Pay check

This is a discussion on Pay check within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Social Security was modeled after the "Railroad Retirement" plans way back by the FDR administration. Then, a future Gubmit got into it, raided it and ...

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  1. #76
    VIP Member Array JoJoGunn's Avatar
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    Social Security was modeled after the "Railroad Retirement" plans way back by the FDR administration.

    Then, a future Gubmit got into it, raided it and now look what we have.
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  3. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    I'd gladly opt out of social security if the government would like to refund my money...I'll even take it back without interest.
    They'd never hear another thing from me. We have 401's and other retirement, we can fend for ourselves. Heck, just give us 1/2 of what we've paid in and we'll call it even.
    You would be making a huge mistake to opt out. Most folks have lost net worth during the last decade. Fending for yourself
    sounds nice, and some can, but most can't. Even reasonably high earners who are still within the middle income range can't
    save enough. So you saved up 10 million at today's interest rates? Would you have enough income after taxation?
    What if you only saved up 2 million? You'd be living on less than what you are likely going to get from SS.

    All the factors in the retirement equation vary with the times, unfortunately. SS provides a steady reliable payment. There is
    a bottom below which you can't fall when your nice financial adviser leaves for Latin America.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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    Member Array mcgyver210's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Sorry about your misfortune, but it isn't the result of government theft. That is how all types of insurance operate.
    The risk is spread among the pool. Some win, some lose. Drive safely and you will be supporting the
    folks who don't.

    Your mom is an example of why the SS retirement age must not be raised and needs to be lowered back to 65.
    Raising it too high, or dinging the benefits for retiring at 62 too severely, does hurt many who have reached a point where
    they can't work very severely.
    First Mistake many make is calling this retirement, Insurance etc. As for my mother my point is there are many like her that paid into this system UN-voluntarily no matter how much they "STEAL" from any of us there will never be enough because they use it for other agendas & entitlements. So I stand by my original quote it is Government Theft since I don't have a choice.

    Insurance is a choice & you choose which company SS is a forced TAX same as ObamaCare that many of us will never get anything back or even come close to using what is forcibly taken.

    I would gladly give up any thing I have maybe coming to me even though I pay 100% of Social Insecurity being a Owner if I could choose my own investments for my retirement since I know I could do a better job as they could if they didn't use the stolen funds as their personal piggy bank.

    Not to mention they send notices out with the estimated amount I should receive back of my own money & it shrinks every time yet I keep paying more in since I make more money than I did? Social Insecurity is just another entitlement paid for by actual working people with a few of them actually getting a little of their own money back before they die.
    Everyone has an opinion & this is just mine sorry if it offends anyone.
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  5. #79
    Member Array linuss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Even reasonably high earners who are still within the middle income range can't
    save enough.

    You're confusing "can't" for "won't".

    They DON'T save enough. They sure as hell can, but that'd mean actually having a decent budget and sticking to it. I'm 24 and I have more money saved then a lot of the useless people in this country, and I'm considered a 'public servant'!
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    Last time we got one of those SS disclosure letters (a few months ago) they had added a caveat at the top. It said something like,"this is an estimate and funds are not guaranteed to be available". I wish I had kept it so I could give the exact wording.

    I bet in a few years SS will become available only after a "means test". At first the rich will be means tested out; then gradually the threshold will be lowered until people who make over 75k (plus or minus) will be out.
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  7. #81
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    Social Security, the worlds largest Ponzi Scheme.

    Why Social Security is a Ponzi Scheme - Forbes
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    Quote Originally Posted by linuss View Post
    You're confusing "can't" for "won't".

    They DON'T save enough. They sure as hell can, but that'd mean actually having a decent budget and sticking to it. I'm 24 and I have more money saved then a lot of the useless people in this country, and I'm considered a 'public servant'!
    I'd invite you to come back and talk to me when you are 55, but unfortunately I will surely be somewhere else by then.
    I'm going to stick with the word "can't ."
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    Last time we got one of those SS disclosure letters (a few months ago) they had added a caveat at the top. It said something like,"this is an estimate and funds are not guaranteed to be available". I wish I had kept it so I could give the exact wording.

    I bet in a few years SS will become available only after a "means test". At first the rich will be means tested out; then gradually the threshold will be lowered until people who make over 75k (plus or minus) will be out.
    It is already means tested; twice. In the first means test the amount you get varies greatly on what your lifetime
    average earnings adjusted for inflation were. A poor person gets a proportionally higher return than a middle income
    earner, who gets a higher return (as a % if lifetime average earnings) than folks who paid the maximum tax their whole life; I don't recall the tiered percentage
    but what you get as a % of your earnings is tiered, and favors the poor.

    The second means test applies to taxation of social security. Initially, till Ronnie, there was no income tax applied to
    SS payments. They then introduced an income tax on 50% of the payout for a single person with 18K of non-SS income
    and 36 K for a married couple (I could be off a tad on this second % but not by much). These were never adjusted for inflation, so now anyone with any IRA savings or pension or
    401K money who isn't flat out poor is going to be paying income tax on SS. Worse, once Congress got it in their heads that they can
    apply taxation to 50% of the payout Congress decided to apply it to 85% of the payout.

