Am I legally obligated?

Am I legally obligated?

This is a discussion on Am I legally obligated? within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; To decipher or obey the intent of this sign? Saw this at the local Cox Communications office when I went to pay my bill yesterday. ...

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Thread: Am I legally obligated?

  1. #1
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Am I legally obligated?

    To decipher or obey the intent of this sign?

    Saw this at the local Cox Communications office when I went to pay my bill yesterday. No words or writing...just this sticker.
    Here's a specific excerpt from the Arkansas state laws concerning concealed carry:
    In
    addition to the places enumerated in this section, the carrying of a concealed
    handgun may be disallowed in any place in the discretion of the person or
    entity exercising control over the physical location of such place by the
    placing of a written notice clearly readable at a distance of not less than
    ten (10) feet that the @carrying of a handgun is prohibited.@ Provided no sign
    shall be required for private homes and any licensee entering a private home
    shall notify the occupants that he is carrying a concealed handgun.


  2. #2
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    My first guess as both an Instructor and a Deputy would be YES you are obligated to follow the sign.

    You might argue it in court and win.

    However,the ASP website has this in their list of places you cant carry...

    Any place where a property owner or manager has exercised discretion to prohibit the possession of a firearm.

    I would think that the above sign meant that intent, would'nt you?
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


    AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
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  3. #3
    Distinguished Member Array Agave's Avatar
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    That's not a written notice and is not readable.
    The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.

    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor, Tennessee Certified Instructor

  4. #4
    JD
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    Personally, I don't think that would qualify of "Written Notice"

  5. #5
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    Ask a lawyer .
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  6. #6
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky View Post
    Ask a lawyer .
    I may just do that with a phone call now that you mentioned it.

  7. #7
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    Unless your lawyer has dealt with such matters, he wont have a clue. If they reference the ASP website, he'll have to agree with me.

    Thats the first place most of them go to to check. Right or wrong. Then they'll check the Statutes.Then they'll see the difference and then they argue about it forever, in the meantime it'll cost you a fortune to get a simple answer. I have dealt with Cops,Prosecutors and lawyers over this very thing,enough that it'll make your head spin. Even asked a friend of mine that is a Judge what he thought.

    It always comes full circle and they say, why would you want to go in there armed anyway?
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


    AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
    Like custom guns and stuff? Check this out...
    http://bobbailey1959.wordpress.com/

  8. #8
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Unless your lawyer has dealt with such matters, he wont have a clue.
    I just e-mailed my question to the ASP regulatory folks. They were very helpful with my change of address ordeal last year...did it all through e-mail, print, and scan. I'll post my findings/their reply. Turnaround has been pretty fast with them in the past. Likely be today.

  9. #9
    Distinguished Member Array Agave's Avatar
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    It could mean "Beretta 92/96 prohibited."
    The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.

    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor, Tennessee Certified Instructor

  10. #10
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    My first guess as both an Instructor and a Deputy would be YES you are obligated to follow the sign.

    You might argue it in court and win.

    However,the ASP website has this in their list of places you cant carry...

    Any place where a property owner or manager has exercised discretion to prohibit the possession of a firearm.

    I would think that the above sign meant that intent, would'nt you?
    Initially, yes.....but by the looks, I could decipher it to mean they simply don't like Berettas. But I didn't find that part you have quoted. In my mind that as well requires a further definition. I by no means intend to claim ignorance of anything so long as I can help it...but I feel that the laws should be followed by both sides equally.

  11. #11
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agave View Post
    It could mean "Beretta 92/96 prohibited."
    Great minds............................

  12. #12
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    Holy Crap RamRod,

    I hope you do better than we do sometimes. We couldn't even get a simple answer about notarizing applications.

    For years we did it and when they changed the law back in January we quit doing it. We sent in over 600 applications and all of them were approved. Then, all of a sudden they started kicking them back...because they hadn't been notarized. Come to find out, they hired a new gal and she was kicking them back. I had some people in the same class get approved and other didn't. When I brought that to her attention, she kind of freaked, and referred me to her supervisor, who couldn't answer my question, who referred me to her supervisor who was the authority on it and she couldn't give me a matter of fact answer on it. Normally she is very good, but she couldn't find the answer I needed.

    We quit doing the notarizations because the drivers license was all the proof they needed and since you sign a waiver to let them use the picture on your drivers license it was considered redundant to notarize the applications.

    Now, we started do it again just to avoid any confusion, and when I set up a class now, I've got to have several notaries there to do it. Its a pain in the tail that we didn't have to do because we couldn't get a simple answer.

    I sincerely hope you do better, bet I'd be willing to bet you that they reference the ASP site and use the sentence that I did in post no.2.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


    AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
    Like custom guns and stuff? Check this out...
    http://bobbailey1959.wordpress.com/

  13. #13
    Member Array texasccw's Avatar
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    If I'm not mistaken this is not a legal "do not carry" sign in the state of Texas. It might be different in your state. Kind of off topic, but have you seen the signs that say "the unlicensed carry of a firearm in this establishment is forbidden"--or something of that nature?

  14. #14
    Senior Moderator
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    Here ya go...
    Arkansas State Police | Regulatory Services

    Number 15 on prohibited places.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


    AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
    Like custom guns and stuff? Check this out...
    http://bobbailey1959.wordpress.com/

  15. #15
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Red tape runaround. I've got about four forms to fill out and copies of my DL and CHL plus waiver, etc....for my renewal. Plan on doing my COT at Sturm's this Saturday after work since I'll be off work until after the first of the year and won't be going up north for a while. Steve is a notary also. I figure with all that 'package', I'll be using the USPS and sending it in. I never did receive a duplicate permit from doing the address change...they just have it on file. I hope my copies are okay since the addresses on my DL and CHL don't match.

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