Raising my neighborhood crime level from low to high

Raising my neighborhood crime level from low to high

This is a discussion on Raising my neighborhood crime level from low to high within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; I just got a visit from a neighbor. Apparently there have been several drug related burglaries from one person in the last couple of weeks. ...

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  1. #1
    VIP Member Array ExactlyMyPoint's Avatar
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    Raising my neighborhood crime level from low to high

    I just got a visit from a neighbor. Apparently there have been several drug related burglaries from one person in the last couple of weeks. His MO is that he knocks on the door inquiring about someone. When the owner tells him he is not there, he leaves and tries another house hoping no one is home. If no one is home, he goes around back and breaks in through the sliding glass door, picks up anything he can carry in a backpack and leaves.

    She was distributing a flier about a neighborhood watch meeting next Monday. The sheriff will be there to give us ideas on how to protect ourselves. I wonder if I should ask him how many times I can shoot him should I find him in my home.
    Last edited by ExactlyMyPoint; October 7th, 2008 at 05:39 PM. Reason: Changed robberies to burglaries to make Sixto happy.
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    Don't answer the door when you hear a knock...when you hear the glass break in back...wait for 30 seconds...give the dirtbag standing in your kitchen or den, exactly what he deserves for threatening your life!
    ...STOP!
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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  3. #3
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    Not trying to nitpick, but that would be a burglary, not robbery.

    Dogs are great in this sort of situation... and what leads you to believe its drug related? (it probably is, just wondering)
    "Just blame Sixto"

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array ExactlyMyPoint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Not trying to nitpick, but that would be a burglary, not robbery.
    Whatever.

    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Dogs are great in this sort of situation... and what leads you to believe its drug related? (it probably is, just wondering)
    Don't have a dog. I have a cat who would be useless.

    She said it was drug related. That is all I know.
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    Distinguished Member Array Black Knight's Avatar
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    retsupt99 I don't know about OR law but in VA you might get charged with "lying in wait". It is a charge they sometimes use when the homeowner knows of a neighborhood problem and doesn't try to call before the shooting starts. I have heard of the charge when talking with local LEO's but have no evidence of anyone actually charged with it. My idea would be don't answer the door and call the locals before he breaks in. That way it is on tape if you have to shoot while in fear of your life.

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    I guess the best answer is to make it look like somebody is home; light timers, leave a radio or TV on, leave a pair of work boots on your porch. You get the idea, be creative. I know a lady who puts a note on both doors saying dont ring the bell, I'm sleeping... at least it keeps them guessing.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Knight View Post
    retsupt99 I don't know about OR law but in VA you might get charged with "lying in wait". It is a charge they sometimes use when the homeowner knows of a neighborhood problem and doesn't try to call before the shooting starts. I have heard of the charge when talking with local LEO's but have no evidence of anyone actually charged with it. My idea would be don't answer the door and call the locals before he breaks in. That way it is on tape if you have to shoot while in fear of your life.
    Knock on the door? (I guess I missed that part in the law that says I have to answer my door.) I didn't hear any knock on the door, I did hear some glass breaking in the back den...I grabbed my gun and saw this strange guy in my home, when he stepped towards me, I was in fear on my life...PERIOD...I'll take my chances, and the BG can take his.
    If every dirtbag who broke into someone's home became a dead intruder, home breakin's would decline...I'd have no regrets!

    Anyone is free to disagree, just don't break into my home. I will end your career, that is, if you cause me to fear for my life...

    I agree with Ted Nugent when he says he doesn't like repeat offenders, he likes dead offenders.
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    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Knight View Post
    retsupt99 I don't know about OR law but in VA you might get charged with "lying in wait". It is a charge they sometimes use when the homeowner knows of a neighborhood problem and doesn't try to call before the shooting starts. I have heard of the charge when talking with local LEO's but have no evidence of anyone actually charged with it. My idea would be don't answer the door and call the locals before he breaks in. That way it is on tape if you have to shoot while in fear of your life.
    Who's gonna know? Do we deserve the same tactical advantage commonly used by the BG's? Of course we do! Is it called entrapment? 'Laying in wait', or being prepared? Do you feel obligated to your community or just yourself once the problem has been announced? Look at the big picture......get another BG off the streets and you'll feel better....how you do it is up to you. let your conscience be your guide.

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    The "laying in wait" thing isnt an offense by itself, its a ploy used when the legal wrangling begins. It has been used with success when people have taped shotguns to their front doors and things like that.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Not trying to nitpick, but that would be a burglary, not robbery.
    Quote Originally Posted by exactlymypoint View Post
    Whatever.
    Of a dwelling only, not other buildings or property. There's a strong distinction between property and person crimes in Oregon, and that difference can help keep "whatever" out of prison, actually.

    Oregon does NOT have Texas-style property laws that allow anything near the degree of lethal force to be used for "mere" property crimes, except inside a person's dwelling.

    Basically:

    1. Lethal force may be used to defend persons against forcible felonies or the imminent commission thereof.

    2. Lethal force may be used to stop burglary of a "dwelling" (ie, your house), but not the outbuildings, garage, tool shed, etc.

    3. Reasonably-necessary force may be used to stop criminal trespass, though the use of lethal force is strictly limited to situations that call for the defense of persons (above), as in arson or a forcible felony.

    4. In a nutshell, essentially you cannot use lethal force to stop a burglary or criminal trespass unless that person directly and violently puts lives at risk, or that burglary is of a dwelling. Then, lethal force is legally authorized to stop the crime(s), using the same basic standards that apply anywhere else.

    It would be worthwhile to review the Oregon statutes distinguishing between what is legally authorized in the two scenarios (property versus person crimes). A few of the relevant statues include:

    161.209 Use of physical force in defense of a person.
    Except as provided in ORS 161.215 and 161.219, a person is justified in using physical force upon another person for self-defense or to defend a third person from what the person reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of unlawful physical force, and the person may use a degree of force which the person reasonably believes to be necessary for the purpose. [1971 c.743 §22]
    161.219 Limitations on use of deadly physical force in defense of a person.

    Notwithstanding the provisions of ORS 161.209, a person is not justified in using deadly physical force upon another person unless the person reasonably believes that the other person is:

    (1) Committing or attempting to commit a felony involving the use or threatened imminent use of physical force against a person; or

    (2) Committing or attempting to commit a burglary in a dwelling; or

    (3) Using or about to use unlawful deadly physical force against a person. [1971 c.743 §23]
    161.225 Use of physical force in defense of premises.
    (1) A person in lawful possession or control of premises is justified in using physical force upon another person when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes it necessary to prevent or terminate what the person reasonably believes to be the commission or attempted commission of a criminal trespass by the other person in or upon the premises.

    (2) A person may use deadly physical force under the circumstances set forth in subsection (1) of this section only:

    (a) In defense of a person as provided in ORS 161.219; or

    (b) When the person reasonably believes it necessary to prevent the commission of arson or a felony by force and violence by the trespasser.


    (3) As used in subsection (1) and subsection (2)(a) of this section, “premises” includes any building as defined in ORS 164.205 and any real property. As used in subsection (2)(b) of this section, “premises” includes any building. [1971 c.743 §25]
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  11. #11
    Member Array citizen510's Avatar
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    Move to Tennessee! It is less complicated here. If they break in, they get a free pass to the pearly gates.
    It is not the Bill of Privileges. It is not the Bill of Permits. It is the Bill of Rights.

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    The way I look at it, the BG didn't make 1 bad decision, he made 3.

    1. Made decision to commit a crime.
    2. Made decision on place to commit crime.
    3. Made decision to follow thru on commiting the crime.

    This person had 3 chances to decide no instead of yes. A no decision on any of the 3 would have resulted in no crime. It is a simple of a 3 strikes rule as you can have.

    The victim has 1 choice. Defend myself or not. If victim makes wrong choice, it may be game over.

    Just my opinion.

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    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flfirefighter View Post
    The way I look at it, the BG didn't make 1 bad decision, he made 3.

    1. Made decision to commit a crime.
    2. Made decision on place to commit crime.
    3. Made decision to follow thru on commiting the crime.

    This person had 3 chances to decide no instead of yes. A no decision on any of the 3 would have resulted in no crime. It is a simple of a 3 strikes rule as you can have.

    The victim has 1 choice. Defend myself or not. If victim makes wrong choice, it may be game over.

    Just my opinion.
    That would be the 'three strikes....you're out' rule! Sounds good.

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    Senior Member Array rolyat63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Knock on the door? (I guess I missed that part in the law that says I have to answer my door.) I didn't hear any knock on the door, I did hear some glass breaking in the back den...I grabbed my gun and saw this strange guy in my home, when he stepped towards me, I was in fear on my life...PERIOD...I'll take my chances, and the BG can take his.
    If every dirtbag who broke into someone's home became a dead intruder, home breakin's would decline...I'd have no regrets!

    Anyone is free to disagree, just don't break into my home. I will end your career, that is, if you cause me to fear for my life...

    I agree with Ted Nugent when he says he doesn't like repeat offenders, he likes dead offenders.
    Quote Originally Posted by citizen510 View Post
    Move to Tennessee! It is less complicated here. If they break in, they get a free pass to the pearly gates.
    +1 in Fl we have a very nice castle doctrine with no duty to retreat, warn, bellow out, etc... Dude, forcibly enters the castle he learns the doctrine.
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    Member Array Tye_Defender's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Knight View Post
    retsupt99 I don't know about OR law but in VA you might get charged with "lying in wait". It is a charge they sometimes use when the homeowner knows of a neighborhood problem and doesn't try to call before the shooting starts. I have heard of the charge when talking with local LEO's but have no evidence of anyone actually charged with it.
    There was a case in my area where a homeowner was charged with something similar, along with a few other charges. Basically, the homeowner worked every Saturday night. 3 or 4 weeks in a row he was coming home to find his house had been broken into and stuff was missing. They weren't taking big stuff, like the OP described, enough to fit in a backpack or something, but he was tired of it. He called the police, but all they did was make a report. He decided to take care of it, so he called in sick to work one Saturday and got a few of his friends to come over. They turned out the lights like he was gone and pulled out the video camera. When the criminal broke in, they beat him severely and then called the cops. They gave the cops the video tape as well, figuring that would prove that the guy broke in.

    The homeowner and his friends were brought up on assault charges, lying in wait charges, etc. Apparently, if you know a crime is going to be committed, you can't ambush the criminal. That wouldn't be "sporting".

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