caveat for Mi bikers...

This is a discussion on caveat for Mi bikers... within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Smokin Joe's in Caledonia MI has a nice bike selection, clean showroom, and friendly sales people.... I bought my Victory Kingpin there... That said their ...

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Thread: caveat for Mi bikers...

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array Sheldon J's Avatar
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    Angry caveat for Mi bikers...

    Smokin Joe's in Caledonia MI has a nice bike selection, clean showroom, and friendly sales people.... I bought my Victory Kingpin there...

    That said their mechanic needs to go back to school!!!

    My new Kingpin had an issue... It would back fire through the intake and would stall intermittently!!! Hot cold, ran for 5 minute or for 3 hours, it would do it with the only warning is the tac would drop down a few hundred rpm's. It might do it several times today and not again for a week...

    The throttle advance (choke) was out of adjustment...
    .
    Their mechanic would reset the TPS and when that did not work, his suggestion was to put on a high performance exhaust system for a grand...

    For 3 years I took the bike there on a regular basis and complained.... It was never fixed with the Mechanic guessing....
    I even called Victory and complained about an incident where it stalled and dumped the wife and myself before he would attempt an fix...

    Now one trip to Planet Power Sports in Coldwater MI, (they are closer) and I tell them the story....
    They taxi us to town so we can relax and explore while they work on the bike..
    Turns out Smokin Jose had never entered one thing in the system about my issues!! Nada, ZIP, nothing...
    The Power sports mechanic kept it for over 5 hours. Turns out it was running way rich, the TPS was not synced to the Baro pressure or O2 sensor... now she runs like a champ, warms up quickly.

    Today I called Corp HQ and filed a complaint...

    Did this cause wash down damage to my upper cyl due to excessive fuel, don't know but I do know if you have issues stay away from Smokin Joe's!!!
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century

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  3. #2
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    Victory makes a nice bike (I really like the Kingpin - the new Indians are way-cool too), but this is why I ride a Harley now (prior to that, 30 years of jap bikes).

    Harleys are so ubiquitous, just about everybody knows how to work on them. There is so much published, I've learned to do almost all of the work myself.

    'Glad you found a good service shop. Ride safe.
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    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    As a professional mechanic i have no idea what it is like to be at the mercy of another tech. I have worked with many incompetents over the years and if i got rich would still work on my own machines. Modern electronics makes that a bit difficult for a hobbyist. My friends with Victorys are quite happy with them, one guy had the second one in CA and nearly wore it out before buying another.
    Flew to San Diego and bought a Suzuki Burgman 650 scooter for my wife, came home 500 miles yesterday mostly between 80 and 90 mph on the freeway. Fun toy, she may have trouble getting me off it.

  5. #4
    VIP Member Array Sheldon J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arborigine View Post
    As a professional mechanic i have no idea what it is like to be at the mercy of another tech. I have worked with many incompetents over the years and if i got rich would still work on my own machines. Modern electronics makes that a bit difficult for a hobbyist. My friends with Victorys are quite happy with them, one guy had the second one in CA and nearly wore it out before buying another.
    Flew to San Diego and bought a Suzuki Burgman 650 scooter for my wife, came home 500 miles yesterday mostly between 80 and 90 mph on the freeway. Fun toy, she may have trouble getting me off it.
    Yeah is is crazy the HP they can crank out of a small engine today.... My God Son bought an 750 Triumph, with more HP at the rear tire than most small cars have at the engine. But he tired of it quickly and ended up buying a Vegas 8 ball...

    HD old US company, AMF near destroyed them... but for the $$$ in my opinion a tad over the edge for what you get.

    I wanted reliable and American Iron when I retired, read a heap about Victory's before my purchase, even the HD rags could find nothing to complain about when they test rode them... and as a whole Polaris industries has one heck of a good reputation. Victory HQ was great, just is the place where I purchased it, and placed my trust in service was a huge let down.....
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century

  6. #5
    Distinguished Member Array kapnketel's Avatar
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    I ride a Victory Vision. They make a way superior bike but the dealer system is a tad weak.
    I'd rather be lucky than good any day

    There's nothing that will change someone's moral outlook quicker than cash in large sums.

    Majority rule only works if you're also considering individual rights. Because you can't have five wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for supper.

  7. #6
    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    I was judging bikes at a run back when Victories were new, the other judges didn't think it belonged in "American" classes. At the time there were more American parts in Victories and Goldwings than in Harleys. Polaris makes great machines, in the winter I ride Polaris 900 RMK long track. Great machine.

  8. #7
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WHEC724 View Post
    Harleys are so ubiquitous, just about everybody knows how to work on them. There is so much published, I've learned to do almost all of the work myself.
    You know there is a reason for that , don't ya ?? LMAO.

    OP:
    Most .. come from the factory set "lean" to meet the EPA standards, MPG, etc. By adjusting the TPS, they were riching it out... which is typical to get rid of back-firing when it's due to running too lean and to get rid of knocking. Hope you are using the right fuel for it as well. I don't know Victories, but dont' imagine they are any different than 99% of the bikes out there, and there is NO "setting it in sync with the O2 sensor" ..... that I've ever been aware of. The O2 sends info / signals to the ECM, and the ECM "adjusts" timing, mixture, etc. from there...... there is no way to "adjust it", unless you've added a fuel managment system that allows adjusting the mixtures, etc. So, sounds like you may have just had a bad 02 sensor, or they adjusted the TPS right in the first place. If they "guessed" where the TPS should be.... vs ... actually measured it and determined where the right spot was. Sounds like the first guys just richened it up and said "here, try this" .

