Educating the Sheep

This is a discussion on Educating the Sheep within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; So went to the wife's fathers house and her 2 sisters and brother are in town for Thanksgiving. Walked into the door and like always ...

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Thread: Educating the Sheep

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array Hydrashok Glock's Avatar
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    Educating the Sheep

    So went to the wife's fathers house and her 2 sisters and brother are in town for Thanksgiving. Walked into the door and like always they greet us and are very warm and welcome. Well i cant even sit donw before one of her sisters husband comes over and asks if I still work where I worked and i said yes. He said ok you need to help me find a gun. I looked at him and said sure.

    Now let me tell you the wife's family is mostly all right wing but her one sister and husband is hardcore left wing and they live in liberal Chicago. Well of course the one sister starts making comments and a full on gun argument occurs. Now no one but the wife knows i carry and i would like to keep it that way so i stay out of it.

    Well they start attacking the right to carry a gun. Thant is when i had to step in. They, like most uneducated sheep, didn't know that in Ohio you could open carry let alone conceal carry. OMG they flipped then saying "oh that's is just great, your telling me people can just carry a gun and yadada yadada yadada!" So i chimed in saying that it is a strenuous process that costs money and the Sheriff needs to sign off on the application before it gets issued. They then said oh ok that is alright then.

    Next comes about how dangerous guns are and that tons of people are killed because of them. I then say that a normal person who takes the time effort and money to get a ccw is not going to mess it up by robbing someone or murdering someone. I also said that of all people and places Chicago has the highest homicide rate at 443 last year and you can not carry there compared to here where we had 86. They really warmed up to the idea and relaxed.

    I haven't converted them but i educated some ignorant people and now they look at it as a valid from of self defense.
    I think i did good and a proud that i informed 7 grown adults who live in a very anti-city. Please comment on improvements and what not.

    Thanks guys and gals.
    Last edited by JD; December 1st, 2008 at 11:03 AM. Reason: Spaced out text, corrected spelling.
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  3. #2
    Senior Member Array GreyGhost's Avatar
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    I think you did a great job. You got your points across and got them to see the your side. That alone is an amazing accomplishment. You probably will never totally change their minds but at least they're thinking.

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    jfl
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    Distinguished Member Array jfl's Avatar
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    You did very good. Congratulations

    I've got to the point I don't even discuss with "antis"; not that I meet a lot of them here.
    For me it is like "Teaching a pig to sing: you lose your time and aggravate the pig"
    Guess I'm getting old and tired ...

    Again, good job on your part; a burglary/home invasion, etc. might be all you need to get them to flip.
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    The second rule: "Bring enough gun"

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    You have more 'energy' than I do to discuss the value of firearms with a crowd of 'anti' relatives, but it sounds like it went well for you.

    With my family...
    I know where they all stand and they all know where I stand. Unless asked something about firearms, I keep my mouth closed and my weapon(s) are never seen or discussed.
    There are a few who have firearms, but for the most part, their weapons are locked in an attic......we'll see how that works for them in a home invasion.

    Stay armed...hope you convert some...stay safe!
    Last edited by RETSUPT99; November 30th, 2008 at 06:32 PM.
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    Member Array gogriz91's Avatar
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    Edumacation hurts doesn't it??? I never contemplated getting a Concealed Carry Permit 'til Obama got elected, now the damn thing can't get here fast enough. Trouble with most libs is when one or two idiots &*it their pants, libs want everyone to wear diapers.

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    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Good for you! Personally, I think educating the sheep poses us all a certain risk. Just simply making our point might induce some future recklessness in the herd. Not to say that some can't be converted, it's been known to be done. But where to start? And to show them the big picture. It's a major undertaking. Not saying it isn't worthwhile for some...just you have to ease them into it so they don't get excited and panic in front of the wolf. Comprende?

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    Senior Member Array Hydrashok Glock's Avatar
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    Thanks guys! It really means alot for you guys to say such things. You guys actually just made my day.
    I was worried at first but actually none of them asked me if i carried or if i owned because if that was the case things would have been diff. I only speek of firearms if approached or overhear someone talking about them.
    Oh i deffinatly understand the fighting with a wall. My parents absolutly hate guns... not antis per-se but just dont like me having them. The biggest problem that i have with it is that my dad actually had a crack head put a gun in his face and demand money. Even after that he thought about a gun but couldnt buy one. I guess the saying you cant teach an old dog new tricks has some truth.
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    I had similar discussions late last week with some of my family. This was right after my oldest brother and his son in-law returned from the gun store and were telling tales of how many guns we just bought that they wouldn't fit into the trunk of the car etc.

