The face (and belly) of Occupy - Page 3

The face (and belly) of Occupy

This is a discussion on The face (and belly) of Occupy within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; 1. It doesn't take ANY courage to modify your appearance in order to please/impress a group of people you're trying to be part of. That's ...

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  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array jumpwing's Avatar
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    1. It doesn't take ANY courage to modify your appearance in order to please/impress a group of people you're trying to be part of. That's called conformity, and it doesn't matter how vastly it differs from any traditional "norm".

    2. There's absolutely NO way to tell what this "individual" (and I use the term ironically) believes or stands for. The only safe guess is that he hasn't put much thought into it.
    "The flock sleep peaceably in their pasture at night because Sheepdogs stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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  2. #32
    Senior Member Array Zsnake's Avatar
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    Well, my 2 cents....

    How has The U.S.of A. existed for 236 years? Under the Capitalist System. The wealthy were either luckier or smarter or harder working than the average Joe. They, one way or the other, EARNED their wealth.
    YOU want the wealth, well come up with a better mousetrap or toil and sweat and save and invest like or forefathers did. Don't come crying to the Big Boys table with your hand out saying "Gimmie, Gimmie".
    I'm poorer than many and richer than many, but I did it MYSELF.
    It all goes back to personal responsibility.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunsnroses View Post
    I don't agree. If a person or corporation has made millions off the system and the politics they bought, they should be more in debted to America then the person that is more then likely your customer at some point It should be totally based on income because that is a definate number of what you have gained and taken out of America. You can claim what you put back by "deductions" Duh!

    It is very difficult for me to understand how some people want to go back to the King/peasant form of government. Do you all think you are going to be "kings" or something? What is it that actually convinced you to think this way?
    I am curious what convinced you to think that there is a fixed pot of wealth in an economy. The whole purpose of capitalism is to increase the wealth in the economy by producing things that people want. Your supposition that there is a fixed amount of wealth is perpelxing.

    I don't see going back to a Constitutional form of government, getting rid of all the things the feds do that are not supported by the Consitution, as being a king/serf set-up in any way.
    Naufragia and MotorCityGun like this.
    It's the Land of Opportunity, not the Land of Entitlements - Vote America!!!

    "When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny." Thomas Jefferson

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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by kapnketel View Post
    So you would agree that all welfare, unemployment benefits, Medicare and Medicaid be eliminated? Then failure would have very real consequences.



    So you are one of those that believes the wealthy do not desreve or earn their wealth? The VP got a bonus because he earned it by handling hundreds of milions of dollars of his clients' funds, maintaining if not increaseing the shareholders stock value and significantly working towards keeping thousands of his fellow workers employed. The janitor, while probably a very nice fellow, did not do that.



    Really? I agree that there are some bad actors and we can all point to examples of bad behavior, remember that a corporation is merely a shell operated by normal everyday people like you and me. Just because you are a corporate employee you do not become Dr. Evil. Also, the stockholders are you and me, either by direct ownership or via our 401K's, etc. Corporations do nothing independent of the people who work there. I have worked for several internation al corporations (still do) and I have never seen anydishonest or criminal behavior in 30 years by any of my companies. In fact, at the slightest hint of imprpiety things get escalated very quickly.
    1. Yes. I'm saying let it ALL go. If you can't make it on your own, you lose...and maybe die. It sounds harsh because it is. Evolution is about natural selection and when people who don't or can't produce have (many) more children than those who do, we as a species are screwed. I'll even use MYSELF as an example. I had scoliosis as a child. If it wasn't treated, I'd be dead right now. Because he had insurance, it was and now I'm free to pass that gene on. I know that the physical is only a part of our existence (thank you Stephen Hawking), but it applies to the less intelligent and the lazy as well. If you had no safety net, you'd adapt or die as nature intended.

    2. I'm not saying he didn't earn it. I'm saying he earned it by having preferential access to the system. If he makes money for the company, he gets a bonus. If he doesn't, the taxpayers bail him out until he does make money....and then he gets a bonus,but that's beside the point. The point I was trying to make is that, past a certain point, the rich don't contribute as much to the middle and lower class economies as people think. And how well do you think he'd "make" that money without all the people beneath him. I'm not saying he doesn't deserve something...but could he do it in am unsanitary office with no-one to answer the phones? Those people deserve their fair share of the profits too.

