OC in Michigan?

This is a discussion on OC in Michigan? within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I know that technically it is legal to open carry in Michigan according to state law. However, the city in which I live has an ...

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Thread: OC in Michigan?

  1. #1
    Member Array clark81's Avatar
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    OC in Michigan?

    I know that technically it is legal to open carry in Michigan according to state law. However, the city in which I live has an ordinance that says that it is illegal to do so. But I found this online that seems to say that state law trumps this.

    3) No local ordinance concerning firearm possession is enforceable due to Michigan’s preemption law.

    In 1990, the Michigan legislature enacted MCL 123.1102 which provides, in pertinent part: A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.

    THE MICHIGAN APPEALS COURT CONCLUDED: April 29, 2003 9:10 am. v No. 242237 In sum, we conclude that § 1102 is a statute that specifically imposes a prohibition on local units of government from enacting and enforcing any ordinances or regulations pertaining to the transportation and possession of firearms, and thus preempts any ordinance or regulation of a local unit of government concerning these areas.

    Further, we conclude that the specific language of the 2000 amendments to MCL 28.421 et seq., particularly §§ 5c and 5o, which were adopted more than a decade after the enactment of § 1102, do not repeal § 1102 or otherwise reopen this area to local regulation of the carrying of firearms.17 Accordingly, we hold that the Ferndale ordinance is preempted by state law and, consequently, we reverse.

    MCRGO v. Ferndale: The Michigan Court of Appeals held that local units of government may not impose restrictions upon firearms possession.


    Does anybody know for sure about this?

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  3. #2
    Member Array Kovernm's Avatar
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    You might get a better answer over on the open carry forum http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/fo...p?106-Michigan, but I have heard that is the case. State law trumps local ordinance.

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    Member Array clark81's Avatar
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    Thanks for the link. That was very helpful.

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    Member Array Rasher's Avatar
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    Yes indeed state law does trump "ANYTHING'' any city may "want", you can oc in your/any city/township/county. Thats not to say you wont be harrased or even locked up, by uneducated or defient police, it can and still does happen, do your homework visit sites like Migunowners.org--opencarry.com(has a sub link for MI)--moc.org(ithink might be .com) and this site as well, do your homework know the laws before you OC, cuase the laws are slightly different for OC when you dont have a cpl than when you do, you need to what they are and when they apply

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    Array RoadRunner71's Avatar
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    It is called pre-emption and it is legitimate. To say that OC is legal is a slight mis-statement. I believe the better way to describe it is that it is not ILLEAGAL. As Rasher said, that may not prevent you from being hassled or even cited/arrested. The way I look at it is, you have to know your environment and know how much hassling you are willing to deal with.
    "Mind own business"
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    Member Array 007BondJames's Avatar
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    Look up the Royal Oak Art, Beats & Eats! It a great example of pre-emption.
    http://www.clickondetroit.com/commun...09/detail.html
    Hitler once said, “The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerers who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing.”

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    Member Array jamierah's Avatar
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    The state law or lack therefor does preempt the local ordinance. There are a couple of ways to go about getting your city to change it's ordinance.

    1. Print off a copy of the Ferndale court decision http://www.mcrgo.org/mcrgo/doc_pdf/0...e_decision.pdf and go to your city manager/mayor and advise him that the cities ordinance is unenforceable and opens the city to potential lawsuits. Don't make a big deal about your 2A rights being infringed upon cause they don't care, be concerned about bad publicity for the city and potential costs to the city, that's what they care about. Give him some time, one or two council meetings, to bring it up if he doesn't speak up at a council meeting try to get a couple of friends to come with you, NOT open carrying. Be respectful and you will probably get it changed. If they start stonewalling you get in contact with MCGO http://mcrgo.org/mcrgo/default.asp they are one of the plaintiffs in the Ferndale case.

    2. Conceal 6 recording devices on your body and have a friend follow you with a hidden camera while walking around city hall OC the biggest chrome handgun you can find. When the police show up start arguing about the unconstitutionality of the law calling the city council fascists that want to destroy America. This way you'll be able to sell the video of you getting tasered and arrested to Worlds Dumbest to help pay for your lawyer. The ordinance will eventually get repealed because it is illegal not because you made a fool of yourself.









    OK for anybody that doesn't recognize satire, I wasn't serious on the last part. Not to knock the OC crowd that pushes the boundaries a little because they do get results. By the time the news media is done editing the story that's what it looks like, but the reason they get results is the law is on our side not because they backed politicians into a corner. If you read the stories about Royal Oak the city council will most likely try to lobby the state to change the law now. If the problem had been taken care of in a low key manner nobody would have to try and save face and the matter would just drop. Just my $.02
    We the willing, being guided by the unknowing, Doing impossible feats, for the ungrateful, Have been doing so much with so little for so long,
    We now feel qualified to do, absolutely anything, with literally nothing

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    Distinguished Member Array bigmacque's Avatar
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    Part 1 of jamierah's post is reasonable and a good way to go about things. Simply start by approaching the city council and making them aware of the state statute, and how that invalidates their statute, and then get a good grass roots thing going to change or eradicate the local ordnance.
    I'm in favor of gun control -- I think every citizen should have control of a gun.
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    Member Array Jblack44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigmacque View Post
    Part 1 of jamierah's post is reasonable and a good way to go about things. Simply start by approaching the city council and making them aware of the state statute, and how that invalidates their statute, and then get a good grass roots thing going to change or eradicate the local ordnance.
    This is what I and many others have done. In regards to my city, I emailed the council and informed them of there out of date ordinances. It was resolved in a matter of a few months. More and more cities are updating their illegal ordinances and are up to speed with OC in general. But as warned above, this does not mean you may not come up against a officer who doesn't know the laws.

  11. #10
    Member Array The Expert's Avatar
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    Some Michigan cities just have not figured out what the law is. I live in Taylor and they're like that. While the city is "working on" rewriting the offending ordinance (read "trying to find a way to make open carry illegal regardless of state law"), the police department has been put on notice not to harass those who OC in Taylor.

    It really wasn't much of an issue as, until recently, nobody bothered to open carry because of the pervasive thinking in the minds of the public that doing so is illegal by default...which is of course the exact opposite of the way things really are.

    The resurgence of OC in Michigan has earned those who choose to exercise their rights in such a way the reputation of being upstarts who are looking to rock the boat and get attention. They occasionally throw in the accusation about guns compensating for something as well.
    In the Marine Corps I carried one of the standard Beretta M9 service pistols in a traditional duty holster. Now it's a 1911 in a SuperTuck. I'm glad for the upgrade.

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    VIP Member Array Sheldon J's Avatar
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    They have hashed and re hashed this out over at the MGO forum..... Drop by there for mostly MI gun owner stuff.....

    Most of the issues have been with small municipalities not knowing what the law is and their local PA or PD trying to make thing up as they go..... Such as trying to say OC on a motorcycle is CC, which according to the MI state police web site is is not......
    "The sword dose not cause the murder, and the maker of the sword dose not bear sin" Rabbi Solomon ben Isaac 11th century

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    Distinguished Member Array Spec's Avatar
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    To the OP if you post message me what city you live in I can bring it to the attention of my lead members in Michigan Open Carry and see if we have had any communications with your city.....
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    If you find yourself in a fair fight your tactics stink.

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