. Are you a PA?
    I was a PA.
    The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.

    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor, Tennessee Certified Instructor

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