Dog(s) as part of your Home Defense - Page 4

Dog(s) as part of your Home Defense

This is a discussion on Dog(s) as part of your Home Defense within the Off Topic & Humor Discussion forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Bunny I am sorry and I don't want to argue with you but I have read a couple of your dog posts in the past ...

Page 4 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast
Results 46 to 60 of 96

Thread: Dog(s) as part of your Home Defense

  1. #46
    Member Array muddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    328
    Bunny

    I am sorry and I don't want to argue with you but I have read a couple of your dog posts in the past and noticed that you are some kinda of a trainer or some such. I could not believe some of the stuff you were saying. You in fact need to get your info in order. You do however talk in circles quite well.

    I realize each dog is different just like humans but I was stating in generals. Sure there are a few labs out there that are meaner then any junk yard dog around but in general they are nice.

    Really you have a dog that will only eat from your hand or a dish you give her. Well dang I guess my pup running a goose down for 200 yards is nothing or how about a 200 yard blind retrieve through the swamp busting ice and frag the hole way. You can keep the parlor tricks for the rescue dogs.

    My lab will not chew the face off my grandson because he squealed or cried at just the right tone to kick in his pray drive. A lab may bite but rot's, pit's and dob's tend to bite and not stop.

    Good luck with that dog behavioral thing.

    O and BTW I have been at this dog deal a long time. I have done my research and talked with many professionals throughout the years.

    I agree there are way to many dogs out there in pounds and what not. Some of it is because of what I have stated and people got into something they didn't know about and couldn't handle. Most I think just don't realize how much responsibility an animal is and what it takes to train, feed and up keep one. We as humans can really suck when it comes to taking care of pets.


  2. #47
    VIP Member Array Dal1Celt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Clarksville, TN
    Posts
    2,672
    Here's my addition to weapons at my house.
    Attached Images
    "Without fear there can be no Courage!"

  3. #48
    Senior Member Array Pure Kustom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Mesa,Az
    Posts
    1,081
    Quote Originally Posted by Dal1Celt View Post
    Here's my addition to weapons at my house.
    Wolf? Nice looking dog.

  4. #49
    Member Array trob09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    53
    our goofy furball - relaxing and training
    Attached Images
    Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitude - Frederick Douglass

  5. #50
    VIP Member Array Dal1Celt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Clarksville, TN
    Posts
    2,672
    Quote Originally Posted by Pure Kustom View Post
    Wolf? Nice looking dog.
    He's actually a Eurasier, The breed was created in 1955. It's a mix of Keeshond, Samyoid, and Chow. German Breed
    "Without fear there can be no Courage!"

  6. #51
    Distinguished Member Array Bunny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    North Carolina - LKN
    Posts
    1,384
    Quote Originally Posted by muddy View Post
    Bunny

    I am sorry and I don't want to argue with you but I have read a couple of your dog posts in the past and noticed that you are some kinda of a trainer or some such. I could not believe some of the stuff you were saying. You in fact need to get your info in order. You do however talk in circles quite well.

    I realize each dog is different just like humans but I was stating in generals. Sure there are a few labs out there that are meaner then any junk yard dog around but in general they are nice.

    Really you have a dog that will only eat from your hand or a dish you give her. Well dang I guess my pup running a goose down for 200 yards is nothing or how about a 200 yard blind retrieve through the swamp busting ice and frag the hole way. You can keep the parlor tricks for the rescue dogs.

    My lab will not chew the face off my grandson because he squealed or cried at just the right tone to kick in his pray drive. A lab may bite but rot's, pit's and dob's tend to bite and not stop.

    Good luck with that dog behavioral thing.

    O and BTW I have been at this dog deal a long time. I have done my research and talked with many professionals throughout the years.

    I agree there are way to many dogs out there in pounds and what not. Some of it is because of what I have stated and people got into something they didn't know about and couldn't handle. Most I think just don't realize how much responsibility an animal is and what it takes to train, feed and up keep one. We as humans can really suck when it comes to taking care of pets.
    What are you talking about, "parlor tricks?" I HAD (years ago) a Pit. Because we lived in an area where there were some dogs being poisoned, we agreed it was safest to train her not to accept food from anyone but me, her owner. I have no idea what that has to do with your dog chasing a goose.

