Really Confused about Dogs for Defense

This is a discussion on Really Confused about Dogs for Defense within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Mike...you really do know your dogs. Great flawless advice. "Also, if I have a protective dog living outside and someone comes prowling around and my ...

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  1. #16
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    Mike...you really do know your dogs. Great flawless advice.

    "Also, if I have a protective dog living outside and someone comes prowling around and my dog bites him or attacks him, I'm assuming I would be held responsible. I'm also assuming that this could lead to liability issues on a similar scale similar to me shooting an intruder breaking into my house? If these assumptions are true, then is it even worth having a guard dog, given the gravity of potential liability issues?"

    Yes, you will be held legally liable & responsible for the actions of your dog. There has been legal precedent set these days that if your dog (for instance) kills a child that wanders onto your property then you could actually be facing a murder charge.

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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    Mike...you really do know your dogs. Great flawless advice.

    "Also, if I have a protective dog living outside and someone comes prowling around and my dog bites him or attacks him, I'm assuming I would be held responsible. I'm also assuming that this could lead to liability issues on a similar scale similar to me shooting an intruder breaking into my house? If these assumptions are true, then is it even worth having a guard dog, given the gravity of potential liability issues?"

    Yes, you will be held legally liable & responsible for the actions of your dog. There has been legal precedent set these days that if your dog (for instance) kills a child that wanders onto your property then you could actually be facing a murder charge.
    Gotcha. So in other words, ALOT of responsibility goes along with owning one of these dogs.

    I have to admit after looking at ANIMAL RESORTS AND TRAINING CENTER in Frankfort, KY that I'm finding myself very intrigued by the whole matter.

  4. #18
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    Follow the advice from Mike 1956. You can own a great, obedient, personal protection dog that can also be an integral and trusted part of your family. It's all in the training. Dogs are amazing and intuitive, smart, creatures. They can do their job when called upon to do it and still be affectionate and loving to you and yours.
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  5. #19
    Distinguished Member Array DefConGun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    Follow the advice from Mike 1956. You can own a great, obedient, personal protection dog that can also be an integral and trusted part of your family. It's all in the training. Dogs are amazing and intuitive, smart, creatures. They can do their job when called upon to do it and still be affectionate and loving to you and yours.
    In complete agreement here. I am definitely going to follow Mike 1956s advice if I decide to move forward with this endeavor. I'm thinking I'm really wanting to bring a new friend home soon and am going to continue to look into this so that I don't make any rash decisions.

  6. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by DefConGun View Post
    This trainer is in Frankfort, KY...not far from me.
    18 weeks, not months. They are demonstrating basic bite development work ( in a shepherd, taking its bite from 300-400 psi to around 800) and prey drive development. Shepherds, as shown in the vid and attested to by NY27, can be great dogs for this type of work, and are one of the most popular. Dobermans, rotties, and many of the other herding and working breeds can also be trained along these lines effectively. Temperament testing at 7-8 weeks old can be a very good indicator of the types of work and training each puppy will excel at.
    There are five basic personalities of dogs: happy-go-lucky; hyper; shy and undersocialized; aggressive; and fear-biter. Some dogs will manifest basic traits from more than one catagory, and are referred to as multi-personality. About 2% of all dogs can be characterized as psychopathic. For personal protection/family dogs, hgl and hyper tend to be the best two for the average owner.
    A competent trainer/breeder can help you sort all that out. Don't be shy about asking lots of questions, or about being comfortable with their goals, objectives, priorities and training philosophies. Much like the gun world, the dog world attracts and supports all types who operate at all points on the spectrum. It is a huge investment and years-long commitment and responsibility, so it is essential to get it all right first time out.
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  7. #21
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    There are two books by the same author that you should read. Richard Wolters has written serval books about retriever training, but he has also written a couple that will specifically address some of your concerns. "Home Dog" and Family Dog". I personally own a copy of "Home Dog" and have read "Family Dog" several times.

    It would be well worth your time and money to read these before you decide to acquire a pup.

