How Much Tax Should You Pay for Your Jack Daniels?

This is a discussion on How Much Tax Should You Pay for Your Jack Daniels? within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; I saw a news story tonight talking about Lynchburg, TN and Jack Daniels whiskey. I'm not here to give a commentary about drinking nor do ...

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Thread: How Much Tax Should You Pay for Your Jack Daniels?

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    Distinguished Member Array DefConGun's Avatar
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    How Much Tax Should You Pay for Your Jack Daniels?

    I saw a news story tonight talking about Lynchburg, TN and Jack Daniels whiskey. I'm not here to give a commentary about drinking nor do I think this thread needs to go in that direction. The purpose of this post has to do with the fact that the news story stated that circa 60% of the price you pay when you buy a bottle of Jack Daniels is tax in one form or another. Lynchburg isn't, however, satisfied with that and wants to add another $10.00/barrel tax. Some citizens, supposedly, feel that the distillery has deep pockets and given they can afford it, there's no reason as to why they shouldn't. This stands irrespective of Jack Daniels being responsible for the majority of the town's wealth in the jobs and taxes it already provides. Some fear that JD may pull out if the taxes get to be too expensive while others are banking on the distillery never pulling out because they're image is so closely interrelated with the community, etc.

    We have already had a thread recently talking about a large number of our jobs going across seas because of taxes and an inclement climate that is adverse to businesses. IMO, lets stop punishing successful businesses and support a free market; a characteristic of our country that used to be a differentiating factor. To me as a consumer, it won't make a difference to me one way or the other given that I don't buy their product. To me as an American, however, it will make a huge difference since it is the culmination of businesses (big and small) that impact our economic prosperity that we have in this country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DefConGun View Post
    I saw a news story tonight talking about Lynchburg, TN and Jack Daniels whiskey. I'm not here to give a commentary about drinking nor do I think this thread needs to go in that direction. The purpose of this post has to do with the fact that the news story stated that circa 60% of the price you pay when you buy a bottle of Jack Daniels is tax in one form or another. Lynchburg isn't, however, satisfied with that and wants to add another $10.00/barrel tax. Some citizens, supposedly, feel that the distillery has deep pockets and given they can afford it, there's no reason as to why they shouldn't. This stands irrespective of Jack Daniels being responsible for the majority of the town's wealth in the jobs and taxes it already provides. Some fear that JD may pull out if the taxes get to be too expensive while others are banking on the distillery never pulling out because they're image is so closely interrelated with the community, etc.

    We have already had a thread recently talking about a large number of our jobs going across seas because of taxes and an inclement climate that is adverse to businesses. IMO, lets stop punishing successful businesses and support a free market; a characteristic of our country that used to be a differentiating factor. To me as a consumer, it won't make a difference to me one way or the other given that I don't buy their product. To me as an American, however, it will make a huge difference since it is the culmination of businesses (big and small) that impact our economic prosperity that we have in this country.
    Lots of towns in Ohio would give them huge tax incentives to move here.

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    VIP Member Array high pockets's Avatar
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    On one hand, 1 barrel of whiskey makes approx 300 fifths of 80 proof liquor. In that regard, the increase per bottle of Jack would be approximately .033 cents per bottle.

    On the other hand, I watched the Seagram's distillery in Lawrenceburg, Indiana close because of this same thing. The city wanted to raise their taxes, so Seagram's just closed up and laid off over 2,000 people in a city of 25,000. If Lynchburg isn't careful, they could face the same thing.
    Last edited by high pockets; October 22nd, 2011 at 10:42 AM. Reason: corrected my math.
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    This is an all too real scenario when local communities needing additional revenue, often look towards the major businesses in the area for a tax hike. With a lot of communities feeling the pinch, desparate measures are implimented and with the usual disasterous results of a business going out of business or packing up and moving.

