Which self-defense training for 18 y/o daughter?

Which self-defense training for 18 y/o daughter?

This is a discussion on Which self-defense training for 18 y/o daughter? within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; My dear 18 year-old-daughter will be off to school in August. She is unlikely to be able to carry until she's 21, and has not ...

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Thread: Which self-defense training for 18 y/o daughter?

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    Which self-defense training for 18 y/o daughter?

    My dear 18 year-old-daughter will be off to school in August. She is unlikely to be able to carry until she's 21, and has not been trained in any method of self-defense other than an hour or so with .22 and rangemaster. The current plan is to run her through the CCW I and II classes, but I'm wondering if effort might also be very well spent to enroll her in a martial arts program of some sort.

    She is homeschooled and very busy with her other subjects, and we could probably get her to a class once or twice a week if that's what she decides to do. We're 45 minutes from a fairly large town and an hour-and-a-half from a moderately large city. We don't have lots of money, but I'm sure we could free some up for this purpose.

    She ships out early in August. The small school she will attend is probably the safest place in the world so far as students go, but it is downtown in a small university town (and the OTHER school is a State U). Her studies in the library and salons at the coffee house will likely take her WAY past dark most nights. I won't be there to offer what protection or cover I can at home, and I would prefer to see her trained rather than untrained.

    She's of delicate build (think Limatunes) and (also like Lima) has an extremely good head on her shoulders. She would prefer not to bulk up like a professional weightlifter, and is not interested in training for competition but rather for exercise and self-protection. My wife and I would like her to be trained well enough to rip someone limb from limb, of course. Anybody know of any one-weekend baddonkey knife courses, for instance?

    Given our goals, constraints and timeframe, is there a particular 'school' of training you would suggest we investigate, or one you would steer us away from?


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array friesepferd's Avatar
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    sounds like you have raised an excellent young lady!
    congrats.
    as far as self defense schools go, i wish i could help, but i donno
    Wo die Notwehr aufhört, fängt der Mord an
    (Murder begins where self-defense ends)
    Georg Büchner

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    There are specific mixed arts classes out there just for people like your daughter. You dont have to be the grape ape to win a fight using these techniques. In fact, there is a guy who teaches my agency stuff that is a skinny little nerdy guy... but he can toss the biggest knuckledraggers we got around like nothing.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    Next step?

    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    There are specific mixed arts classes out there just for people like your daughter.
    Good to hear - but how should I go about finding them? Find a Tae Kwon Do place and say, "Whatchagot? And do you know of any 'Mixed Arts' classes nearby?" I figure that the local martial arts enthusiasts are likely to know about the others.

    Please forgive me if that's a stupid question - I'm afraid this is like hearing that a Compact car gets better gas mileage, and me going around looking for the local "Compact(tm)" dealer.

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    Distinguished Member Array SixBravo's Avatar
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    It would seem that, like with firearms, the most important weapons are the mind and self-confidence. As long as she refuses to be a victim and is willing to learn a few things I think she'll be fine.
    The Gunsite Blog
    ITFT / Quick Kill Review
    "It is enough to note, as we have observed, that the American people have considered the handgun to be the quintessential self-defense weapon." - Justice Scalia, SCOTUS - DC v Heller - 26 JUN 2008

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paymeister View Post
    Good to hear - but how should I go about finding them? Find a Tae Kwon Do place and say, "Whatchagot? And do you know of any 'Mixed Arts' classes nearby?" I figure that the local martial arts enthusiasts are likely to know about the others.

    Please forgive me if that's a stupid question - I'm afraid this is like hearing that a Compact car gets better gas mileage, and me going around looking for the local "Compact(tm)" dealer.
    To be honest, I dont know enough to answer that question. The stuff I know was taught in the military and later by police instuctors. Its nasty stuff, easy to use and works well, but I have no idea what it is called. From what I gather, its a little bit of everything tailored to our needs. It mixes everything from grapling, karate kid stuff to good old fashioned boxing and physics.
    I guess I would just call around and look for a S/D class designed for women, and let them know your not interested in learning the entire discipline, just tell them what you want.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    Quote Originally Posted by SixBravo View Post
    It would seem that, like with firearms, the most important weapons are the mind and self-confidence. As long as she refuses to be a victim and is willing to learn a few things I think she'll be fine.
    Mindset is the most critical part, for sure.

    And it certainly doesn't hurt to know how to throw a good punch while using that mindset.

    Most of the recent stuff I have learned as far as hand-to-hand is concerned I have learned from my husband. And he has learned that by improvising in his wilder youth and in the military. My favorite thing he ever taught me was how to throw a good punch. Whether or not it's good enough is up for grabs because I've never had to use it, but it's a start.

    I'm going to quote from the review I gave of a class that JD and I took in September of last year on how to stay alive (basically).
    We then learned the priorities of survival:
    1) Mindset
    2) Tactics
    3) Skill
    4) Equipment

    We’ve all heard dozens and probably thousands of times that mindset is the most important part of self-defense and I don’t think that anyone would argue that point. The idea is that without the will to live and to fight and to survive, it doesn’t matter if the person has a bazooka in their hands. There are little old grandmas who defeat attacks from much more able-bodied attackers just because they had the mindset that said they would not be victims. Mindset is the first priority.

    Second, is tactics. Some tactics can be learned, but some are born out of the necessity of the situation. The people who are unarmed, but have the mindset to survive and prevail will improvise their tactics to succeed, no matter what is required.

    A person can be born with a measure of skill, but usually skill is learned. However, someone does not need to be skilled to survive and that is why it is more important to have mindset and tactics than it is to have skill. The little old grandmother with her bare hands can be just as effective as the skilled, trained shooter, as long as she has the will to get going and the idea that sets her will in place. However, skill can help and be built upon and keep you alive longer and healthier than the lack thereof. And more skill than the other guy is always a better thing.