    So, who knows what future means testing might be added on, but the benefits I receive, minus the income taxation
    are nowhere near as generous as what my mom and dad received; and of course I had to work a full year longer to qualify
    for the full benefit.

    I think my SS income roughly covers the taxation on my other income to the near break even point. Or maybe looked at a different
    way, my SS income gets taxed at my highest marginal rate, and there is little net gain to me due to how the marginal rates are sliced.

    Please do note who was Prez when this taxation was instituted and the age for retiring was raised.

    The reason for the message you saw at the top of your notice is that Congress can pull the plug, literally. A present Congress is not bound by the acts of a prior Congress.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    I'd invite you to come back and talk to me when you are 55, but unfortunately I will surely be somewhere else by then.
    I'm going to stick with the word "can't ."
    Stick with it, the truth doesn't back you up.


    And I'm not speaking as some haughty-taughty spoon fed 24yo either, I'm speaking from experience as a Paramedic. I've been in far too many homes by lazy people who have an expensive car (leased or financed), big screen tv, all the gaming consoles, etc etc etc, with 5 kids running around with dirty as hell clothing on them, and them bitching and moaning that they can't afford their prescriptions or the ambulance bill or the ER bill.

    They CHOOSE to live beyond their means. Most of the issues could have been avoided with simple budgeting being taught to them, either by their school, or by their (also probably deadbeat) parents. There are exceptions, there are people that fall on hard times... those people are not a majority.



    Tell me I'm wrong.

  11. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by linuss View Post
    Stick with it, you are still incorrect.



    And I'm not speaking as some haughty-taughty spoon fed 24yo either, I'm speaking from experience as a Paramedic. I've been in far too many homes by lazy people who have an expensive car (leased or financed), big screen tv, all the gaming consoles, etc etc etc, with 5 kids running around with dirty as hell clothing on them, and them bitching and moaning that they can't afford their prescriptions or the ambulance bill or the ER bill.

    They CHOOSE to live beyond their means.



    Tell me I'm wrong.
    You are wrong. And btw, I'm a septuagenarian (go ahead and get your dictionary) who did stick with it. You are wrong.
    Again, I'd invite you to come back and discuss this when you have moved from 24 to 55, raised a family along the way etc.
    But as previously noted, I don't think I'll be here for the conversation.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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  12. #86
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    No, you are most defiantly wrong. People live beyond their means. Many of those people CHOOSE to live beyond their means. Otherwise, tell me how can a family making $50,000 be just fine and dandy, while someone making 3 times that moans about barely making ends meat?

    YOU, and people like you, are the reason the country has a huge debt: Spending beyond their means.



    This isn't an age thing, like you're trying to make it be. This is a common sense thing. Don't spend more than you bring in. No one has ever gone in to debt living by that rule. How can you possibly disagree with that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Please do note who was Prez when this taxation was instituted and the age for retiring was raised.

    The reason for the message you saw at the top of your notice is that Congress can pull the plug, literally. A present Congress is not bound by the acts of a prior Congress.
    Makes no difference who was the prez at any given time. SS will eventually be "for the poor"; only everyone else will pay into the system. Kind of like all the other entitlements.

    I do understand that there are so many people so dependent on the government that they could never make it on their own.
    It's either sad or disgusting, I can't decide which.
    It may be that your sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others.

    http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown...eaves%20office

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    Quote Originally Posted by linuss View Post
    Stick with it, the truth doesn't back you up.


    And I'm not speaking as some haughty-taughty spoon fed 24yo either, I'm speaking from experience as a Paramedic. I've been in far too many homes by lazy people who have an expensive car (leased or financed), big screen tv, all the gaming consoles, etc etc etc, with 5 kids running around with dirty as hell clothing on them, and them bitching and moaning that they can't afford their prescriptions or the ambulance bill or the ER bill.

    They CHOOSE to live beyond their means. Most of the issues could have been avoided with simple budgeting being taught to them, either by their school, or by their (also probably deadbeat) parents. There are exceptions, there are people that fall on hard times... those people are not a majority.



    Tell me I'm wrong.
    Some folks here suffer from Obamitis. It's main symptom is characterized by the inability to discern their fantasy from reality. Other symptoms include the overwhelming belief that they know what's best for other people and the ability to overlook any factual data that doesn't support their beliefs. Sadly, no treatment is yet available. The only thing we can do is hope that it'll clear up in about four years.
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    The present administration never makes mention of the fact they have been party to the downfall of SS. Based on today's deficits $2.7 trillion is just a drop in the bucket, but the fact is it was our money not theirs. If you are I were the managier someones trust and took $1.00 without the owner(s) permission, as the government has done, we would be jailed. If $2.7 trillion were to be stacked one $100 bill on top of the other the stack would be about 170.1 miles high.
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldshellback View Post
    I'm seeing a very measurable decrease...........
    Then release your waistband back to your belly!

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