As I said, I OC. More often than not. I am not a fan of peacocking. Intentionally gathering to prove a point is not my speed either. Especially when you usually get the one dunce who want to bring his AR15. Then again, I have no agenda. I carry, both OC & CC, because I can and I want to irreguardless of what others think or say. I do it for my own safety. I do legally. And I don't need some group of choads living in mommy's basement to reaffirm anything for me.
I find it hard to take serious any 300lb gun wielding knucklehead talking about the zombie apocolypse.
Point is (I think) ... there's always something that someone doesn't like. Can't please everyone. Just cuz you don't like it doesn't mean you have to ban it.
Well it certainly is nice to see the OC guys go after each other and us other folks just sit back and watch.
An organized event like Lima described is a great way for people to see how normal everyone is and would be of great benefit to any movement or cause. The problem arises when Fred and his OC buddies load up with handguns, rifles and shotguns and go eat at a restaurant and wait for the manager to ask them to leave or the police to be called then videotape it claiming how their 2nd, 3rd, 8th and 21st rights have been violated. That type event does not do the movement any good it makes everyone who carries a gun look like a damn moron.
Now you can jump on your soapbox and preach all day long "It is their right" yes you are correct but did expressing that right in that manner benefit or harm the cause. As someone stated the act of OC'ing is not some dirty, illegal thing but when Billy Joe Jim Bob carries his M1A at the salad bar and then wonders why folks become alarmed you have to start thinking is this guy wired right, but remember he is speaking for all gun owners when he does this no matter what or how you carry. These are the things the general non gun toting, ELECTION SWAYING, public see. Youtube is full of it that is what turns people off.
In the recent post about the MOC president one of the videos was him in a police station being billy badass telling the officers it is my right, great it is ok said done, leave but to stand there and argue the point? All the average person sees is some guy they have now labeled a gun nut, argueing with the person whom they feel is their protection and savior when they need them. So this furthers the cause how?
In regards to CA OC movement. The majority of videos, comments and posts that I saw in regards to this were some guy, strapping on a Hi Point, walking down the street unloaded, waiting to be stopped by LE to record it period. It was even stated on this forum "They carry a Hi Point in case the gun is confiscated". There was no intent of using the weapon for self defense it was for show period. To me they poked and proded stating "We want a response from Governent" well they got one. Now everyone acts shocked that it happened. Then the next day when the handguns are not authorized what do they do "LETS CARRY OUR RIFLES AROUND" that will show them.
Gents as I have stated here over and over again I wish there was one clear cut law, regulation, decision that would be valid everywhere. You could OC, CC, tie it to your forehead and it would not matter but there is not. The shock value videos, meetings and confrontations dont work. The average non gun toting citizen does not see you as a person exercising their rights sometimes, they see some guy with a gun acting like a moron just as when they see someone burning the american flag. They do not see them as exercising their rights they see someone destroying a symbol of their country.
Organized, family type, preplanned, non confrontational meetings, gatherings, picnics, fundraisers great all for it and have long lasting benifits, but the let's show the sheeple what a real sheepdog, God I hate those terms, looks like by taking over Burger King for a meeting has no other benefit than to cause panic and lose whatever momentum you have gained.
-Somebody tell me why I am going to step into this knee-deep pile-
I enjoy living in a state which 'permits' me to exercise my right to carry open or concealed. Here in the north, hockey jerseys make great cover garments; I could hide Ma Duce under there but it easily is pulled out of the way. However when eating I will often remove it; I would rather spill on an $8 shirt than $80 jersey. And when at Old Country Buffet, I won't bother putting it back on to go get a refill. The Mrs. is always worried that there will be a mass panic ending with me on the floor, boot to the neck. Only once have I seen someone even notice my pistol.
Now in a perfect world, there would be U.S. Code 18-jibba jabba stating “Per the Second Ammendent, all persons not prohibited from owning firearms (See Code This That and The Other Thing) may carry firearms, without restriction, openly or concealed, in all locations, upto and including, but not limited to, the President's private porta-potty.”
Unfortunately our world is less than perfect. I agree, organized non-confrontational OC gatherings will show the general public than gun carriers and 'just folks'.
On the other hand when, shall we say a more confrontational attitude is adopted, I leave it to the reader to draw their own line- truth be told, mine is still fuzzy, said average citizen will conclude “That National Council to Control Handguns, (no the Center to Prevent Violent Handguns or was in Handguns Incorporating Controls?) -ach- those Brady people are right. The gun nuts just whine about their rights. They all all on the edge of going off.”
We who prefer CC have it easy. We get to hide among the public 99% of the time; they never know we are there. When outed to friends, family, whomever/however we become the ambassador/representative for the whole carry community.
OC people have chosen a higher path. They are the ambassador/representative to the public all of the time. Does this mean I believe they should preach the values of being armed to every Dick, Jane, Spot and Puff who asks? Of course not; no more than I would discuss any other personal, political or religious views to a stranger. However the way you say “Because I can” will likely have a great impact. As a customer service manger I am told that in this day and age a positive experience will be passed in detail to three other people, and in less detail to twenty or more. A negative one will be passed to five times as many.
My $.02 in 448 words.
P.S. If there are any OC meets planned in the TC metro area, I hope there will be announced here. I would be interested in attending.
OC people have chosen a higher path. They are the ambassador/representative to the public all of the time
You know this is absolutely correct. Just as my sig line says every minute of everyday so those that OC are the representives of us all. I don't know about the rest of you but if you are going to represent me as a gun owner do it in a professional manner and have the skills and know how to back it up in both actions and words.
