Talk about a rash decision.
This is a discussion on Beware: Gun Confiscation within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; At 21, if my dad took my 30+ guns in this manner, I'd give him an ultimatum: give them back or go to jail. "Dad, ...
At 21, if my dad took my 30+ guns in this manner, I'd give him an ultimatum: give them back or go to jail. "Dad, I love you, but you don't really have a choice. If we want to make an arrangement to store part of them, that is fine, but I will know the location and have access to them."
I seriously doubt that would ever be this case, especially since he and I are truly communistic about guns.
Slimz, has he mentioned your drinking in the past? Does he seem concerned about alcohol use? Did you ask him why he took the guns?
The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.
NRA Certified Pistol Instructor, World Drifter
Talk about a rash decision.
Why in the world is everyone giving advice that will destroy this family when a little calm reflection and cooperation can solve about all of the problem.
Paymeister got it right. The kid and the dad should go talk to a neutral third party such as a grandparent, uncle, pastor, psychologist, and work this thing out.
THe assumption that the guns will turn up being used in a crime is far fetched given the scenario and the situation.
I'm impressed by the OP's statement that he is an A student. I believe that. Therefore, I think he has the intellect to find a solution to this situation without escalating it.
Absolutely nothing good can come from doing what some here have proposed. Someone will end up in jail; maybe two someones, and the family will be destroyed. (That by the way isn't a good display of family values.)
There are better ways to deal with this. And if need be, this young man can and perhaps should seek some legal guidance if he is worried about the statute which some have cited.
I think that statute is a non-issue, and I would love to hear from Sixto as I think he would have some solid insight into what the law truly requires here, and how the cops would view this situation.
Still, unless dad is some sort of goof who is utterly irresponsible, this thing needs to be cooled.
(And I doubt the dad is in fact irresponsible. As this young man is an A student, maybe dad raised him right. It appears so from some of what the OP wrote. So, there is likely at least some poor judgment on both sides. You don't want that in the hands of the cops. Pity the poor mother if both end up in the slammer.)
The "kid" is an adult. Perhaps it is time for him to move out, and live like one.
This is a simple situation, every child goes through this in their lives; Your father is telling you that it is his house, and his rules and he controls everything and everyone in it. I had this same issue with my dad 25 years ago when he took a pistol that I carried and sold it at the local pawn shop "because I shouldn't be carrying something like that around". he conveniently forgot that I worked in the oil fields of South Texas and was on the road alone a lot in those days.
To solve the problem, I simply moved out on my own. Yes, it was hard and it took me an extra year to graduate from school, but I managed and had my freedom from his "rules". So the answer to your question is how much do you value your principles and your need to protect yourself, as well as your willingness to exercise your rights? If you are willing to move out on your own, then so be it. Move out and demand your father return your property. If he has gotten rid of it, like my father did, then you know where you stand with mom and dad. It was 4 years before I spoke to my dad after that, and I have not let him or any of my other family members forget it.
Ever since he did that, i have made him an NRA member every year since then. If any of you wonder why I have mentioned in some of my posts why I make all of my liberal family members NRA members every Christmas, now you know the story behind the story.........
"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry
Request the immediate return of all your property.
If not immediately returned, report the guns as stolen/missing.
You need to both act as adults.
"There is no such thing as too much ammo. Unless you're swimming!"
As a tenent paying rent, you have the rights anyone renting an apartment has. Likewise if a stranger was renting a room from your parents they would have rights.
First of all, a landlord cannot enter the tenents domicile without permission. You have every right to keep your room locked.
A landlord certainly may not tamper with or take a tenents property.
Your dad could be charged with criminal trespass and grand larceny. By the way, the person now in possession of your guns could be charged with conspiracy, accomplice before the fact to grand larceny and felony possession of stolen property. I'd call the police and tell your father to call a lawyer.
"First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand."
Edge of Darkness
All of you, stop this nonsense that the kid should move out.
He needs to find a solution that both he and his dad can live with.
Talking about making this into a big dang legal deal, or insisting that the OP grow up and moving out, is just silly; and dangerous to the family's welfare.
You all on that side of the issue are encouraging a family calamity.
Honestly, to the guy who said he didn't talk to his dad for 4 years over a similar issue, was that really wise?
I have not gone back to early posts to check whether or not the kid is actually paying rent. My initial recollection was no, as he is a student living at home. But in any case, don't twist a family arrangement into a commercial venture. They aren't the same thing.
This is a kid living in his dad's home. Something happened that caused the dad to be concerned about the guns and the kids behavior or safety. Who give a whatever about the legalisms. These two have to find a way to get along. Whatever concerned the dad needs to be resolved.
I urge the OP in the strongest way possible, preserve your relationship with your parents. If it is necessary to seek outside help to do so, do it. If it is necessary to give in, do it. Down the road you will be glad you did.