    It is a thing played out too many times and it doesn't work, but they still keep trying. Even if it is just a "few more cents" per bottle on their whiskey, after awhile, Jack Daniels may decide that Tennessee is no longer a good place to do business, close and move on. The Lynchburg community will be right back where they began, needing revenue, find another place to generate it and the cycle will repeat until all the business is gone. Sad, but that is how it goes.
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    How Much Tax Should You Pay for Your Jack Daniels?
    How about none? I'm no hardcore drinker, but the alcohol isn't really at issue. I shouldn't have to be penalized for producing something for my own or anyone elses use. The entire concept of taxing producers of anything for any reason, let alone the so called "sin taxes" is ludicrous. I hope JD BANKRUPTS every last one of the scheming, conniving, EVIL, moochers and looters.

    Then again, I come from a family of mighty fine rotgut producers(historically speaking that is - RIP granddad) and I happen to believe we deserve to be free to keep and/or use anything we produce or the byproducts thereof whether it be alcohol or knitting needles.
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    I toured the distillery a few years ago (worth the trip, btw). The town that it's in is actually 'dry'. There is nothing there but the distillery.

    Once again, an example of killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.
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    As the calls go out for budget tightening in Washington, the money supply from the federal government to the state level shrinks. As the state money dries up, money to local municipalities shrinks along with it. Services are cut, libraries are closed, school systems merged, firefighters, teachers, and police denied raises and/or laid off. Every politician knows that raising property taxes will kill their chances for reelection, so the town leaders turn to the golden goose and ask it to increase egg production. Eventually, the goose gets tired and moves to another municipality that offers it huge tax incentives to make the move. Of course, that lost tax revenue must be recouped somewhere.

    We've already lost a lot of manufacturing in this country. Eventually, all of it will be gone. We'll lose technology superiority eventually also, because none of our students want to learn science and math. The immigrant minority population will eventually be the majority and our economy will look like Mexico where you have the wealthy and the wretched poor and very little in between. As government services at every level dry up due to lack of revenue, gangs and mobs will replace the rule of law. We're seeing the beginnings of that in flash mob looters and protestors occupying Wall St.

    The future doesn't look pretty from where I'm sitting. I think I'll pour a glass of Jack Daniels.
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    Taxes.

    I hate taxes.

    I hate politicians that think that raising taxes is the right answer. Obviously it isnt, but politicians for the most part are some of the stupidest people alive.

    Taxes are counterproductive.They always have been and they always will be. Some people support it because they are too lazy to look for a real answer. Other support them because they say that it wont affect them because they dont drink, so its not their problem, with out figuring out that if you tax a company into oblivion, that its just a matter of time until they pack up and go somewhere else where the taxes are lower.

    Its always the easy answer. Raise taxes. Raise them some more. In a year, when we decide that its not enough, we'll disguise the fact that we'll raise them again by calling it a "millage" increase. They'll say that the millage increase is only for a limited amount of time, that we'll get a chance to vote it down. It never happens that way though, because some financial crisis will see that the tax never goes away, it just goes to something else.

    Anyone that doesn't think that paying a 70% tax on anything isn't absolutely ridiculous is either an idiot or a total fool. It dosent matter what political party you are from, if you cant see it then you are part of the problem.

    With the educated idiots that we have in local,state and federal government, I don't see it ever getting any better.
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    VIP Member Array Gene83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Taxes.

    I hate taxes.

    I hate politicians that think that raising taxes is the right answer. Obviously it isnt, but politicians for the most part are some of the stupidest people alive.

    Taxes are counterproductive.They always have been and they always will be. Some people support it because they are too lazy to look for a real answer. Other support them because they say that it wont affect them because they dont drink, so its not their problem, with out figuring out that if you tax a company into oblivion, that its just a matter of time until they pack up and go somewhere else where the taxes are lower.

    Its always the easy answer. Raise taxes. Raise them some more. In a year, when we decide that its not enough, we'll disguise the fact that we'll raise them again by calling it a "millage" increase. They'll say that the millage increase is only for a limited amount of time, that we'll get a chance to vote it down. It never happens that way though, because some financial crisis will see that the tax never goes away, it just goes to something else.