    You said that rescue dogs are bad for people with kids. That was a sweeping generalization and WRONG. I do agree that like humans, there are all different dog personalities, but in general, there's no majority that rescue dogs are bad with kids. That's ridiculous.

    No need to roll your eyes at me and get snarky about "the dog behavioral thing." This is my job, it's what I do, I happen to do a pretty good job at it. At least, my clients and the rescues I work for seem to think so. But while we're being snarky and rude, gee, good luck with the "dog thing" since you've been "at it a long time now" and all.

    When you're a professional in the field, maybe you'll think twice before spreading mistruths like they're gospel.
    Don't frisk me, I am the weapon.


    Sig Sauer P239 DAK (9mm)
    NRA Member & Pistol Instructor

    www.vanguardnc.com

  7. #52
    Member Array muddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    328
    Not trying to be rude or snarky. Just for my information what makes you a professional? Are you a professional trainer? What education do you have? Just want to know.

    Yes I said rescue dogs are bad for kids. You stated that this is what you do, evaluate a dog to make sure its safe to be around kids or people in general and if it should be put up for adoption or I assume put down. If put up for adoption what type of family it should go to. Right? Well why do you do this? Is it maybe that rescue dogs have had a bad past? Do they do this at all pounds and rescue places? I don't think our local pound dose this, so there's a chance of getting a problem dog.

  8. #53
    Member Array BaserRonin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    304
    Quote Originally Posted by muddy View Post
    Here is a bit of advice from a bird dog owner who trains his own. Get on a dog or hunting forum and do some research about training and breads. From what I have read above there is a lot of wife's tails and bull. Also stay away from rescue dogs if you have kids especially kids (grand kids) that aren't in the house all the time. You are asking about breeds on a defensive forum so of course you will get the Boxer, Pit, Rot, etc. There are better breeds out there for family pets which will do well as an early alert system. A dog that will truly defend your home would not be a suitable pet. People can believe what they want about there dog and its defensive quality but generally a person who isn't afraid of dogs and has a little treat go a long way towards shutting down these defensive quality's. A dog tends to act meaner and be more aggressive when its pack is around because it will defend its pack not its stuff, plus a pack works together to defend its self so write or wrong your dog thinks you have its back when its defending you. Most of a dogs deteriorate is the noise it makes which alerts people to the presence of a BG as well as the BG not knowing if the dog will chew his leg of or not. There is always that uncertainty. Most BG are stupid, but the ones that know or know that there is something worth doing in your house will get around your dog.
    What? Where in the world...? I don't even know where to start, so I will attempt to go piece by piece. Most of these things are so wrong they can't even be argued because there it zero actual data to back them.

    "Also stay away from rescue dogs if you have kids especially kids"
    what? that is the most ridiculous thing I have heard all day, and I am on a DOD contract right now. I could find zero data to back up your claim.

    "You are asking about breeds on a defensive forum so of course you will get the Boxer, Pit, Rot, etc. There are better breeds out there for family pets which will do well as an early alert system. A dog that will truly defend your home would not be a suitable pet."
    American Pit Bull Terriers are people friendly to a fault and actually make extremely poor guard dogs because of this. They are excellent family dogs, and always have been because they love people. I will attach a pic of Helen Keller with her pit, just because I like the picture...not because it furthers my argument...
    Pet Pit Bull - Breed Information

    "A dog tends to act meaner and be more aggressive when its pack is around because it will defend its pack not its stuff, plus a pack works together to defend its self so write or wrong your dog thinks you have its back when its defending you."
    At least you have heard of pack behavior, but that was a sweeping generality that had little to do with reality. Sure, your dog sees you as the pack leader, we all have seen Cesar Millan do this thing, but more aggressive when it's pack is around because it defends it's pack rather then it's stuff? What does that even mean? You are his pack, remember.

    The last few sentences are correct, a dogs deterrent to a BG is his bark.
    Attached Images

  9. #54
    Member Array trob09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    53
    Quote Originally Posted by BaserRonin View Post
    The last few sentences are correct, a dogs deterrent to a BG is his bark.
    I would say this is -generally- true. But for PPD-trained dogs, there is more behind the bark. Most pet owners are unwilling or unable to commit the time and effort needed for establishing and maintaining personal-protection skills in their dogs. Even for those owners that are, not every dog (regardless of breed or lineage) is capable of full PPD training.
    Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitude - Frederick Douglass

  10. #55
    Distinguished Member Array Bunny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    North Carolina - LKN
    Posts
    1,384
    Quote Originally Posted by muddy View Post
    Not trying to be rude or snarky. Just for my information what makes you a professional? Are you a professional trainer? What education do you have? Just want to know.

    Yes I said rescue dogs are bad for kids. You stated that this is what you do, evaluate a dog to make sure its safe to be around kids or people in general and if it should be put up for adoption or I assume put down. If put up for adoption what type of family it should go to. Right? Well why do you do this? Is it maybe that rescue dogs have had a bad past? Do they do this at all pounds and rescue places? I don't think our local pound dose this, so there's a chance of getting a problem dog.
    Yes, I am a professional behaviorist and trainer for canines, and a trainer for equines. (Though my abilities are limited with horses, I have a difficult time relating in "prey animal" mentality, so I mostly just break out the young ones and work on sacking out all ages, or minor problem behaviors.) I work for 4 national 501(c) 3 rescues, and I am a back-up call/foster home for a few local shelters/rescues as well. I'm also a handler for therapy dogs. Currently my male is a therapy dog and my female is slated to get certified and registered at the end of the month. I take what I do VERY seriously.

    I have a 4 year college degree and many years apprenticing under other trainers. But I'm always learning, it's a nonstop process, in my opinion.

    When I evaluate dogs for rescue, I test for several things. Our main concern is whether or not the animal is a bite risk to humans and other animals. If they are considered a bite risk to humans, we will not accept them into rescue. No, we don't usually put the dogs down. In fact, it's against policy to accept a dog into rescue just to put them down. If they do not seem a likely candidate for adoption, and we can not in good conscience place them, we will not accept them into rescue in the first place.

    If a dog is considered a risk to other dogs or cats, poultry, farm animals, etc, we will note that on the dog's adoption profile and NEVER adopt to a home with those animals. We have a 4-step screening process for adopters and foster homes, including background checks, veterinary references, and at least one home visit by a trained rescue evaluator.

    If the dog has issues with children, same protocol as above.

    If the dog has ANY bite history other than accidental (dog was trying to bite a flea on its leg the moment you came over and grabbed its leg, oops!) then we will not accept into rescue because we can not place the dog in good faith, it would be too much of a risk to society.

    When I evaluate dogs, I take several hours for ONE consult. I try and find every possible trigger for the animal that I can, but I do it gradually, with lots of "fun time" in between. I look for signs of past abuse (there are several), etc. It's important to find those triggers and figure out what the dog's threshold is so that we know where the best (And worst) placements would be. For example, a dog that had been kicked in the past would do poorly with anyone who has a shuffling gait. Shuffling feet are the first and last thing right before a swift kick, so shuffling gaits that set the dogs off are an indication fo prior kicking/abuse and someone who has a bad leg would be a bad match for the dog.

    We evaluate because to not do so would be a horrible irresponsibility. All the shelters I know of around here do behavioral evals to see if each dog is suitable for adoption or should be put down. I'd imagine it's a huge liability if they didn't. There is a behavioral director here at our local shelter, and a staff under that person, all qualified to do the evals. I'd imagine your shelter might as well, but you can call them to find out.
    Don't frisk me, I am the weapon.