    It’s also news to no one that a gun is not necessary to defend one’s self. In the absence of a gun anything can be used whether it be a knife, hands and feet, a fork, a chair or a gallon of milk. Those who choose to carry a gun for self-defense are a step up on the equipment scale, but a $3,000 gun can never replace mindset, tactics or skill, nor should it.

    Then we were lectured on the two Principles of Personal Defense
    1) Awareness
    2) Decisiveness

    You can have all the things necessary to survive a confrontation, but if you are unaware of your surroundings or undetermined as to whether you should act, you are as hindered as though you have nothing.
    I agree 200%!

    Most of my work over the last five years has been 90% on my mindset and 5% on my skills and equipment. Where I'm trying to step up that 5% is in terms of my tactics--learning how to improvise, finding solutions in impossible situations, adapting, overcoming. JD has been a great help in that he tries very hard to help me think outside the box and look around for unconventional ways to defeat my problems. He does this by prompting me with questions, "What could you do? What are your options? What's wrong with that idea? What's your priority? Why do you think that would work? What next?"

    The one thing I was cautioned on when I started taking classes was that some classes teach these cookie cutter solutions to cookie cutter problems. All the sparing is done in a controlled environment in controlled settings with an instructor saying "go" and "stop."

    While their obviously does have to be order to these classes it can be too easy to get caught up in the sport and the rules and to forget that you are learning these skills to be used in an uncontrolled, unregulated setting such as self defense.

    Like Sixto said, the military and police don't train you in any particular art, they just throw everything in the mix to give you what you need to kick the crap out of someone else who is trying to do the same thing to you. Those are the best classes and the ones I'd be looking for.

    Any class that emphasizes avoidance and the actual application of force in a defensive situation more than the "art" of whatever it is they are teaching.

    The first thing that came to mind in finding such classes in your area would be to contact a woman's shelter and ask them if they have any classes or fliers offered by instructors who are trying to get a program started for women.

    If you do want your daughter to use tools such as a knife or pepper spray which certainly wouldn't be a bad idea, you may even look into some training in the use of said tools.

    But I do think the best that you can do for her is to start prepping her on the use of her mindset and tactics, awareness and decisiveness.

    It doesn't matter if she had a tank on her side, without those things she's defenseless.

    Good luck!

  8. #8
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    See if the college she is attending or local PD offers a self-defence class.

    I took a college level self-defence course for fun once. It was not a formalized Martial Arts class but a Crotch kicking, eye gouging, fish hooking, nose biting, gutter fighting class.

    I would check the coloege and police department, just tell them what you are looking for, they will know what you are talking about.
    “You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic.”

    ― Robert A. Heinlein,

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    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    We will be visiting a Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu group tomorrow evening, and I'm looking into Krav Maga training as well. I'll let you know what we discover.

    All, thanks for the thought you've put into these replies. I really appreciate you!

    More comments welcome, of course.

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    VIP Member Array friesepferd's Avatar
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    thats a good point. many colleges have martial arts type courses.
    lots of fun if nothing else.
    im guessing wherever she is going doesnt have a pistol club tho. sorry.
    send her over to my neck of the woods! we got one!
    Wo die Notwehr aufhört, fängt der Mord an
    (Murder begins where self-defense ends)
    Georg Büchner

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    Member Array Final Option's Avatar
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    Krav Maga would be very good. Check out the people on Paxton Quigley's site The Paxton Quigley Web Page They do training almost exclusively for women. If I remember correctly she was very anti-gun at one time. She was attacked (don't remember the details) and became pro gun and got training in self defense. Since then she has gone on and started a career in womens self defense training. I believe at one time she was or is associated with the NRA. That would be a good place to get recommendations. The Paxton Quigley Web Page

  12. #12
    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    Pistol club

    Quote Originally Posted by friesepferd View Post
    ...I'm guessing wherever she is going doesnt have a pistol club, though...
    Funny you should say that - my avatar is the patch I designed for her to use as she starts one! I doubt she will, but I enjoyed myself considering the possibility.

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    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paymeister View Post
    We will be visiting a Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu group tomorrow evening, and I'm looking into Krav Maga training as well. I'll let you know what we discover.

    All, thanks for the thought you've put into these replies. I really appreciate you!

    More comments welcome, of course.
    Check out the FIGHT system(Haganah) too. They incorporate parts of Krav Maga as well as BJJ (among many other things). I liked it because out of 10 years off and on of different styles of MA(Hapkido, Taekwondo, Gung-Fu) that was the only thing I found that seemed to be effective. AND ITS QUICK TRAINING. The way they design the training program you can be street effective in 4-6 months. Check them out at Fight 2 Survive
    There's only two listings for locations in VA and I've only attended the one in Vienna. So I don't know how good the other instructor is at that other location.

    btw - there were girls in our class that were 100lbs soaking wet thrashing 180-200lb guys like they were rag dolls.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the crap out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

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    VIP Member Array friesepferd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paymeister View Post
    Funny you should say that - my avatar is the patch I designed for her to use as she starts one! I doubt she will, but I enjoyed myself considering the possibility.
    haha thats great. well if she ever does have her contact me. im the president of a university pistol club, im sure i could give her some info to help her out. having a student club that is gun related isnt an easy thing to do, but very possible.
    Wo die Notwehr aufhört, fängt der Mord an
    (Murder begins where self-defense ends)
    Georg Büchner

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    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    Great - I'm quite interested! I thought I should park it in a new thread, though, and would love your input:

    http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...l-club-do.html

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