April 25th, 2006 12:32 PM
April 25th, 2006 01:20 PM
Richard - no link to hand, sorry, but there do seem to be some blanket rules to apply, even tho there can be some state by state peripheral aspects.
As I have understood it - any transfer across state lines requires an FFL involvement. If long gun then shipping to an FFL for logging and pick up. If handgun then FFL to FFL. That said, when it comes to shipping there seems to be sometimes a need for shipper to see FFL both ends regardless.
In state is where things seem to vary somewhat - in as much as ftf deals can often be done with no hassles or paperwork - on a longarm anyways.
I have erred on safe side tho and gone the FFL route about every time, except when I bought my 870 from a very local guy. Handguns anyways for me have always seemed to involve dealer at source or, thru a state to state transfer.
Whether there is a truly definitive readable summation of the whole thing I am not sure, tho it would he handy as a reference - just can't think of one right now. Each state should of course have available a copy of its own statutes for perusal.
Chris - P95
NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.
"To own a gun and assume that you are armed
is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."
- a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.
April 25th, 2006 02:23 PM
I've never seen a readable summary... just use the usual ATF book, but it will give you a headache in a hurry.
state links will tell what's needed for sales (and you get to read law at the same time, how fun.....blech... I swear we could all get together with a six pack and come up with better stuff that would make sense)
What P95 said on shipping is the same thing I follow.
April 25th, 2006 03:06 PM
Great question. I'm not sure that this is covered anywhere. Can a state make their own laws ref firearms being sold from one non-FFL to another non-FFL ?? I really can't imagine it.
If I want to sell a firearm to an individual, that is not known to me to be a convicted felon, why can't I do that?? Also,as a non-FFL I have no way of doing a background check on the buyer AND,I do not consider that my responsibility anyway. Do I even have to keep records ??? I doubt it.
This is one reason that (during the klinton years) I let my FFL of 12 years expire without renewal. Can I go to a gunshow,rent a table,and sell my firearms to anyone that has a fist full of money ?? I would assume that I can. This is probably without even as much as knowing the buyer's name. It probably would be my responsibility to ensure that the buyer is of the legal age though.
Just for the record.......what I do is ::: eyeball their drivers license,write down all info on it+their telephone number. The selling price and the time and date delivered to the buyer. Also the description of the firearm and the ser.no.They hand me the money and they can take the weapon anywhere they want to. It is their responsibility that they abide by all state and federal laws that has to do with transportation of firearms. This,in my opinion only.---------
Last edited by RSSZ; April 25th, 2006 at 08:26 PM.
April 25th, 2006 10:33 PM
Great info above guys! I appreciate the help! Any government statutes and regulations give me headaches now days - even the tax code and regs.
I've decided if I go FFL to FFL I minimize my risks - whatever they might be. I can have a buyer represent they're not a felon, over 21, etc., but by having an FFL at each end I think I isolate myself as well as possible.
If FTF I think I'll have a written Bill of Sale the buyer and seller both sign, with all of the appropriate data, as well as a representation from the buyer that they are not a felon, etc. I'll also get a copy of their state drivers license, and match that to the buyers pic, ID etc.
I think each state can absolutely write statutes and regs that control this within their boundaries - but not in interstate commerce. So state laws apply within a state, and if out of state, then Fed, but to be safe - I'm gonna follow ALL of them - state of seller & buyer, and fed.
I don't want to be some guys girlfriend!
April 26th, 2006 07:41 AM
I think that (in most cases) both persons could just both go into any FFL Gun Shop & have the serial # of the particular firearm registered to the other individual and that would effect a legal transfer of that firearm within the same State.
Or the firearm could be shipped one FFL Dealer (in one State) to the other FFL Dealer (in the other State) & then the firearm N.I.C.S. registered to the legal person that you want to have it.
Doing that enters the firearm Serial # into the National Instant Check System
It gets weird because you can "Gift" a firearm to a family member & a few other things.
To be 100% safe I would call your local ATF.
I have called them a few times with specific gun related questions & their agents have always been helpful & polite.
They are not "out to get" citizens that want to comply with the Local, State, & Fed Gun Regs.
I've called them before with questions & no Black Helicopters ever landed on my front lawn.
Just write down the day you called - the time you called & the name of the agent that you were speaking with.
April 26th, 2006 10:49 AM
April 26th, 2006 09:16 PM
Wikipedia! Brilliant! Thanks for all the info, all of you!
By dbraves8 in forum The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion
Last Post: July 1st, 2010, 10:18 PM
By Sheriff3006 in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
Last Post: August 12th, 2009, 11:32 PM
By Rustynuts in forum General Firearm Discussion
Last Post: September 9th, 2008, 03:07 PM
By NESTO in forum General Firearm Discussion
Last Post: November 21st, 2006, 10:49 PM
By Gunner in forum General Firearm Discussion
Last Post: February 10th, 2006, 07:34 PM
» DefensiveCarry Sponsors