Outstanding comment and Semper Fi
I believe, as I stated earlier, that the in your face people are the minority. Put those open carriers in the back of the bus. They don't really belong here anyway.
Atltho, I suppose we could all sit back and wish we had things better. Everyone concealing would make things much easier since no one would see our sidearms. Since no one sees them eventually most people would think they are not around so therefore no one is really going to care if a law is enacted to eliminate carry all together. Not carrying them? Don't need them.
I guess my point in this not really organized post is that if no one does anything, nothing will change. If we want to achieve our rights back where they should be or not lose what we have, we have to do something. For all the over the top videos you can also find recordings of those who, like myself, only record for self protection. Those of people being proned out just for walking down the street open carrying.
I guess the cc people will just come in and say we deserve that. Just cc and everything will be ok. Just sit in the back of the bus and it will be fine. jsut wait for the next bus cuz this one is for us normal folk. Don't come to our bus stop until our bus leaves. That is your bus stop, don't come to ours. Sorry, no bus for you.
If we only had just cc'd, everything would have been fine. Well, you aren't a celebrity so you don't have a need to carry. No permit for you! Can't carry that piece so you have no need for it, do you! No one really needs a gun. Man up! Real men can defend themselves with their hands! We have the police to protect us so no need anyway. Haven't seen anyone carry in years so no one will miss it. Don't need a gun anyway.
The cc people are just a minority of kooks so the normal people really need to get rid of them. The gov't officials are really the only ones that need guns. They will protect us. What's that you say? The 2nd amendment? Only applies to an army anyway. You don't need a permit as you can't have a gun anyway.
I open carry. I guess I should stay in the back of the bus.
I appreciate the measured and civil responses to my eternal pessimism on OC. You've moved me down the continuum a bit.
It's strange. I split my time between FL and NC, and I would have zero problem with folks OC'ing in NC (it is legal there, anyway), but every time I imagine OC in Florida, someone puts up a video like the Chicago train deal where the old man gets knocked out by the coward thug and the homies cheer. Imagine those non-humans strapped up and drawing down for "looking at me" or "disrespecting me" or just because they think they deserve your watch, or coat, or shoes? That's what I see here in FL, and that's exactly their mindset. I'm not sure how beneficial that could possibly be, even if my gun was bigger.
And, do you suppose they don't carry now? Can't remember the last time I saw a gang banger open carry where it's legal. Yes, we have them in Idaho too. Just last week 18 gang members arrested for various charges including gun violations. Yes, we also have the drive bys and shootouts from car to car.
carracer. Don't know about sitting in the back of the bus thing but a xanax may help.
The only thing that made sense of that was "I guess my point in this not really organized post" no one said go to the back of the bus, if you want to hold some meeting in the police department lobby to show you can go for it. If you want to take over the local Denny's and dare the manager to kick you out have fun.
You will need to put on your big boy undies and stop the "I'll just take my crayons and go home" sarcasm and see how just maybe some ideas can be passed around to do some event that does not look like a meeting of the local militia group. The original question I believe was "Do the open carry meetings work" the general concensus is yes when well organized and not done in a confrontational manner they show everyone that we/me/you are normal people.
The hostile takeover media events don't generally come off as being family friendly and make gunowners, ALL GUNOWNERS, look like idiots on occasion.
Just as was posted if you OC you are the ambassadors of the gun toters of America whether you like the title or not so dont get mad when an ambassador does something ignorant and other people tag them for it.
I think part of our problem is many of us are arguing the same side from different viewpoints.
Do we all agree:
O C person asked- “why do you carry?”
Reply- “It is a personal choice of exercising my right that I do not care to discuss at this time.”
“I have a free hour. Would you like to grab a seat at yonder Starbucks and we can talk”
(Personal choice. Less extreme answers welcome.)
C C person outed- As I was by my wife when visiting friends. He is very pro gun, she is a nurse who believe the A M A views.
She asks (Yelling from another room) “Are you packing heat?”
Me (yelling back)- “Maybe”
Her- “Do you think you have to defend your life here?”
Me- “I'm playing with your kids.”
Her(laughing)- “Point taken”
She has never asked again or given any concern when we visit. She still won't let her husband carry and he must store all of his guns disassembled.
O C person asked- “why do you carry?”
Reply- “Do I know you Sheep? Go away.”
“Am I being detained? No, then leave me alone before I sue you and your department to the third world flatfoot.”
C Cer (wearing standard issue God Guns Guts cap, Cold Dead Hands T-shirt and Tac Vest- color can not be determined since it has every patch From H&K to Hi-Point, with three obvious gun shaped bulges) Pats his hip- “I'd like to see some punks come in this store and try something with ol'Bessie an' me here. Save the cops the doughnut time; we can just talk to the funeral home across the street.”
And yes, had the more politically active of us not stood up, and worked within the system, we would be no better than we were 30 yrs ago and likely much worse. As a popular book says, “There is a time for everything.” Knowing that time and using it properly is critical.
As for SoCal, I enjoyed my stations there very much. There land is beautiful, people are great. But I would like to see Bigfoot on the flag and L.A... well there must be something we can do short of returning it to Mexico. What if they won't take it?
-Dug in couch cushions to find a couple more pennies-
I guess you missed all the other "go to the back of the bus" posts in this thread. Trust me, I am an AMBASSADOR to the cause. I wear my "big boy undies" every day. Those events you speak of are a minority. There are too many in this forum tho that think it is mainstream among the OC group. Perhaps some of you should actually attend some meetings before you criticize the masses. