The Logic of 'Open Carry' and LEO's Attitude - Page 8

The Logic of 'Open Carry' and LEO's Attitude

This is a discussion on The Logic of 'Open Carry' and LEO's Attitude within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; IMG_0220.jpg I own an auto restoration and custom automotive shop and the above sign is posted next to the entry door of my business. Once ...

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Thread: The Logic of 'Open Carry' and LEO's Attitude

  1. #106
    Member Array chrisdridley's Avatar
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    IMG_0220.jpg
    I own an auto restoration and custom automotive shop and the above sign is posted next to the entry door of my business. Once you walk through the doors, you will see 5 or 6 people working behind the counter with side arms in plain site. While there are home invasions and business being robbed in broad daylight all around me regularly, I have had no such issue. There are days when there are large sums of cash in the shop and we don't worry about people with bad intentions. We get dozens of customers every day....many families bringing children in to look at our work...and not one customer has been distressed by our firearms. I firmly believe that OC has kept me, my employees and my business safe.
    Just down the street from me, a very good man and business owner who CC's was surprised in the middle of the day when two men burst through the front door carrying shotguns, blew the security cameras off the walls and ceilings, hitting a customer in the process and robbed him of $37. When asked why he didn't pull his weapon, the owner said that the shotguns were in his face to quick for him to do anything.
    With me and many of my employees carrying sidearms in plain site, we send a clear message. There is no doubt in a bad guys mind that if he or she comes into my shop with bad intentions, they will pay dearly for their actions.
    Jack Dempsey said that the best defense is a good offense.....


  2. #107
    Senior Member Array Freedom Doc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crazybastid8 View Post
    I don't believe in open carry, it shouldn't exist. If someone qualifies to open carry, they should be able to conceal carry.
    The so-called Gold Star open carry states (of which there are a fair number) "qualify" people to open carry by the fact that they are alive. That is, in those states (mostly) they do not have a law that says "open carry is OK"; their laws say NOTHING at all about open carry. That is, it is legal because there is no law against it.

    Those are the real FREE states!
    LongRider likes this.
    Anti-gunners seem to believe that if we just pass enough laws, we can have utopia. Unfortunately, utopia is NOT one of our choices.

  3. #108
    Member Array FTG-05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chada View Post
    The police are well aware of the law its just a form of harassment. I can understand their perspective. They have guns and they don't want citizens to have them as they perceive that as dangerous. Now that assumption is untrue but it appears to be the assumption that many of them tend to operate under. If you go to YouTube and type in open carry harassment or open carry you can find many people videoing such interactions with the police. Even when the police know that the people have the right to be armed and open carry and admit to knowing the law they still come to "investigate" and demand to see IDs and question the people about their activities. There is one from Maine where the police harass a person for around ten minutes and the person keeps asking if he is free to leave and the police keep demanding his ID and tell him no. Well after a while they finally just stand there and quit talking to the guy altogether and refuse to answer whether or not he is free to leave and he finally says that he will take their silence as permission to leave and does so.
    I agree. And here's an excellent example of it: Tuscaloosa Police Chief Anderson orders police to "challenge" open carriers

    “I don’t agree that people should be allowed to carry a weapon openly,” [Tuscaloosa Police Chief Steve] Anderson said. “I have instructed my officers to ***challenge anyone they see carrying a weapon openly*** to make sure that they have the right to carry a weapon. Some people, like felons, cannot carry a weapon. They (people carrying weapons) will be treated with respect and dignity but they will be challenged.”


    However, it looks like we're making headway on this one: Chief Anderson of the Tuscaloosa Police Dept letter to me.

    "I hope this email finds you doing well. I wanted to clarify my comments in the Tuscaloosa News to you and I hope you will forward this email on to other individuals who support Open Carry in our community. The Tuscaloosa Police Department will not harass or intimidate individuals in our community who choose to exercise their rights to carry a firearm openly. We will however, respond to any calls or complaints from citizens concerning this issue. In responding we will be respectful as we attempt to investigate the call or complaint. Our response will be consistent with the guidelines of reasonable suspicion and probable cause. [snip]"

  4. #109
    Member Array MichiganCCW's Avatar
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    All law abiding citizens that own a firearm should carry it with them at all times. Law abiding citizens compose the majority in this country. We have all the rights to follow what ever laws are on the books ;open carry is a law that should be used by anyone who qualifies. People get used to seeing their neighbors with guns ;it is not inherently nervracking to anyone but criminals. CARRY ON

  5. #110
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichiganCCW View Post
    All law abiding citizens that own a firearm should carry it with them at all times. Law abiding citizens compose the majority in this country. We have all the rights to follow what ever laws are on the books ;open carry is a law that should be used by anyone who qualifies. People get used to seeing their neighbors with guns ;it is not inherently nervracking to anyone but criminals. CARRY ON
    I carry to protect my loved ones and myself. I am not carrying to prove a point, desensitize the public to firearms or any other reason. Ya know, an acquaintance of mine thinks like you do. He is almost insulted that sometimes I don't carry (when I go for runs or in my house). I have a car but I don;t drive it everywhere (yeah I know, it is a privelge not a right). When I go vote I don't post it on Facebook to let everyone know I am exercising my rights. I don't announce to folks that I am going to church to express my religion freely. Why should I OC all the time, just because I can? I can use profanities at passing vehicles to express my 1st A rights but I don't. I think we get so wound up about the 2nd A and folks are always trying to prove a point. It is our right to carry and OC if legal where you live. Then if that what floats your baot, fine. But don't expect everybody to carry just because.