P.S. I'm an old guy who raised a kid who is now a decade older than the OP. If you haven't raised a kid, or you have the kind of temperament where you have in the past been in constant conflict with your parents, at least stop and think about the potential damage your poor advice is going to cause.
This isn't about gun rights. It is about a son and a dad learning to get along, and a dad trying to protect his son. It isn't for the cops. It is for a pastor or a psychologist or a close relative both trust, to sort it out.
To the OP; SON, seriously, don't do anything you are going to regret for the rest of your life. Think carefully before you act.
Then if they don't appear, report them as stolen - - which they were.
"...bad decisions that turn out well often make heroes."
Gary D. Mitchell, A Sniper's Journey: The Truth About the Man and the Rifle, P. 103, NAL Caliber books, 2006, 1st Ed.
22 and still living home, I moved out at 18. It was tough at first, but I survived. I am now 32, married, and have three kids. I also got my education (BA) on Uncle Sam’s dime. Move out, it's time to become a man. My father and my relationship with him have grown tremendously since the big move.
OP needs to report the guns missing...
Dad is in violation of Ohio Landlord Tenant laws, Dad has had at least one loaded firearm transported from the home (Probably in violation of State law) - unless he is leo or CHL holder there is no way he could legally transport a loaded handgun in a motor vehicle in Ohio, if any of the long guns were loaded he definitely violated law in transporting...
OP needs to have a serious chat with Dad - Ohio law is not 'friendly' to people who violate gun laws in ignorance...
had a similar situation with my son - came home while still a student - all but one of his collection found it's way to my safe...
house rules do have a place, but once rent changes hands the rules change...
Along those same lines, try to find some middle ground. You want them back, but you're willing to wait it out. I would suggest showing him the code that requires reporting of stolen/missing firearms. Make it clear that you are not even willing to consider getting the police involved, but that they are in-fact missing according to the letter of the law. Then draw him up a statement saying the he acknowledges that the guns (loaded) have been removed from proper storage and that he is assuming any and all responsibility for what happens as a direct result of their displacement. Then ask him to sign it.
What good is that? Nothing, I would imagine when it comes to legality. I don't even know if it would/could be used in court for whatever reason. BUT it will force your father to consider the consequences of his actions. Suppose your father's storage-person lets it slip to someone that they are storing a bunch of guns and the wrong person gets a hold of that information. Unlikely but still something for him to consider.
I like the idea of taking your dad out for a beer or two and discussing the issue at hand. Explain all of what you have told us and go from there. Prove the maturity to him and proceed like an adult. If he still doesn't see your point - then you tried. At this point, you might consider what I suggested.
Hopyard your wisdom is showing through.
I think everyone will admit we don't know 100% of the story.....we haven't heard Dad's side though many are already condeming and convicting him without hearing his side of the story.
Helpful hints on pushing back and strengthening the 2A:
The father's actions here - acting unilaterally rather than sitting down man to man and discussing his concerns - have placed his son in the position where he must choose to either knowingly break the law himself or report the taking of the guns to the police.
That's not a position one should place a loved one in.
It seems likely to me that Dad doesn't know what position he has placed his son in - and that his son should tell his father what the implications of his choice are.
This business that the guns have been stolen is a non-starter.
Think about the whole picture. This young man has been living in the home all his life, he has no doubt been a dependent on his dad's income taxes which implies that dad has provided more than 50% of the kid's support.
This means the money the kid had available to make the gun purchases with was the dad's money-- or at least largely the dad's money and encouraging the dissolution of the family.
And clearly, dad was generous enough that the kid somehow had substantial money to invest in those guns. You can't make a case for the word "stolen" under these circumstances. It won't fly.
You can't make a case that dad didn't have an ownership interest here. No one in their right mind is going to call that stealing, and if it went before a jury, which it never would, you will never find 12 people who will see this as the type of "missing or stolen" referred to in the statute.
All of this advice to report it stolen is beyond belief. You guys aren't thinking of the consequences. One wrong word from the dad and this kid will be picked up and hauled off to a mental hospital (whether he needs it or not). As someone noted earlier, all dad has to say is that he was fearful that the kid would harm himself or someone in the house, deliberately or accidentally.
Again, instead of urging rash action that will destroy the family, urge an approach which brings about a reconciliation.
And to the folks who want this kid to move out, yes, many do move out at an earlier age. Often they are forced out because parent's can't abide the behavior. Other times they leave for military careers at a young age. But, vast numbers of people do live a different way. They send their kids to college, support them into young adulthood, let them live at home out of love until they finish school and find a decent job. Apparently, this latter approach is what has been taken in this household, and the kid isn't yet ready financially to move out.
So, nothing good, absolutely nothing good whatsoever, can possibly come from advising this young man in the way some here have.
All of the evidence here is that the dad loves his son, is acting for his best interest, and you all should be ashamed for wanting to throw stones at the dad.