    Now, if the TPS was running too rich ... and the 02 sensor was telling the ECM to richen up the mixture, you would have been really running rich. You can tell that by pulling your spark plug and just looking at it.

    Running rich, shouldn't harm it in any way except for ruining plugs, etc. ... although it may have left some carbon deposits in there that you can clean out by running a good (stress good) fuel cleaner thru the next tank of gas. Running it lean can harm it.... engine will run hotter and can burn up valves, etc. if it's too lean.
    I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
    Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."

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    VIP Member Array Sheldon J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    You know there is a reason for that , don't ya ?? LMAO.

    OP:
    Most .. come from the factory set "lean" to meet the EPA standards, MPG, etc. By adjusting the TPS, they were riching it out... which is typical to get rid of back-firing when it's due to running too lean and to get rid of knocking. Hope you are using the right fuel for it as well. I don't know Victories, but dont' imagine they are any different than 99% of the bikes out there, and there is NO "setting it in sync with the O2 sensor" ..... that I've ever been aware of. The O2 sends info / signals to the ECM, and the ECM "adjusts" timing, mixture, etc. from there...... there is no way to "adjust it", unless you've added a fuel managment system that allows adjusting the mixtures, etc. So, sounds like you may have just had a bad 02 sensor, or they adjusted the TPS right in the first place. If they "guessed" where the TPS should be.... vs ... actually measured it and determined where the right spot was. Sounds like the first guys just richened it up and said "here, try this" .

    Now, if the TPS was running too rich ... and the 02 sensor was telling the ECM to richen up the mixture, you would have been really running rich. You can tell that by pulling your spark plug and just looking at it.

    Running rich, shouldn't harm it in any way except for ruining plugs, etc. ... although it may have left some carbon deposits in there that you can clean out by running a good (stress good) fuel cleaner thru the next tank of gas. Running it lean can harm it.... engine will run hotter and can burn up valves, etc. if it's too lean.
    Actually the Victory has a cat converter, and it was running rich, very dirty plugs that the Mechanic at Joe's had changed twice (but he had no clue) I only run Shell or BP premium grade fuel.

    Joe's mechanic called yesterday, seems that Victory called him about my complaint, and he had my service dates wrong, how many times I had been there wrong, when I asked him about not entering it in the system his excuse was "we don't always do that" then he had the nerve to tell me that there was no indication of a issue!!!

    I reminded him of my issue that I told him about every time I was there and that should have been sufficient, and of my call to CO HQ the first time!!! This guys is clueless and full of excuses that bear no fruit!!! I thanked him for his call back then slamed it down in hie ear....
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century

  10. #9
    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    This guy sounds like a flake, and an abnormality in Victory's system. I have heard many praises for the dealer in Sacramento.
    Last edited by Arborigine; June 13th, 2012 at 01:24 PM.

  11. #10
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sheldon J View Post
    Actually the Victory has a cat converter, and it was running rich, very dirty plugs that the Mechanic at Joe's had changed twice (but he had no clue) I only run Shell or BP premium grade fuel.

    Joe's mechanic called yesterday, seems that Victory called him about my complaint, and he had my service dates wrong, how many times I had been there wrong, when I asked him about not entering it in the system his excuse was "we don't always do that" then he had the nerve to tell me that there was no indication of a issue!!!

    I reminded him of my issue that I told him about every time I was there and that should have been sufficient, and of my call to CO HQ the first time!!! This guys is clueless and full of excuses that bear no fruit!!! I thanked him for his call back then slamed it down in his ear....
    Sounds like he is clueless. I've seen a few dealers like that.... it sucks. Changing the plugs twice, is a rather LARGE clue.... and he didn't get that ? And said there was no indication ? Was he born that stupid, or did he work on it ?

    I had one who wanted to charge me $1000 dollars to check the electrical as to why the bike wouldn't start. Now, it did not go in there for "not starting" ..... LOL. I began pinning them down ... as they said it would start... and they'ld roll it out and it wouldn't (when he was sitting on it). I asked if they checked the plug of the gear position sensor (right under the seat) , and they said they wouldn't do that.... and need $1000 to cover going thru the bike.

    I went out and rolled the bike out of the shop, sat down on it... it wouldn't start.. they laughed.
    Then , I pulled the seat and found the sensor plug under the seat .... they had messed with the battery while in there... which the sensor sits next to.... plug seemed loose, unplugged it ... and then put the plug back together... tucked it where it should be (which it wasn't ) ... put seat on ... bike started.... turned it off, restarted it... did that 10 times.

    I asked them if they'ld pay me $1000 for fixing a problem they created when they were messing with the battery.
    I've never had a problem with it starting since I left there .... 6 mo's ago.

    My bet is... the just moved the TPS to make it richer, and never measured it or checked if it was correct at all. But, the 02 sensor with a CAT converter & TPS ... do not play off each other either... both send signals to the ECM which should automatically make all adjustments.
    You should also have an atmospheric / barometri / O2 sensor (measures air density / pressure).
    I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
    Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."

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