The American Revolution and modern times - Page 6

The American Revolution and modern times

This is a discussion on The American Revolution and modern times within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by Free American Why is it Self Defense that when they "subvert the ideals of MY country" they need to be defeated. If ...

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  1. #76
    Restricted Member Array SelfDefense's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Free American View Post
    Why is it Self Defense that when they "subvert the ideals of MY country" they need to be defeated. If you can freely sit there and call others wrong for being so sure about how it should happen, IS IT NOT POSSIBLE that you could also be wrong?
    I think you missed my point. Those who subvert the ideals of the United States (my country) need to be defeated POLITICALLY. That is why I vote for people who propose lower taxes, strong military, border security, and defense of the most innocent in this country: babies.

    Those who propose and conspire to an armed rebellion against the United States should be and will be stopped.

    Patriotism is not just standing behind the flag and following blindly along as the country is driven into the ground.
    You think the greatest country on Earth, with the most freedom, the best opportunities, and no limits to success for anyone, is being driven into the ground? And you are perplexed that I disagree with your views? Patriotism is standing behind your country. It is the love and devotion to your country. It is not attacking every policy with which you disagree with such vengeance to make it seem you are spoiled by the success we have achieved over our long history.

    Nobody has mentioned armed rebellion as the most desirable, practical method...nor have they said they are ready for one. What I have heard...and it seems quickly turned around as "evil thoughts" is that if it came down to the removal of our rights we would stand and fight.
    No one has removed your rights. That argument has no merit. Some rights are protected but many here just make up rights (like the Court has done with Roe v Wade, for example) and screech when they think those perceived 'rights' have been violated. Some so loudly that they think rebellion against the United States should even be considered.

    If YOU choose to just follow orders that go against our Constitutionally guaranteed rights then so be it. Follow the flock, but do not suppose to judge others on their belief in patriotism.
    Can you describe a single instance when your personal rights have been violated? You had to submit to a search at the airport?

    People work themselves into a frenzy over nothing. Just the fact you can discuss this type of activity in public is a right that would uickly get you arrested and detained n many other countries. That you do not appreciate that fact is...well...disturbing.

    I would just wonder what the response would be if our rights were actually violated rather than worrying about identifying yourself to authorities.


  2. #77
    Senior Member Array Free American's Avatar
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    I do believe our country is currently being driven into the ground. Almost 50% of this countries citizens rely on government handouts to survive. The congress spent over a month last session arguing over a NONBINDING RESOLUTION that says "we don't like the war". That is not what they are there for pass some laws already.

    As for passing laws, I am tired of the government trying to protect me from myself. I'm a big boy now...get out of my bedroom, get out of my mind, stay away from my paycheck, leave my guns alone. The idiots we have in office need to read the Constitution and realize that it IS THE INSTRUCTION MANUAL FOR THIS COUNTRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    They who give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin


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  3. #78
    Restricted Member Array SelfDefense's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Free American View Post
    I do believe our country is currently being driven into the ground. Almost 50% of this countries citizens rely on government handouts to survive.
    Any evidence to support that number? Remember, not paying taxes is very different than relying on government handouts. The number you are looking for, those on welfare, is closer to 10 million, which is about 6% assuming two people per household. oo many to be sure, but a far cry from 50%

    The congress spent over a month last session arguing over a NONBINDING RESOLUTION that says "we don't like the war". That is not what they are there for pass some laws already.
    Why do want them to pass laws? Exactly what laws do you want them to pass? We have plenty of laws already. I would prefer them to review previous laws and rescind them, such as offshore drilling.

    As for passing laws, I am tired of the government trying to protect me from myself. I'm a big boy now...get out of my bedroom, get out of my mind, stay away from my paycheck, leave my guns alone. The idiots we have in office need to read the Constitution and realize that it IS THE INSTRUCTION MANUAL FOR THIS COUNTRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    You might be tired of the government, but in general they do a good job. There are very few laws that protect you from yourself. There are, however, laws that protect society that you think are there to protect you from yourself. But that is rarely the case.

