The Liberty Amendment

The Liberty Amendment

This is a discussion on The Liberty Amendment within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; What do you make of this? I'm still mulling it over, but think it would be a lot harder to pull off than what they ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array Nate's Avatar
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    The Liberty Amendment

    What do you make of this? I'm still mulling it over, but think it would be a lot harder to pull off than what they describe.

    http://libertyamendment.org/


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    That sounds good but on reading and thinking about it I have my doubts. It would get rid of the FDA, USDA, OSHA, and EPA. While these agencies need to be downsized and streamed lined (mainly by making them unpoltical), I find them useful. I don't know how many people have read Upton Sinclairs "The Jungle" or have seen examples of patent medicine or read about standard industrial pratices in th eGloden age of the 1880's to 1920's. It was truly buyer beware, medicine was often more dangerous to you than your diease, and a corporation could poison your well and kill your crops and you had no recourse. I whole heartedly agree that goverment needs to be smaller and much more effective, but goverment also exists to protect the rights of those who can not protect themsleves. What chance does the average citizen have against DOW, 3M, Merck or other mega corpations?

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    Senior Member Array cmidkiff's Avatar
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    Sounds great to me... sign me up!

    Getting something through congress that limits government authority and reduces the size of the government significantly... without a revolution? Highly unlikely.

    Still, I'd love to see it happen.

    On your points pgrass101... Yup, corporate greed needs to be held in check by some method. Giving the federal government that responsibility is probably the least effective and most inefficient method that I could come up with. Consumer response, local laws, and court cases should be able to keep corporate abuse to a minimum.

    Upton Sinclair was a socialist, early supporter of the ACLU, backed prohibition... not someone I want to look to for political philosophy.
    Liberty is an inherently offensive lifestyle. Living in a free society guarantees that each one of us will see our most cherished principles and beliefs questioned and in some cases mocked. It's worth it.

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    Point taken cmidkiff, I used his book as an example not the man. The problem with making things Federal is you get to many fingers in the pie as you pointed out. As for the ACLU isn't the 2nd Admendment a Civil Liberty? I wonder why they don't fight for that Liberity?

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    Distinguished Member Array SixBravo's Avatar
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    Interesting. I consider myself a libertarian, but I gotta question this one. I think abolishing the income tax, while is a great idea in theory.... uhhh... well.... How is the military going to sustain itself? Soldiers aren't going to serve out of the kindness of their hearts. Not to mention the intelligence community. And their point about the CIA making money in real estate.. hmm.. okay so the CIA owning a safe-house someplace is a bad thing?

    It really sounds great in theory but I don't know.

    Does the Federal Reserve count as a business? And if the FBI needs to.. oh wait... no income tax. Can't have an FBI. As much as we ALL hate paying any kind of taxes - they are necessary. Even more so as the baby-boomers move towards retirement and social security claims/benefits.

    I'm dubious of this plan, to say the least.
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    'I like'...

    and I intend to read more thoroughly...

    Thanks...

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    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Why don't we just have a Con. amendment that says, "The Constitution means what it says, so lets all play along."

    Yeah, I know.
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    Senior Member Array cmidkiff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Congressional Record
    The latest Federal budget shows that individual income taxes supply only 42 percent of the Federal revenue; the rest comes from other sources. There is ample documentation to prove that getting the Federal Government out of these unauthorized businesses would cut the cost of Government at least 50 percent, while revenue is reduced only 42 percent, would give a surplus of 8 percent.
    The military makes up about 19% of our federal budget. The CIA and the FBI are explicitly not being dismantled, but are being denied the right to operate as profit making businesses.

    I believe that the plan would work, but we'll never get the chance to prove it (peacefully).
    Liberty is an inherently offensive lifestyle. Living in a free society guarantees that each one of us will see our most cherished principles and beliefs questioned and in some cases mocked. It's worth it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SixBravo View Post
    Interesting. I consider myself a libertarian, but I gotta question this one. I think abolishing the income tax, while is a great idea in theory.... uhhh... well.... How is the military going to sustain itself? Soldiers aren't going to serve out of the kindness of their hearts. Not to mention the intelligence community. And their point about the CIA making money in real estate.. hmm.. okay so the CIA owning a safe-house someplace is a bad thing?

    It really sounds great in theory but I don't know.

    Does the Federal Reserve count as a business? And if the FBI needs to.. oh wait... no income tax. Can't have an FBI. As much as we ALL hate paying any kind of taxes - they are necessary. Even more so as the baby-boomers move towards retirement and social security claims/benefits.

    I'm dubious of this plan, to say the least.
    I don't like paying taxes but I like what they provide. I am a small goverment small l libertarin, but I do reconize the need of a centralized goverment. I am against goverment waste and unnesscary regulation. I believe the Consitution means what it says.

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    VIP Member Array SammyIamToday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgrass101 View Post
    I don't like paying taxes but I like what they provide. I am a small goverment small l libertarin, but I do reconize the need of a centralized goverment. I am against goverment waste and unnesscary regulation. I believe the Consitution means what it says.
    The problem with that being taxes are providing all manner of things that they aren't supposed to be, or do you really like providing a bridge to nowhere in Alaska or welfare? I agree with the one guy, this is the best thing that could happen to America and probably won't happen without a revolution.

    I'll be barking up my congresscritters about this one.
    ...He suggested that "every American citizen" should own a rifle and train with it on firing ranges "at every courthouse." -Chesty Puller

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    I meant more like roads to somewhere Sammy. I guess I will just have to more about how this proposal will be interperted. I am always afraid of anything that the Polticians want to do. I do know that we need to curb goverment spending and all the pork projects that are passed every year.

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    VIP Member Array SammyIamToday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgrass101 View Post
    I meant more like roads to somewhere Sammy. I guess I will just have to more about how this proposal will be interperted. I am always afraid of anything that the Polticians want to do. I do know that we need to curb goverment spending and all the pork projects that are passed every year.
    Transportation and the military are two things I will definitely support the government doing. However, the whole host of other social programs I don't and won't support. This amendment from what I've read so far would be the exact way to get America back to how it was designed to be. A free country. Not just free to do what you want, but free from your government as well.

    What better way to get politicians to do what you want than repealing all the crap they've pulled over our heads the last 150 years or so?
    ...He suggested that "every American citizen" should own a rifle and train with it on firing ranges "at every courthouse." -Chesty Puller

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    Senior Member Array cmidkiff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SammyIamToday View Post
    ...host of other social programs I don't and won't support...
    Unfortunately... you _do_ support these programs. Financially, if not philosophically. That's the point :)

    Building roads and bridges are constitutionally valid projects for the federal government to spend money on.

    Dictating to the states what can and can't be taught in school, and running a national health insurance company isn't.
    Liberty is an inherently offensive lifestyle. Living in a free society guarantees that each one of us will see our most cherished principles and beliefs questioned and in some cases mocked. It's worth it.

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    You've got me thinking about this guys.

    How would "Interstate Commerce" be regulated? This is one of the Consitutional responibilites of the Fedearl Goverment and is used in the Clean Air and Water Act, and probably some others.

    I like clean air and water but I don't think that the goverment has the righ to tell me that I can't use my pasture because it is a wetland. How would this be handled?

    How can we ensure sensible regulation (and not just sensible to me )?

  15. #15
    VIP Member Array SammyIamToday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmidkiff View Post
    Unfortunately... you _do_ support these programs. Financially, if not philosophically. That's the point :)
    I know, that's why I'm all for this amendment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pgrass101
    You've got me thinking about this guys.

    How would "Interstate Commerce" be regulated? This is one of the Consitutional responibilites of the Fedearl Goverment and is used in the Clean Air and Water Act, and probably some others.

    I like clean air and water but I don't think that the goverment has the righ to tell me that I can't use my pasture because it is a wetland. How would this be handled?

    How can we ensure sensible regulation (and not just sensible to me )?
    The problem with "needing" these regulations are that the vast majority of people won't take any personal responsibility for anything. They immediately look to the government to fix it for them. And the government is good at making it look like they are the answer. If people stepped up to the plate more, there wouldn't be an issue.
    ...He suggested that "every American citizen" should own a rifle and train with it on firing ranges "at every courthouse." -Chesty Puller

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