    3. Seriously? If many corporations had their way they wouldn't spend a nickle on anything that didn't generate profit. I'm not saying they're "evil" but, by nature, they are geared to make as much as they CAN...regardless of consequences. We'd have unsafe products everywhere because safety features cost money. They'd also have enough money to put on a media campaign to brainwash the less intelligent. Have you ever watched a commercial and thought "Well that's the dumbest thing I've ever seen"? That commercial is there because it WORKS. For every intelligent person that sees through the dumb stuff, there are thousands that do things "because I saw it on the TV".

    For everyone who wants to make up some story about who the guy in the photo is or is not, what he thinks or does not, please understand what I was trying to say. No matter his reasons, he intentionally dressed himself for his own reasons. He chose to appear in a manner that isn't even close to the societal norm. I don't care if he's making a statement or trying to fit into his group of friends. He expressed himself in his own way, for his own reasons. Just because it doesn't suit you doesn't make it wrong. Trying to make up reasons to justify prejudices, however, is.
    I think I should be able to claim my guns as dependents on my taxes. I have to clothe them, feed them, clean them when they get dirty, keep them safe from bad people...

  5. #35
    Member Array onehit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Okemo View Post
    That lady sure has a hairy belly.
    LOL it almost made me sick, btw new guy here

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunsnroses View Post
    I don't agree. If a person or corporation has made millions off the system and the politics they bought, they should be more in debted to America then the person that is more then likely your customer at some point It should be totally based on income because that is a definate number of what you have gained and taken out of America. You can claim what you put back by "deductions" Duh!

    It is very difficult for me to understand how some people want to go back to the King/peasant form of government. Do you all think you are going to be "kings" or something? What is it that actually convinced you to think this way?
    I don't disagree for a minute that our system needs a little tweaking, corruption has taken its toll. However, I'm not ready to throw the baby out with the bath water. I think for this discussion to move forward, we need to clarify if we are speaking about individual taxes or corporate taxes.

    I still think a flat rate is the way to go, for both corporate and individuals. No fuss, no muss, a flat percentage across the board. For individuals, their 10% (for sake of argument) is taken out of their paycheck right off the top. At the end of the year, the individual can audit the IRS if he feels the need to make sure he did not pay to much. Business taxes would obviously be a little more complicated than that, but essentially the same. They will have the option of paying quarterly or annually, and the tax comes off of net, not gross to avoid double taxation.

    That would also come with some serious welfare reforms. A time limit for everyone who does not have a serious/severe physical or mental handicap. Drug testing (at their own expense) for who receive any kind of public assistance.

    No more employer funded or government mandated health insurance. We go back to the way it was meant to be, and you will see the free market at work.

    No more free pass on illegal immigration. Get caught, you get sent to a work camp to pay off whatever your debt you racked up here. Also, federal prisons would be work camps. No need for able bodied people being punished to lay around and producing nothing.

    No more federal funding of a whole lot of programs to long to list here. The money and power will remain where it belongs; with the states. No more holding states hostage with threatening to end funding.
    MotorCityGun likes this.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  7. #37
    Member Array Aiko's Avatar
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    I still think I have the National Geographic with her on the cover :-o

  8. #38
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    I'll say what I said in another thread before. I disagree with pretty much everything they stand for, but you bet your a** I support their right to stand for it.
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    If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

  9. #39
    Distinguished Member Array kapnketel's Avatar
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    3. Seriously? If many corporations had their way they wouldn't spend a nickle on anything that didn't generate profit. I'm not saying they're "evil" but, by nature, they are geared to make as much as they CAN...regardless of consequences. We'd have unsafe products everywhere because safety features cost money. They'd also have enough money to put on a media campaign to brainwash the less intelligent. Have you ever watched a commercial and thought "Well that's the dumbest thing I've ever seen"? That commercial is there because it WORKS. For every intelligent person that sees through the dumb stuff, there are thousands that do things "because I saw it on the TV".
    Ah, the old misguided belief that people are tricked into buying things they do not want or need as opposed to the reality that companies make things because people want them. Volvo markets cars that are somewhat higher priced because of their alleged superior safety features. John Browning came up with a design that had a unique safety feature that was not mandated by the govenment and has done pretty well in the market place at a higher price partially because of that feature (sold by a corporation). As to other safety features, most exist because the various industries develop voluntary standards (ever hear of ANSI? UL?) and provide many products with a choice of safety devices in their product line to meet consumer demand. There it is, the demand word. Part of supply and demand, the basis of our economy.

