Swat team uses flashbang grenade against teen girl watching the food channel

This is a discussion on Swat team uses flashbang grenade against teen girl watching the food channel within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; You can't be too careful when looking for violent computer equipment, unless it's the wrong house. What would you do if you heard a flashbang ...

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    Swat team uses flashbang grenade against teen girl watching the food channel

    You can't be too careful when looking for violent computer equipment, unless it's the wrong house. What would you do if you heard a flashbang go off in your livingroom?



    Police: 'Threat matrix' dictated SWAT team response at Powell Avenue home Evansville Courier & Press
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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    Do the residents of the home have wifi that was poorly-secured? That could be how the postings came from their IP address without them knowing about it. Secure your wifi people.
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    Member Array lordofwyr's Avatar
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    I guess it all depends on what the threats were that were made and the criminal histories of the extended family members as to that amount of force on a computer seizure case.

    Remember, murderers, rapists and thugs sit around watching TV also, but that doesn't mean they won't shoot back.

    That said, the knock first was a bit self defeating if you are going to kick a door and throw a flashbang. The whole idea of that technique is taking the homeowner or occupant by surprise, which kinda went out the window with the knock/announce anyway....things that make one go Hmmmmm........
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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    I can understand the "knock, announce, enter" warrant this time. If there are legitimate threats against individuals or the department, that's something that needs to be addressed. Subpoena the website to get the IP address of the poster, subpoena the ISP to find who that IP belonged to at the time and bam, you have your address. The internet isn't as anonymous as people like to think.

    Given that the threats mentioned explosives, the possible possession of firearms can be inferred. The question is how seriously does one take threats written on the internet, but that's not a question I can answer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by paaiyan View Post
    Do the residents of the home have wifi that was poorly-secured? That could be how the postings came from their IP address without them knowing about it. Secure your wifi people.
    'Important piece of advice here folks.

    I know it's easier to not mess with those pesky encryption keys, but if you're running unsecured, any common dirtbag can pull up within range with a laptop in their car and surf/email whatever they want from your location. I can see two neighbor's unsecured wireless access points from my office as I type this.
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    Distinguished Member Array DontTreadOnI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WHEC724 View Post
    'Important piece of advice here folks.

    I know it's easier to not mess with those pesky encryption keys, but if you're running unsecured, any common dirtbag can pull up within range with a laptop in their car and surf/email whatever they want from your location. I can see two neighbor's unsecured wireless access points from my office as I type this.
    Also, do not use WEP encryption, as it is at the tail end of it's existence and can easily be cracked with a Google search and a free download of a program.
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    Illinois, color me surprised.
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    Not sufficiently familiar with how it all works, but I wouldn't be surprised if IPs can be spoofed.

    I know it is quite inexpensive and easy to obtain equipment to spoof phone numbers. I'm disinclined
    to believe the IPs aren't also spoofed.

    Also, lots of folks somehow manage to steal contact lists-- from places like Yahoo itself.
    They then send e-mails with everything from Nigerian scams to links to sites with malware.
    I've gotten a few of those recently appearing to come from a friend's mail e-mail.

    I'd not be at all surprised if the investigators never did identify the source of the threat, but
    assumed it came from the person whose name was associated with the header.
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    Senior Member Array highvoltage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Not sufficiently familiar with how it all works, but I wouldn't be surprised if IPs can be spoofed.

    I know it is quite inexpensive and easy to obtain equipment to spoof phone numbers. I'm disinclined
    to believe the IPs aren't also spoofed.

    Also, lots of folks somehow manage to steal contact lists-- from places like Yahoo itself.
    They then send e-mails with everything from Nigerian scams to links to sites with malware.
    I've gotten a few of those recently appearing to come from a friend's mail e-mail.

    I'd not be at all surprised if the investigators never did identify the source of the threat, but
    assumed it came from the person whose name was associated with the header.
    Maybe, but I'm leaning more towards drive by posting. Keep driving until you find an open network and then post from there. Much easier.

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    IP's can be spoofed easily as well as MAC Addresses can be blocked.
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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    Agreed, HV, which is why securing your wifi is important. Can even the most secure wireless networks be accessed? Eventually, but your run-of-the-mill piggybacking teenaged wannabe hacker/anarchist/authority-hater won't go to that trouble. He'll just try a few standard easy-to-guess passwords and move on.

    Hoppy, spoofing an IP would be significantly more difficult than spoofing a phone number. The infrastructure of the internet is orders of magnitude more complex than the phone system. Not saying it can't be done, just that it ain't easy. Most of the contact lists that get stolen are personal contact lists stolen from individuals, not from Yahoo or Gmail. Someone inadvertently downloads a trojan or other piece of malware onto their PC giving someone access to their stuff is the simple way to put it.
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    Using an improperly secured wifi is one possibility. Another, in fact much more likely possibility is that they had a malware infection or even an outright compromise that allowed their machine to be used as a remote host to send mail from. This is a real, and common, problem especially with servers.

    Here is a message for our friendly LEOs too, from someone whose job includes computer and network security: get the concept that IP address is absolutely identifiable information pointing you to a perpetrator out of your head! Unless you are dealing with a complete idiot, it is *extremely* easy to circumvent this to where more often than not your probably dealing with a victim, not a criminal.

    1) MAC addresses can be easily be changed, besides they do NOT pass a router.

    2)IP addresses aren't so easily spoofed as most communication, like email requires return data, which won't work if it is spoofed. However, it is easy to spoof email headers and make it look like it came from somewhere else. It is also easy to use a compromised host and send from that.

    3)Next up would be the use of TOR, which even the FBI has been thwarted by as it scrambles the IP information as well as encrypts the information. If you monitor them, all you will see is encrypted traffic to a random, probably foreign, location.

    4)Similarly would be the use of a non US based proxy access in a country that will thumb its nose at the US. Want to identify the IP holder, contact the state dept or Interpol.

    5)If you use TOR, be sure to run a relay node so you have traffic 24X7 rather than showing a pattern that can be correlated to your comings and goings (this is how I think either Sabu or Topiary of Anonymous was caught).

    6)A simple answer is to go to a local McDonalds and use their public wifi? Be sure to change your MAC as their logs may have it.

    7)As far as seizing computers, its worthless as there are these things called truecrypt and LUKS, which has thwarted the FBI even.



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    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    As pro-police as I am, the police are simply going to have to modify their tactics to accomodate the real world. This incident is very much akin to the whole SWATing paradigm.
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    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    Noway, those are definitely points to keep in mind, but as far as tracing the traffic back to the IP address of the folks in this story, I don't think they matter a huge amount. It's possible that someone was just trolling from their wifi, or possible that someone accessed the router through malware or open wifi and had set it up as a proxy for them to use from anywhere. You have good points all around, but regarding the issue of the posts originating from these folks' IP address, there aren't a huge number of ways that could have happened.
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    Wonder how this would have gone if someone in the house had fired at the police considering the recent change to Indiana's law on self defense.

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