Self defense and Christianity.

Self defense and Christianity.

This is a discussion on Self defense and Christianity. within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; It is a little late, so pardon any spelling or other errors, but I wanted to get this posted while it was fresh in my ...

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Array GoodSamaritan's Avatar
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    Self defense and Christianity.

    It is a little late, so pardon any spelling or other errors, but I wanted to get this posted while it was fresh in my mind.






    Self Defense and the Bible.

    On any other forum I wouldn’t post something like this because it would likely become flame war. I know of more than one lib who misquotes the Bible in an attempt to say that it prohibits self defense. At the same time they are playing “Holier than thou” in that thread, they are bashing anyone who objects to gay marriage, or taking the words “Under God” out of the pledge.

    So here comes the good part. I am a minister, and I know the Bible better than most. However it took me a while to realize that there is very little pacifism in the Bible. Unfortunately that is what the majority of people focus on. Don’t get me wrong here I am not saying that it advocates violence, either. ( Romans 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.)

    I just thought that this would be an interesting topic for a while. Post your favorite verses, thoughts, or whatever about this topic.


    I’ll start.
    uke 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    Those are the words of Jesus telling his disciples to make sure they purchase a weapon. Why? For self defense obviously. For those who would say that he was speaking figuratively, the next verse has them showing Jesus a literal sword and Him, saying that it was adequate.

    The next one, I would like to point out is this.

    1 Timothy 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

    Part of providing, is protecting. If you gave your family the best of everything, but stood by and watched while a BG took it and harmed them, you didn’t provide for them. If this happened despite your best efforts that is a different matter. If you don’t put your baby in a car seat, you aren’t providing for their safety. If you don’t take them to the doctor when they get hurt, you wouldn’t be providing for their health. It is my duty, to God and my families, to not only be willing to lay my life on the line to save theirs, but to come home every night, and keep on providing.

    Your turn...


    Bryan


  2. #2
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    I'm not good at verses but expect there are hundreds in the Bible that apply to (and support) self defense and the defense of your family and friends.
    Bumper
    Coimhéad fearg fhear na foighde; Beware the anger of a patient man.

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    GS - no disrespect to you whatever but - I am not a religious man per se. That disappeared 40 and more years ago.

    I am tho - to use some perhaps overused expressions - a spiritual person and humanist - my conscience is my guide. I have therefore to bear all my guilt on my own - only I can deal with it - and I do, in whatever way works.

    I am a peace loving guy and respect life and try to ride the road of honor, integrity and respect. I am thus a man who wishes no harm to befall those who live upright (in your terms maybe - a ''Christian'' lifestyle) but do have little trouble in having a less than altruistic feeling toward those who perpetrate evil.

    If that evil should impact my life by creating dangerous threat - to me or those I care for then - I consider it my right and duty to defend self and those dear. Quite simply - if an evil person thinks they can deprive me of my life and rights then - I have the right to defend. That to me is simple - even if it means I should ( more than a little reluctantly) finish up taking the life of another.

    I therefore, need no writings to define my boundaries of conduct - my conscience will do that!
    Chris - P95
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    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Senior Member Array GoodSamaritan's Avatar
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    GS - no disrespect to you whatever but - I am not a religious man per se. That disappeared 40 and more years ago.

    I am tho - to use some perhaps overused expressions - a spiritual person and humanist - my conscience is my guide. I have therefore to bear all my guilt on my own - only I can deal with it - and I do, in whatever way works.

    I am a peace loving guy and respect life and try to ride the road of honor, integrity and respect. I am thus a man who wishes no harm to befall those who live upright (in your terms maybe - a ''Christian'' lifestyle) but do have little trouble in having a less than altruistic feeling toward those who perpetrate evil.

    If that evil should impact my life by creating dangerous threat - to me or those I care for then - I consider it my right and duty to defend self and those dear. Quite simply - if an evil person thinks they can deprive me of my life and rights then - I have the right to defend. That to me is simple - even if it means I should ( more than a little reluctantly) finish up taking the life of another.

    I therefore, need no writings to define my boundaries of conduct - my conscience will do that!
    None taken Bumper,

    As I have said before, I believe what I believe and I make no appologies for it. I am also not going to cram it down anyones throat.

    This thread was not intended to justify anyones feelings, only to discuss what the Bible really says about self defense. I have met people who I am sure know deep down that self defense is right, but who have been taught otherwise for so long that they have trouble reconciling the two. (I of course made up my mind regarding this some time ago.) This thread was intended to help us as a group to have an intelligent, informed conversation with those who are on the fence.

    Is anyone else interested?
    If not I may just write it up as an article and post it at a later date.

    Bryan

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    GS - me P95Carry - Bumper be ''da boss''!!

    Hope I wasn't intruding anyways - just expressing an ''outsider's view''.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Senior Member Array GoodSamaritan's Avatar
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    whoops. LOL

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    There is a huge contrast between the tone of the OT and the NT with regards to violence and self-defense. The problem with quoting the Bible is that it is used to bolster arguments for just about every possible stance on just about any given argument. It becomes almost pointless.
    - Tom
    You have the power to donate life.

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    Bryan,

    I like:

    "Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle." Psalm 144:1

    Eric

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    There is a huge contrast between the tone of the OT and the NT with regards to violence and self-defense. The problem with quoting the Bible is that it is used to bolster arguments for just about every possible stance on just about any given argument. It becomes almost pointless.
    There isn't THAT much difference. They are two halves of the same coin. The NT emphasizes "turn the other cheek" and "Love your neighbor as yourself" but those things are in the OT as well. The OT emphasizes the law, but mercy is there too.

    No offence Tom, but the key part of your statement is "the Bible is that it is used to bolster arguments". No argument from me there, people take it out of context on a regular basis. Of course, I sometimes wonder if they ever read and understood Rev 22:18-19

    18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
    19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

    My goal is not to twist the Bible, to make it fit what I believe. This post was intended to open up a discussion about what it really does say, in context. I went through this same study myself several times before finally admitting that I was originally wrong, and coming to the conclusion that I now have.

    Having said that, I cannot stress enough that there is a distinction between self defense and revenge. Self defense is when you stop a BG from hurting/killing you, your family, and or a third party. Revenge is when someone shoots them in the back. The N.T. is full of warnings to stay away from revenge. “Turn the other cheek”, “ do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;”. (despitefully use = insults, false accusations etc.)

    Romans 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

    Hebrews 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

    These are often misquoted, as “Vengeance is mine saith the Lord”
    As I have said only half jokingly on more that one occasion, I wish God would loan it to me now and then. LOL.


    Thanks for the participation Ecbaatz.

    BTW it is very late for me tonight, I will check back tomorrow and reread this post. In the mean time, please excuse any errors perpetrated by my overly groggy grey matter.

    Bryan

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