  8. #22
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    The only thing that IMOP is a bad idea is relying on a wireless fence system. While a majority of dogs can be trained to stay within the systems boundries, there are those who cannot/willnot stay inside the system. Also a wireless system does nothing to keep anyone from coming on to your property(small children,salespeople,meter readers.etc.) A good fence allows your dog free run of your property at any time and at a moments notice (no collar to put off/on,or battries to go dead at the worst time). A fence also keeps unwanted people off your property and gives both you and your dog an extra level of securty(no one can easly attack you or you dog with out first climing the fence). Other that that all the advice given by the other members sounds very well thought out and professional. The only other thing that I would consider based on my personal experence is to get your dog a companion (another dog) It keeps them occupied and helps with socialization. Good luck on making a decision on your new best friend(s)
    Last edited by chp1911; November 12th, 2011 at 11:21 AM. Reason: spellig correction

  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DefConGun View Post
    I'm looking up "protection dogs" now but I'm not sure if I'm looking for the right thing that would be suitable for my situation. I'm finding sites that look like they are dealing with dogs trained for police or military work. Training for these dogs are estimated to be between $25,000-$35,000 and there was another adult dog for sell for $7,500.

    If I am interested in a companion/personal protection dog, what should I expect to pay for a dog that is trained to protect in the capacity of civilian situations, etc.?
    I've always trained my dogs to "some" level of PP. In the past 40yrs of experience, I have only purchased "3" dogs (1dob & 2 GSD). All other dogs have been rescued adoptees for shelters or rescue organizations. The THREE best dogs I have ever owned have all been adopted APBTs.

    I might add; my BEST dogs were all over 1yr old when I adopted. So, getting a puppy does NOT guarentee any success. I personally like working with a dog that is at least 6mo old before I start anything. Even a dog that is two yrs old+ can become GREAT dogs. (I suggest seeking a shelter or rescue organization in your area.)

    If you do your part, you can have a GREAT dog!

    I suggest doing a google search for Personal Protection clubs in your area. You may find someone who can help you obtain a good pup; then mentor you in how to train him.

    I will add one more thing-
    If you want "ANY" kind of guard or PP dog, you need to be willing to keep them inside with your family or in an outside kennel. (at the very least)

    Defense dogs do NOT need to be left to they're own devices EVER!

    -

  10. #24
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    Dogs are social animals. Typically they will protect the Alpha / leader of the group, or other members of the group, from outside threats. They will alert the group, to unknowns especially if they consider it potentially a threat.

    Dogs also like having a "job" and "purpose " in life , especially if it involves you and activity. Otherwise, they may determine one for themselves.... and may decide it's chewing up all of your shoes.

    For the absolute best ALERT animal for outside, get ducks. Anything that doesn't belong there, they will alert you ..... really really well. They will raise hell until you deal with it. Put a 5 gal bucket outside, then move it, the ducks will squawk and let you know that is not where the bucket is supposed to be..... until a couple days go by and they figure out it is apparently no threat. Just make sure your neighbor is not a recent immigrant from China, or your ducks might disappear.
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  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    Dogs are social animals. Typically they will protect the Alpha / leader of the group, or other members of the group, from outside threats. They will alert the group, to unknowns especially if they consider it potentially a threat.

    Dogs also like having a "job" and "purpose " in life , especially if it involves you and activity. Otherwise, they may determine one for themselves.... and may decide it's chewing up all of your shoes.

    For the absolute best ALERT animal for outside, get ducks. Anything that doesn't belong there, they will alert you ..... really really well. They will raise hell until you deal with it. Put a 5 gal bucket outside, then move it, the ducks will squawk and let you know that is not where the bucket is supposed to be..... until a couple days go by and they figure out it is apparently no threat. Just make sure your neighbor is not a recent immigrant from China, or your ducks might disappear.
    My old boss used to have a bunch of ducks and anything happened around his farm and the ducks were there but the peacocks were much louder and they would let you know if someone was coming down the half mile driveway as soon as they turned to come down it

  12. #26
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    I highly recommend The Monks of New Skete "The Art of Raising a Puppy" and "How to Be Your Dog's Best Friend." Not for defense training necessarily, but to really understand how dogs function with and respond to humans.

  13. #27
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    Dogs are NOT A DEFENSIVE WEAPON. They are a EARLY WARNING SYSTEM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1 old 0311 View Post
    Dogs are NOT A DEFENSIVE WEAPON. They are a EARLY WARNING SYSTEM.
    They can be not only a defensive weapon, but an offensive weapon as well.

  15. #29
    Distinguished Member Array DefConGun's Avatar
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    Alot of great info in this thread, thank you everyone for all of the great ideas. I never even knew that there could be a club that I could possibly get in contact with for help. I had ducks when I was a kid, they were great. I love the little guys, if I could only keep them at the house.

  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by DefConGun View Post
    Alot of great info in this thread, thank you everyone for all of the great ideas. I never even knew that there could be a club that I could possibly get in contact with for help. I had ducks when I was a kid, they were great. I love the little guys, if I could only keep them at the house.
    I saw a momma Canadian Goose attack a guy one time.
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