November 27th, 2007 11:37 AM
Carrying at work
So I have a question…
No one at my office has EVER expressed disdain for guns. In fact, the guy in the office next to me has spent .223 casings from a hunting trip he just took sitting on his desk. I am always talking about guns/laws/2A/ect. In my contract that I signed for my employment, guns, weapons of any kind, alcohol, ect. are NEVER mentioned.
My question to you is…(keeping in mind that if I screw up at this job and get fired, I may as well never work in the Mortgage Industry again considering how tightly knit it all is and my specific position within my orginization)…when I do get all my weapons training out of the way, CCW permit, and finally purchase a gun…How should I approach the subject of carrying at the workplace with my superiors?
Just start carrying and when/if they say something deal with it then?
Ask if it is ok in advance?
I work for an AWESOME company and I do not want anything to be weird or messed up...
Additionally, I do not want to be presumptuous by thinking that because my employment contract does not state that I can not carry, that by default I can carry...see my dilemma?
Do any of you carry on a regular basis at work (I'm sure a lot of you do, but to what capacity)? If so, how have you approached the subject with your superiors? What tactful methods can you suggest I use?
Your input is greatly appreciated!!!
November 27th, 2007 12:00 PM
Seeing as this is one of those things where the law per se is not your controlling factor ........ I think many of us would say - do NOT start asking around at work to see if carry is OK. That is probably a way to open a can of worms and successfully squash any chances. You only have to ask the wrong person and next thing is, carry will be listed as a no-no.
If carry is definitely not forbidden as such and no actual mention of weapons then, well - good concealement is - good concealment. Also - do NOT share the fact if you choose to carry - loose tongues always exist.
In PA our statute does not state that OC is illegal - ergo it is legal. However, same thing with your work contract - no mention of something is only by that omission making it seem OK. Hang onto that and decide accordingly - and privately.
Chris - P95
NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.
"To own a gun and assume that you are armed
is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."
- a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.
November 27th, 2007 12:02 PM
find a way to carry 'deep' (eg. smartcarry holster or some other way that wont get you 'busted' if someone puts their arm around you for some reason)
then carry carry carry. especially if they dont say anything against it!
you are doing absolutely nothing wrong and you need to remember that.
oh and also... shhhhhhh.
November 27th, 2007 12:03 PM
Can't add much to Chris' response. Sometimes it really is better to ask forgiveness than permission. But with good concealment and discretion, hopefully you won't have to ask for that either.
November 27th, 2007 01:41 PM
Sorry it's been busy today.. Took me a bit to get to this one. KEEP IT CONCEALED and KEEP IT QUIET. No rules means no rules. If they don't expressly ban it, don't ask about it. If you ask about it it's going to force their hand and most likely they're going to err on what they "feel" is the side of caution.
Just keep it to yourself. If you're discovered and they say something you can cross that bridge when you get there. At my office they discovered (my shirt rode up too high while I was working on equipment) I was carrying and ONE person made a big deal about it. No one else cared, but since one person decided to make a stink about it, they made the call and the call was to play it safe on their side (ie they made it a rule - no carry at work).
Then I had to make the decision about whether to follow their rule or be extra careful and carry anyway. Again...Concealed is concealed.
"My God David, We're a Civilized society."
"Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the crap out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
-The Mist (2007)
November 27th, 2007 04:01 PM
- know the difference
is a fancy name for crappy fighter
You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know
November 27th, 2007 04:28 PM
PLEASE heed the above advice.
Originally Posted by friesepferd
That's the best advice that can be given about this subject.
Do what you know is right (carry for your protection) and keep your mouth shut about it! There is no reason anyone should be informed that you are carrying a gun. That is both tactically irresponsible as well as socially. Why run the risk of having even one person in your office know? (And once one knows, they'll all know!)
This goes particularly because you say there is no stated anti-gun policy where you work.
November 28th, 2007 12:27 PM
Don't ever tell anyone at work. It's none of their business. Remember, when one person at work knows you carry, you can pretty much assume everybody at work will know.
DO NOT TELL ANYONE. It's an empowering feeling when you're packing and nobody knows.
November 28th, 2007 12:49 PM
I worked for a very large mortgage company for many years, and always carried a Walther PPK when I had a jacket on or the North American 22 LR in my back pocket when it was just to hot to ware a jacket.
No one ever brought up the issue, and I never said anything to anyone. Forward ten years, and I was a VP for the same company traveling all over the country and one of the guys I traveled with noticed as I pulled the Walter out of the small of back, unloaded it and placed it in my luggage before a flight.
He asked me how often I carried that, and I said 24/7, and he said Humm… I wonder if there is a company policy regarding that. I replayed none that I know of, and we left it at that.
Forward another five years, and I was President of another smaller mortgage company and while it was never in writing, I encourage all officers to take a training class and carry.
Even went so far as to take them to the range, and teach them the mechanics, of pistol and rifle shooting.
November 28th, 2007 01:17 PM
I have to agree. Carry, but be quiet about it.
November 28th, 2007 02:39 PM
guess this is were I have it good, I work at a gun store were its almost mandatory to carry if you have your permit.. Great place... but try maybe a smaller pocket gun, or ankle rig..
Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented immigrant' is like calling a drug dealer an 'unlicensed pharmacist'
De inimico non Loquaris sed cogites.
Do not wish ill for your enemy, plan for it!
November 29th, 2007 02:58 PM
My decision would probably be to carry discreetly and not say anything about it.
But keep in mind one thing. None of us on this forum will suffer your job loss along with you. You would do that by your lonesome. It's easy to advise someone else how to do something when THEY are the ones taking the risk.
You mentioned what a fantastic job this is. Only you can weight how important that is to you.
On the one hand you have risking your job by being discovered with a gun. Moderate risk with maybe a higher than moderate outcome, i.e. losing your job.
On the other hand you have risking not being able to defend yourself against an armed attacker. I think this is a much lower risk of occurance with a HUGE negative outcome if it happens.
fortiter in re, suaviter in modo (resolutely in action, gently in manner).
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