    As to "brainwashing" the public, if you sell a piece of junk nobody wants you make trick a few into a purchase the first time, but you will not be in the market very long.

    Moderators take note-I worked a firearm into the fourth page of a discussion in a firearm forum...
    I'd rather be lucky than good any day

    There's nothing that will change someone's moral outlook quicker than cash in large sums.

    Majority rule only works if you're also considering individual rights. Because you can't have five wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for supper.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ksholder View Post
    Actually the problem is more acute than that. If Joe Public makes $35K per year, with a normal family and a small house, he likely pays $0 in income taxes. A big part of the problem is that roughly half of the country pays $0.00 in income taxes and a good portion of that group get a refund. Then they yell - the fat cats are not paying their fair share...
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  11. #41
    Ex Member Array F350's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jumpwing View Post
    1. It doesn't take ANY courage to modify your appearance in order to please/impress a group of people you're trying to be part of. That's called conformity, and it doesn't matter how vastly it differs from any traditional "norm".

    2. There's absolutely NO way to tell what this "individual" (and I use the term ironically) believes or stands for. The only safe guess is that he hasn't put much thought into it.
    I grew up in the 60s and 70s; all those anti-conformists of the time wore identical "uniforms"
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  12. #42
    Distinguished Member Array bigmacque's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 357and40 View Post
    Since taxing the uber wealthy was mentioned...

    Lets say that joe public makes $35k a year. Lets say he is taxed 25%. He pays $8750 in taxes

    Lets say joe wealthy makes $1.5 million a year and is taxed only 10%. He pays $150,000.

    I think Joe public needs to play catch up.

    And this from a guy that has never made 6 figures in a year.
    I don't make $1.5M a year, but I certainly make a lot more than $35K and have not yet figured out how to pay less than 38%, at least not legally and since I am a law abiding citizen I will pay my taxes legally. I also am part of a small company, part owner, that has created almost 400 jobs in the last ten years, and I'm still paying that 38% which this year will cost me close to $60,000.00 in taxes. Just how much more do you want out of me?

    I will continue to create jobs as I can, but I can't create them out of nothing. In the meantime I have to create a budget for all properties including the corporate overhead and I can't say anything about a lack of budgets on this board without violating rules about politics and postings.
    I'm in favor of gun control -- I think every citizen should have control of a gun.
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  13. #43
    Distinguished Member Array bigmacque's Avatar
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    I think some of the most dangerous assumptions are those that are going around amongst those who feel like the "uber"-wealthy and the greedy corporations are sending us all to the poor house. Assumptions like those are not founded in the facts of an economy as large and complex as ours.

    Here's a brain teaser: if our economy fails, who else's fails with it?

    Quit fearing the Chinese, they need us to need them to manufacture goods. Fear the politicians with no understanding of economics and what it takes to keep the machine going.
    357and40 likes this.
    I'm in favor of gun control -- I think every citizen should have control of a gun.
    1 Thess. 5:16-18

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigmacque View Post
    I think some of the most dangerous assumptions are those that are going around amongst those who feel like the "uber"-wealthy and the greedy corporations are sending us all to the poor house. Assumptions like those are not founded in the facts of an economy as large and complex as ours.

    Here's a brain teaser: if our economy fails, who else's fails with it?

    Quit fearing the Chinese, they need us to need them to manufacture goods. Fear the politicians with no understanding of economics and what it takes to keep the machine going.
    And fear the voters who keep voting them back into office on promise of more handouts.
    357and40 likes this.
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  15. #45
    Senior Member Array RemMod597's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ksholder View Post
    Actually the problem is more acute than that. If Joe Public makes $35K per year, with a normal family and a small house, he likely pays $0 in income taxes. A big part of the problem is that roughly half of the country pays $0.00 in income taxes and a good portion of that group get a refund. Then they yell - the fat cats are not paying their fair share...
    If his boss is on the up-and-up, then he IS paying income taxes. Pulled already before he gets his paycheck.

    The REAL issue is wasteful spending, not who is funding it with how much.


    The maximum effective range of an excuse is zero meters.

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