    Sig Sauer P239 DAK (9mm)
    NRA Member & Pistol Instructor

    www.vanguardnc.com

  11. #56
    Member Array Censored's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    154
    Quote Originally Posted by Bunny View Post
    Yes, I am a professional behaviorist and trainer for canines, and a trainer for equines. (Though my abilities are limited with horses, I have a difficult time relating in "prey animal" mentality, so I mostly just break out the young ones and work on sacking out all ages, or minor problem behaviors.) I work for 4 national 501(c) 3 rescues, and I am a back-up call/foster home for a few local shelters/rescues as well. I'm also a handler for therapy dogs. Currently my male is a therapy dog and my female is slated to get certified and registered at the end of the month. I take what I do VERY seriously.

    I have a 4 year college degree and many years apprenticing under other trainers. But I'm always learning, it's a nonstop process, in my opinion.

    When I evaluate dogs for rescue, I test for several things. Our main concern is whether or not the animal is a bite risk to humans and other animals. If they are considered a bite risk to humans, we will not accept them into rescue. No, we don't usually put the dogs down. In fact, it's against policy to accept a dog into rescue just to put them down. If they do not seem a likely candidate for adoption, and we can not in good conscience place them, we will not accept them into rescue in the first place.

    If a dog is considered a risk to other dogs or cats, poultry, farm animals, etc, we will note that on the dog's adoption profile and NEVER adopt to a home with those animals. We have a 4-step screening process for adopters and foster homes, including background checks, veterinary references, and at least one home visit by a trained rescue evaluator.

    If the dog has issues with children, same protocol as above.

    If the dog has ANY bite history other than accidental (dog was trying to bite a flea on its leg the moment you came over and grabbed its leg, oops!) then we will not accept into rescue because we can not place the dog in good faith, it would be too much of a risk to society.

    When I evaluate dogs, I take several hours for ONE consult. I try and find every possible trigger for the animal that I can, but I do it gradually, with lots of "fun time" in between. I look for signs of past abuse (there are several), etc. It's important to find those triggers and figure out what the dog's threshold is so that we know where the best (And worst) placements would be. For example, a dog that had been kicked in the past would do poorly with anyone who has a shuffling gait. Shuffling feet are the first and last thing right before a swift kick, so shuffling gaits that set the dogs off are an indication fo prior kicking/abuse and someone who has a bad leg would be a bad match for the dog.

    We evaluate because to not do so would be a horrible irresponsibility. All the shelters I know of around here do behavioral evals to see if each dog is suitable for adoption or should be put down. I'd imagine it's a huge liability if they didn't. There is a behavioral director here at our local shelter, and a staff under that person, all qualified to do the evals. I'd imagine your shelter might as well, but you can call them to find out.
    +1
    I had Australian Shep that would only eat from me. Saved his life when other dogs at the barn got poisoned. Go Bunny!
    --
    If I'm repeating myself, or repeating myself differently, it's probably 'cause of the brain cells I've murdered and the selective memory caused by concussions, contusions and confusions. Oh yeah, and that one night in Dallas.

    NRA-Life Member
    ATA- Life Member
    --Guns? What guns?--

  12. #57
    Ex Member Array PNUT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    TN
    Posts
    913
    Sorry Muddy,
    You might know how to train a duck dog but there's a difference between that and knowing how dogs think, The comments in your post make that clear.
    I can vouch that I've been advised by Bunny on ways to treat my dogs aggression issues and that they have in fact worked. He'll still eat someone at the house or in the truck but now I can take him places and he behaves himself. He'll even be nice with people and kids at the park, he used to dislike children. Previously ,I would have to leave him at home when I'd take my other dogs out, no reason for it, no abuse or anything, he was just that way. I also had a rescue Boxer that was the biggest boxer I've ever seen, humongous. He was so gentle that he'd play with the little kids next door, he'd crawl on his belly over to them to be petted, he wasn't taught that, it was his idea. Lots of dogs aren't in rescue because they were abused or problem dogs. Like your post said, too many people get a dog and don't realize just what it takes to maintain them.
    Don't try giving a treat to a dog that wants to bite you, he'll take your hand and leave the treat. A dog that is wound up could not care less about food. I've tried to condition my dog just that way. Not once has he ever been even remotely interested in the treat. When he sees people or situations that set him off he isn't going to all of a sudden stop for a snack. It aint happening.
    I grew up with two attack trained Dobermans in the house, they made great pets and would absolutely protect the house and everything in it. Can't tell you how many other times I've had to get people from outside because the dog/ dogs would have them cornered. They should have paid attention to the Beware of Dogs signs.....anyway, a dog can protect and be a great pet You are very wrong about that.

  13. #58
    Member Array BaserRonin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    304
    Quote Originally Posted by trob09 View Post
    I would say this is -generally- true. But for PPD-trained dogs, there is more behind the bark. Most pet owners are unwilling or unable to commit the time and effort needed for establishing and maintaining personal-protection skills in their dogs. Even for those owners that are, not every dog (regardless of breed or lineage) is capable of full PPD training.
    How does one go about properly training a PPD dog? The thought never crossed my mind before now, but is an interesting idea.

  14. #59
    Member Array BaserRonin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    304
    Quote Originally Posted by PNUT View Post
    I can vouch that I've been advised by Bunny on ways to treat my dogs aggression issues and that they have in fact worked. He'll still eat someone at the house or in the truck but now I can take him places and he behaves himself. He'll even be nice with people and kids at the park, he used to dislike children.
    How does one go about training out aggressive behavior?
    My sisters lab/healer is people aggressive sometimes, I don't know the link. One day she will be fine with a person, the next she will not. Typical behavior is to hold her ground for a few minutes, barking and snarling with her hackles up, but retreat to a safe spot when she sees the person is not going to leave. She then proceeds to bark until the person is gone. Aggression, but probably fear induced? This is particularly bad because if approached by the person she will snap at them. I do not think she has ever actually bitten, but the threat is there.
    Good for waking you up in the middle of the night, but bad 99% of the time.

  15. #60
    Member Array trob09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    53
    Quote Originally Posted by BaserRonin View Post
    How does one go about properly training a PPD dog? The thought never crossed my mind before now, but is an interesting idea.
    Several ways. First, you might use a PPD trainer to either train a dog you own (if it has the capability) or you can have them provide a fully-trained dog (for some serious $$). There are numerous sources for this on the web if you search for personal protection dogs. Second, you can train yourself and your dog in any one of the 'protection sports' available - Schutzhund, Mondio ring, French Ring, PSA, etc. Each of these outlets are more club-based with varying degrees of focus on sport development or dog/handler development. Some - like Schutzhund - are more formal in their approach while others can be less so. This will also vary depending on the individual club and the make-up of it's members. In that way, it is much like martial-arts where some schools are more focused on tradition and formal patterns where others are more focused on surviving a street-brawl - even within the same art.

    I (more accurately, we) do Schutzhund training which tends to be more sport-oriented and less attack-dog oriented. The best thing is to search for what's around you and visit a few clubs/schools to see if something fits. Schutzhund (and each of the other protection sports) is as time-consuming as my other major hobby (technical scuba diving). It's not something that you do for a few weeks and are done. it is every week, several times a week and is a life-long activity.
    Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitude - Frederick Douglass

Page 4 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Selecting a Handgun for Defense: Part 1. Semi-Automatics
    By JD in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 84
    Last Post: July 23rd, 2014, 09:38 PM
  2. Not good for the home team -- sheriff, chief magistrate part ways
    By DaveH in forum Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: July 25th, 2010, 09:26 PM
  3. Selecting a Handgun for Defense: Part 1. Semi-Automatics
    By JD in forum Reference & "How To" Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: December 4th, 2009, 10:33 AM
  4. LMS Defense Home Defense - Defensive Medical COMBO / Yuba City, CA / March 8-10, 2008
    By Tony Siciliano in forum Defensive Carry & Tactical Training
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: February 6th, 2008, 01:55 PM
  5. Part Range Report, Part Ammo Question - Rossi .38spl
    By Joshua M. Smith in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: March 7th, 2007, 12:38 PM

Search tags for this page

best home defense rifle 19 yrs old can buy

,

pithuskeymix pics

Click on a term to search for related topics.