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by SelfDefense View Post
    Any evidence to support that number? Remember, not paying taxes is very different than relying on government handouts. The number you are looking for, those on welfare, is closer to 10 million, which is about 6% assuming two people per household. oo many to be sure, but a far cry from 50%
    There is also 50 million social security recipients that are on the government dole that we are paying for! Then what happens when the left 'gives' us national health care?
    Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est.-Seneca

    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. If I have a gun, what do I have to be paranoid about?" -Clint Smith

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  5. #80
    Restricted Member Array SelfDefense's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goawayfarm View Post
    There is also 50 million social security recipients that are on the government dole that we are paying for! Then what happens when the left 'gives' us national health care?
    Social Scurity is a completely different topic. For the most part, the eople who extract money paid in to the system. Yes, the pyramid scheme is irreparably broken, as could have been foreseen when the prgram ws initiated. FDR was perhaps the worst president of the United States.

    National healh care will will see a lower quality of care, a longer wait to receive health care, fewer qualified doctors and no innovation in medicine. Creation of new drugs from the pharmeceutical companies will be severely curtailed. For all that we will pay higher taxes.

  6. #81
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    Off topic/ soc. security

    Quote Originally Posted by goawayfarm View Post
    There is also 50 million social security recipients that are on the government dole that we are paying for! Then what happens when the left 'gives' us national health care?
    Recipients paid for it with 15% of their annual income over a life time.

    It isn't in the same category as welfare.

    And exactly what do you think should happen to the people who become too old to work? Or, what should be done when inflation has eaten up old people's life time savings and investment?

    And in any case, the number is well below 50 million; more like 35 million.

    That of course includes most likely, your grandparents. Maybe your parents. Maybe some respected older aunts and uncles.

    Don't disrespect them in some imaginary generational war.

    Social Security is a great deal for younger adults. It often frees them from having to personally provide for their loved ones. Would you rather there be no soc. security whatsoever but you be obligated (morally) to pay the upkeep of your older relatives out of your earnings?

  7. #82
    Ex Member Array EB31's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paramedic70002 View Post

    The Declaration of Independence tells us that it is sometimes OK to rise up against the government.


    As a Patriot, I would consider joining a rebel cause if many things were to come into line: massive or unbearably incremental abuses; wide base of cohorts; chance of winning; no where else to go; moral compass; etc etc etc.


    I'd be right there with you.

  8. #83
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    The Declaration of Independence tells us that it is sometimes OK to rise up against the government.
    Some people refuse to understand that though and act as if there will never be a reason to rise up. Never is a long time.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  9. #84
    Senior Member Array Free American's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Never is a long time.
    and THAT is the whole point.
    They who give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin


    Previously known as "cjm5874"

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Recipients paid for it with 15% of their annual income over a life time.
    it's actually only 6.2%.....

    It isn't in the same category as welfare.

    And exactly what do you think should happen to the people who become too old to work? Or, what should be done when inflation has eaten up old people's life time savings and investment?

    And in any case, the number is well below 50 million; more like 35 million.
    Social security as of 2005 had 47.7 million recipients! Look for yourself:
    http://www.njfac.org/FactsSS.pdf

    That of course includes most likely, your grandparents. Maybe your parents. Maybe some respected older aunts and uncles.

    Don't disrespect them in some imaginary generational war.

    Social Security is a great deal for younger adults. It often frees them from having to personally provide for their loved ones. Would you rather there be no soc. security whatsoever but you be obligated (morally) to pay the upkeep of your older relatives out of your earnings?
    It is a government entitlement program, yes participants are supposed to pay into it.......but.....Social security is a Ponzi scheme (which in any other walks of life is ILLEGAL!), that will be bankrupt in just a few years. Most people who have paid into it (As I have!) will end up collecting more than they paid in.....Which means those who are still paying into it will be for others benefit & not their own!.......That's welfare!

    I'm not begrudging anybody their right to collect it...I'm not for tossing the elderly aside........there just has to be a better way. This country survived for 180 years without it! I'm also pointing out that!

    As to my relatives........my father & his father DID NOT PAY INTO SOCIAL SECURITY! NOT ONE DIME! They both worked for railroads who have a separate retirement system OUTSIDE OF THE GOVERNMENT ONE!.........& guess what? They both had & are having a better retirement than if they had been on Social Security.....So there are better ways to handle your retirement without TAXPAYERS who don't know you having to pay for it!

    If you're not nearing retirement age already....DON'T plan on Social Security to be there when you do retire!
    Last edited by goawayfarm; June 22nd, 2008 at 10:39 PM.
    Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est.-Seneca

    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. If I have a gun, what do I have to be paranoid about?" -Clint Smith

    "An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Jeff Cooper

  11. #86
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    Social Security was never intended to be a stand alone retirement program but rather as a supplemental one.

    And with that being said, I dont beleive that it is the Governments job to collect some of my money and distribute it to other people.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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