    Anyone that doesn't think that paying a 70% tax on anything isn't absolutely ridiculous is either an idiot or a total fool. It dosent matter what political party you are from, if you cant see it then you are part of the problem.

    With the educated idiots that we have in local,state and federal government, I don't see it ever getting any better.
    I don't hate taxes. If you are going to have government, you have to supply it with revenue to operate. If you don't want government, then you are electing to go for mob rule or survival of the fittest. That may be fine and dandy as long as you are part of the mob and one of the fit. When you no longer are, that idea probably won't appeal to you.

    So, in my opinion, government and taxes are necessary evils. We have to have them. I just don't think we need as much government as we have. The bureaucracy is bloated at every level and the most desirable job in many communities is something "working for the government". Taxes need to be reduced, but in order to do that, the size of government needs to be reduced and that means eliminating departments, agencies, and throwing some of the bureaucrats with coveted government jobs out of work. As much as many politicians rail about the size of government, don't expect them to voluntarily give up their jobs. Look at the ones who were all for "term limit" until they got into office and changed their minds. I see tax money wasted every day. You probably do also. Maybe we should run government like a business and give department managers and agency heads bonuses based on how efficiently they utilize our tax dollars. What we have now sure isn't working.
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    Member Array Eaglebeak's Avatar
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    This is a very good 3-minute video that explains much of what's going on and why.

    Afterburner with Bill Whittle: Three and a Half Days - YouTube

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    Maybe we should run government like a business and give department managers and agency heads bonuses based on how efficiently they utilize our tax dollars.
    Now that is a novel idea and one that would work so well that we will never see it. Common sense and Goverment do not seem to coexist.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Now that is a novel idea and one that would work so well that we will never see it. Common sense and Goverment do not seem to coexist.
    I know. The challenge right now is that there is no real incentive for the politicians to change the status quo. They harrummph around and posture in public, but they still have jobs to go to every morning and those jobs pay well and come with excellent benefits. It's hard to find a politician at any level of government who is living barely at the poverty level and juggling bills to keep the lights turned on. Their government salary may not be that much, but campaign donations, jobs for family members from campaign donors, speaking fees, book tours, and all the other perks usually make them among the wealthiest members of the community. Since the wealthy put them where they are, the wealthy are naturally the ones that they take care of first, especially now that they are among the wealthy. Government works, for the most part, are pretty decent people. I've got family members that work for the government. Government workers would buy into the plan if it meant extra income for saving money.

    Politicians don't have an incentive to save money though. Every dollar of largesse from the government that they can distribute to their supporters is a dollar spent helping them get reelected and keeping that money train of theirs going. Politicians don't get reelected by refusing tax dollars that are being directed to their states or communities.
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    VIP Member Array Gene83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglebeak View Post
    This is a very good 3-minute video that explains much of what's going on and why.

    Afterburner with Bill Whittle: Three and a Half Days - YouTube
    It is a good video, a little simplistic, but good nonetheless. I grew up in homes that didn't have air conditioning. We weren't poor. Nobody else had air conditioning in their houses either. No air conditioning in the car either and horrors, we had to roll the windows up and down with a hand crank. The television was black and white and only got three channels. When you walked across the room to change channels, you had to readjust the rabbit ears. Families learned how to compromise and get along with each other because there was only one television in the house. We didn't have video games. We had make believe. There were no computers or cell phones. It almost seems primitive these days.

    Yet, anywhere in the country, you can turn on television and find reruns of the Andy Griffith show. Mayberry in the late 50's and early 60's. It was a simpler time and many of us would trade this modern life to go back and live that era once again.
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    Distinguished Member Array Doghandler's Avatar
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    If business leaders were more benevolent we wouldn't need taxation - or government for that matter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by high pockets View Post
    On one hand, 1 barrel of whiskey makes approx 300 fifths of 80 proof liquor.
    I think you are assuming a 53 gal barrel; I don't think your calculations takes into account the "angle's share", or the amount of loss due to evaporation, a fine aged bourbon (which JD AIN'T) can loose anywhere from 25% for a young bourbon (~5 years) to nearly 75% for a 17 year old.

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