  6. #111
    Member Array MichiganCCW's Avatar
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    It is not about proving a point ; it is about self defense. I live in the most violent crime ridden city in America( based on FBI stats) were anything can happen at any time. Here it almost a necessity. OC lets criminals know that you are not a good "mark"

  7. #112
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichiganCCW View Post
    It is not about proving a point ; it is about self defense. I live in the most violent crime ridden city in America( based on FBI stats) were anything can happen at any time. Here it almost a necessity. OC lets criminals know that you are not a good "mark"
    Well, then I guess I misunderstood you. This is what I based it on:
    All law abiding citizens that own a firearm should carry it with them at all times.
    You didn't mention that we are all at the same risk. Anyway, as far as OC. I OC when I snow shoe or hike or walk my dog. My biggest threat is bears and other 4 legged critters. Although I can OC in NH I do not in the "cities". IMO it is not a deterrent and now it is something else I need to worry about vis a vis a BG wanting to steal my gun. I am safer by using SA and keeping myself out of situations. I think CC makes more sense in MY situation. Plus it does bring unwarranted attention good and bad. Sometimes I see folks on the trail and they stop me and ask about why I am carrying. I tell them for protection and then it is more questions. I am not an ambassador nor a teacher for guns. I want to be left alone.

  8. #113
    Member Array MichiganCCW's Avatar
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    Michigan is a shall issue CCW state but it still takes about $300 to get your permit ,that is a hinderance to a lot of LAC. So they have the option to OC and be perfectly legal. I personally like to CC because it gathers no attention by citizens or LE. CARRY ON !

  9. #114
    VIP Member Array LongRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom Doc View Post
    The so-called Gold Star open carry states (of which there are a fair number) "qualify" people to open carry by the fact that they are alive. That is, in those states (mostly) they do not have a law that says "open carry is OK"; their laws say NOTHING at all about open carry. That is, it is legal because there is no law against it.

    Those are the real FREE states!
    True that. A constant source of amazement to me is the number of anti 2A posts we find on a pro gun forum, from those who want to restrict the Constitutional Rights of Law Abiding Citizens.
    carracer likes this.
    Abort the Obamanation not the Constitution

    Those who would, deny, require permit, license, certification, or authorization for me to bear arms are as vile, dangerous & evil as those who would molest, abuse, assault, rape or murder my family

  10. #115
    Member Array jwinkeler's Avatar
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    I suppose one of the original posters is correct I open carry in Virginia because I cannot apply for a CHP for 3 years(I am 18 and a CHP requires you to be 21)

  11. #116
    Distinguished Member Array BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    I OC in Krogers, Walmarts, Taco Bell, restaurants, and any where I want here and have never had a problem with it from anyone.

    I OC with a Ruger P95 with a 15 round magazine and an extra magazine.
    carracer likes this.

  12. #117
    Senior Member Array boatail's Avatar
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    I don't OC, that's just by choice. I want that little element of surprise on my side. There are times when it would work better, and be easier and quicker to draw. It would probably save me a lot of money on holsters and such also. But, like I said, I prefer CC.
    What does trouble me reading this though, are the many references to LEO "rolling up" on a report of "someone carrying a gun". I can understand them checking things out, but not to the point of stopping and confronting the OC'er every time. If it's legal to OC, and unless that person is doing something illegal, they should be left alone. We don't get stopped just for driving our cars, unless we are doing it illegally, wrecklessly or have the LEO's attention because of something else.
    I hope it is just a learning curve thing and in time everyone will settle down and accept things as they are.
    As to what someone else thinks of me doing it? Could'nt care less. They are probably the first to yell Help! when someone attacks them
    carracer likes this.
    Light travels faster than sound...thats why some people appear bright before they speak

  13. #118
    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    My logic for supporting open carry? Concealing in Oklahoma summer heat sucks.
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    My blog

    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.

  14. #119
    VIP Member Array Badey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paaiyan View Post
    My logic for supporting open carry? Concealing in Oklahoma summer heat sucks.
    This is a bit off topic, but how is the fight for OC going in OK?
    Though defensive violence will always be a sad necessity in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men -St. Augustine

  15. #120
    VIP Member Array paaiyan's Avatar
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    Pretty good right now, depending on your view of the laws coming through the legislature. There are two laws going through the motions right now, each pretty much the same. One started on each side, passed and moved to the other side. The last listed status of HB 2522 is as follows:

    Reported Do Pass as amended Public Safety committee; pending CR 03/29/2012
    Pending coauthorship Senator(s) Shortey, Sykes 03/29/2012

    Mary Fallin has stated in the past she supports the idea of open carry. We'll see what happens when the rubber meets the road, but personally I think she'll sign off on it. Quoted from her website:

    "Furthermore, I believe that gun ownership rights in Oklahoma can and should be expanded. Gov. Brad Henry vetoed an "open carry" law that would have permitted responsible gun owners to carry weapons without concealing them. When I am governor, I will sign that bill into law and send a message that in Oklahoma, we mean business when it comes to the second amendment."
    My blog

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