    Then it was brought up that the wife is going to take her CHL class in two weeks, and they were all like what, why are you doing that etc. I asked one sister what her plans are if she is attacked etc. she said she would push their nose into their brain. My comment was wow, I didn't know you were a martial arts expert or ninja. She finally admitted that she would probably end up taking what was coming to her in an event like that. Of course this sister lives two houses away from where a lady was raped a few years ago.

    I used the spare tire analogy on a neice and told her when she got back to Lubbock she should just take the spare tire out of her car and leave it in the garage. The next time she has a flat, she can just go back to her house and get it if she ever needs it. That didn't go over too well.

    We didn't make as much progress as you did Hydrashok, but it was still a good discussion. Got some of them thinking a little bit.
    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
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    Member Array mp45fan's Avatar
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    Strong work!
    Randy
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    Ex Member Array JOHNSMITH's Avatar
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    Excellent. Obviously I wasn't there, but from your description, I'd say you got the "upper hand" in that mini-debate simply due to the fac that you stayed cool. Anti arguments are filled with emotions and shouted statements, which usually results in sensory overload on the part of everyone within about 100 feet.

    By you staying calm, and using facts, you showed that gun owners aren't some crazy nuts who just say "SECOND AMENDMENT SECOND AMENDMENT" over and over without realizing that makes the anti's anti-gun sentiments stronger not because of the actual gun, but a few gun owners! What a sad thing to happen. The second amendment is important but if we want to engage others in conversation, we must do it in terms that matter to them/terms they will listen to/understand.

    Politicians have been doing this for thousands of years and so can we, except I believe that those of us here have more noble intentions than most politicians.

    Plus, shouting statements that have meaning to us but maybe not someone else ultimately makes us not so different from an anti from a pure debate perspective as far as constructive debate.

    Good work!

  12. #11
    Senior Member Array Hydrashok Glock's Avatar
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    Great point Paul. I normally would try and argue back or get really emotional but after getting nowhere with the wife with that ( together of 5yrs, still learning do's/dont's) i realized that taking a calm approach with statistical information that i might be able to get some where compared to a shouting match. That is one reason why the wife and some friends hate arguing with me is because i am a well informed person and i enjoy engaging in monotonous debates.
    I knew that studying this site as well as independent studies and articles, that said information would come in handy sooner or later.
    The choices you make today define you of who you are tommorow

    When you see the light at the end of the tunnel your life is not over..... it is just about to begin

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    Senior Member Array Hydrashok Glock's Avatar
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    Also i would like to appologise for any unclarity in the text. It was early and i was at work. Sometimes, as most of you know, it is difficult to give the whole story while keeping the reader interested and it not being a short novel.
    The choices you make today define you of who you are tommorow

    When you see the light at the end of the tunnel your life is not over..... it is just about to begin

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    Senior Member Array ntkb's Avatar
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    I do it everywhere I go and every chance I get, rarely do I wait for it to just come up. I find a way to work it into whatever conversation I can. Surprisingly it fits in many places most wouldn’t think it wouldn’t.

    Oh yeah good work and keep it up!

    There are some that think it isn't worth the time, but the way I see it the general public isn't anti gun exactly, they just don’t know any better.

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    Member Array user's Avatar
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    I was amazed at the willingness of your guests to actually listen.

    I don't like the phrase, "anti-gun"; instead I use, "pro-crime".

    I don't have a problem with the sheep; it's the cattle I can't deal with. Fear is the only thing that motivates them. So I try to counter the "Scary guns are out there so just give us more money and power and we'll make some rules against those scary guns" argument with "there are people who want you to be a victim in order to further their own agenda; and to promote fear, they inhibit self-defense. These are evil people who are out to get you killed for their own political purposes. Burglars are no where near as dangerous as those cynical politicians."
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    Senior Member Array Hydrashok Glock's Avatar
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    My biggest going factor forme is that they know i am educated and most of them even say that the media is BS. Every time they made a statment or comment based off here-say or media speak, i came back with a logical statment followed but proven information. Now if i can just convince my parents.
    The choices you make today define you of who you are tommorow

    When you see the light at the end of the tunnel your life is not over..... it is just about to begin

    COPS Protective Services

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