Traffic Stops 101

[jeffkirchner]

...since us here in Ohio today are allowed to conceal our weapons while in our vehicle...

Isn't that awesome? I feel like a real person now. LOL

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[SIXTO]

In the shadow of some recent threads, I thought I'd bring this one back.

[kentuckycarry]

Great breakdown. One additional note; the time to tell me you know the mayor or whoever you think may help you, have a courtesy card, or whatever excuse you have is NOW. Not after I go to my car and write you. We have heard all of them and if you have a valid one by all means let us know. Motor vehicle enforcement is necessary but discretionary.

After I write a ticket I can't take it back or do anything with it. Were going to court.

And for the life of me I'll never understand this:

I pull you over for a violation;

after the stop is over and you pull away with me behind you; and,

commit the same or another violation! (this one usually recorded).


Regarding your attitude, if you choose to have one-two words MOBILE VISION. Yes, you are being recorded. Judges and everyone in the Court will appreciate your obnoxious, sarcastic and witty behavior while I maintain my professionalism.

Maybe this shouldnt have took me by surprise, but a "courtesy card"? Can you explain what this is? I know some people get away with just about anything because of "who they know" or "who they are" , I'm not naiive.. But I really dont understand the logic behind it.. If its illegal to do a u-turn ( for instance ) and a guy with a courtesy card does it, does that mean it was safe for him to do it but not me?

[kentuckycarry]

An officer is not going to put the lights on unless there IS a safe area to pull over. Too often people just keep driving or pull over in an area that becomes unsafe for the person stopped AND the officer.

I put my spot light in the DS mirror so that the person stopped can not see me approaching the vehicle. This gives me a tactical edge. They can overt their eyes if they like. I have never shined my hand held flashlight directly into someones eyes for any period of time, but I have used it to distract someone who was a threat.

And please do not refer to LEOs as pigs. I have never observed an LEO on this forum speaking negatively about NON-LEO, so please refrain from the name calling.

I have to disagree with thisbecause it happened to me and it also got me out of a ticket. The last time I got pulled over, it was on a 2 lane highway. I know the highway well because I live on it. A cop put his lights on in an area where there was no where to pull over for a mile, barely a shoulder. I pulled over where he turned on his lights, it was dangerous as all get out. The cop told me I was speeding , but didnt know how fast I was going, but was going to let me go because of where I pulled over, it was too dangerous...

[SIXTO]

I have to disagree with thisbecause it happened to me and it also got me out of a ticket. The last time I got pulled over, it was on a 2 lane highway. I know the highway well because I live on it. A cop put his lights on in an area where there was no where to pull over for a mile, barely a shoulder. I pulled over where he turned on his lights, it was dangerous as all get out. The cop told me I was speeding , but didnt know how fast I was going, but was going to let me go because of where I pulled over, it was too dangerous...

Sounds like his mind was made up before he ever put his overhead lights on.

[kentuckycarry]

Sounds like his mind was made up before he ever put his overhead lights on.

Maybe it was, but he seemed to be surprised that I pulled over where I did. But then again, he saw me go by and said I was speeding but didnt know how fast I was going. So you're probably right.
Great info by the way. When I get pulled over , I want to do the right thing to not make the LEO nervous , but dont always know the right way to go about it. Sounds like you pretty well covered it...

[Sam Douthit]

I drove for forty years without so much as a parking ticket. Then got three tickets in a month. Two were not deserved and one was. I did just as you advised on my pull overs and the officers were polite and just gave me the ticket. I always told my son that when he was pulled over that the first word out of his mouth was sir. My problem is that traffic court judges treat you as guilty unless you have a lawyer with you. The police are just doing their jobs give them every considerration.

[SIXTO]

My problem is that traffic court judges treat you as guilty unless you have a lawyer with you.

Yeah, they do. I think its just because 99% of people contesting the charge have no idea what they are talking about and offer a lame defense. Its just human nature to grow tired of this and forget how its supposed to be.
I enjoy when people contest their charges, every once in a while it gives me a challenge.

[Squawker]

Great list, Sixto. I've been pulled over twice in the past year. The first, I really didn't know why. I thought that I had turned on a leading light, but I was wrong, and actually turned in front of ma cop. The second time, I was running late for work, and I was pushing it, and I was going 10 mph over the limit. The fist time was at night, and I made sure that the engine was off, and my dome light was on. I opened the driver's side door, as the power window doesn't work.
But, I then kept my hands at 10 and 2. When the officer came up, I apologized for open door, and explained. The officer was polite, and explained why he pulled me over. I handed him my OL, and the assorted required paper work. Everything went so quickly that I never got to giving him my CCW. He gave me a warning, and sent me on my way. .
The second time, the officer came over to the passenger side, as it was a highway. I handed him my OL, etc, along with my CCW, and told him that I was armed. He was very professional, and did not ask me to remove it, or take me out of the car. The whole time, I kept my hands in view, and was as polite as I could be. He gave me a warning, and told me to slow down.
I was fortunate that I got a warning each time. I pretty much followed the list each time, without knowing it. Those two times were the only times that I have been pulled in the past twenty years, and I'll do my best to make sure that it will be another twenty years before I get pulled again.

[Cliffh]

Lots of interesting and usefull reading here - thanks!

- You don’t need to find a "safe" place to pull over. That is my job; I turned on my lights when I did for a reason. I am willing to bet I know the area and traffic patterns a little better than you do.

Now, I like watching police videos on tv. "Cops", and all those shows on Court TV or Spike TV are extremely entertaining to me. Last night on one of them in rural Texas a woman drove 6 miles with the lights and sirens following her, to her house, because she said she was afraid to pull over anywhere else.

While reading the OP to my wife, she also brought up the, (for lack of a better term), "redlight bandit" - a BG who uses a flashing or rotating light to cause folks to pull over, usually younger females. She indicated that she would feel much better driving to a well lit and/or populated area before stopping, and would probably do so.

When I teach CCW, I routinely tell people that they can refuse to consent...but if the officer does it anyway, just to stand aside and let it happen and note the time, date, location, unit number etc.

Wish I'd known about that a few decades ago. Riding my bike to work at approx. 2330. Got pulled over & thoroughly searched, including pockets, bags & trunk. I asked why I was pulled over (didn't know I was speeding - no bull), the rookie told me it was too late at night for someone to be riding a bike unless they were drunk. Had to do a field sobriety test too. The rookie got real excited when he found the empty plastic bags in the trunk, which were there to protect (legal) "stuff" if/when it rained. He wanted to get them tested for drugs - his partner talked him out of that. Got the ticket for 5 over. And he never once asked for permission to search. And no, I wasn't driving erratically, slurring my words or exhibiting any other signs of inebriation.

When he hit the lights, I immediately pulled over, shut off the engine & sat there with my hands on the grips until they walked up - one on each side. I was polite through-out the entire stop, with many "Yes Sir" and "No Sir" used.

Since all of the storage areas, except maybe under the seat, on a bike are accessable from the outside & a lot of times are unlockable, are bikes treated differently when it comes to search criteria? I know you'll only be able to answer for your area, and I don't live in the PRK any longer, but I'd still like to hear your answer(s).

BTW, I didn't have to explain being late to work, the shift supervisor and most of the other shift personnel already knew, they all waved as they drove by

[paramedic70002]

Sixto,

If you pull me over for a violation, all things being equal, exactly what kind of excuse qualifies for getting out of the ticket?

If I'm speeding because I'm late for my own wedding (almost was!), or my wife is in labor, or I'll get fired because I've been late for work too much, I'll probably still speed after you let me go. I've known many LEOs that say they'll write the summons VERY SLOWLY when violators have silly excuses (nobody even lies, right?) Also have heard LEOs state that they have an "open door" policy. If they open their door, you're getting a ticket!

And I'm also curious about the "courtesy card." Is that anything like in The Untouchables w/ Kevin Costner when the hitman got a pass on his concealed 45? Dou you really honor those situations? I'm guessing you work in a super-political environment?

[SIXTO]

Since all of the storage areas, except maybe under the seat, on a bike are accessable from the outside & a lot of times are unlockable, are bikes treated differently when it comes to search criteria? I know you'll only be able to answer for your area, and I don't live in the PRK any longer, but I'd still like to hear your answer(s).

Nope, bikes are no different than cars. A motor vehicle is a motor vehicle no matter if its on two wheels or eighteen.

It depends on the situation what can and cannot be searched. It makes no difference if the area is outside, on or in the vehicle.
If its incedent to an arrest, locked or not, the entire vehicle is getting searched. Consent search the same. If I'm looking for a stolen bulldozer, I'm not going to be digging around in your tank bag.

[SIXTO]

Sixto,

If you pull me over for a violation, all things being equal, exactly what kind of excuse qualifies for getting out of the ticket?

If I'm speeding because I'm late for my own wedding (almost was!), or my wife is in labor, or I'll get fired because I've been late for work too much, I'll probably still speed after you let me go. I've known many LEOs that say they'll write the summons VERY SLOWLY when violators have silly excuses (nobody even lies, right?) Also have heard LEOs state that they have an "open door" policy. If they open their door, you're getting a ticket!

And I'm also curious about the "courtesy card." Is that anything like in The Untouchables w/ Kevin Costner when the hitman got a pass on his concealed 45? Dou you really honor those situations? I'm guessing you work in a super-political environment?

The best excuse is the honest one. You will have a better batting average if you are just honest. I'd much rather you tell me that its a nice day and you are out enjoying your new sports car than make u some BS story. I can tolerate someone out for a spirited drive, I do the same myself. Lie to me, and I'll write every ticket I can think of.

Courtesy cards... A thing of Hollywierd. Maybe they exist some where, but I've never seen them. I will consider certain things though when using my discretion. I have stopped a few very public figures and could have very easily destroyed careers or at least put a black eye on them, so I will handle those cases differently as long as they are not donkeys about it.
A word on the politics... I love getting politicians. Those greedy, lazy fat SOB's have their hands in everyones pockets, if I can get mine in theirs just once, I will. I have got two congressmen, and quite a few reps. City clowncil people I get on a regular basis too. I dont care, they all get what they deserve.

[TC_FLA]

Seems like everyone has rules... Rules, rules.. Just another part of the gov't telling use what to do. "I have a badge, do what I say". Most of what carries a badge around here have "little man's disease", and have a very bad need to be incharge. Hard to have respect for an idioit with a badge. (This is not meant for the 2% of police that are great at what they do and are proud of it)

[limatunes]

The best excuse is the honest one.

That is until the honest excuse is the one not believed...

I had this happen to me. The guy just DIDN'T believe what I was saying. We were THIS close to arguing when I gave in and just sat there. I wasn't going to argue with him mostly because I wasn't going to win. He was already raising his voice and using sarcasm, further argument was going no place good.

I got a warning. I think had I let it escalate to arguing I would have had a ticket.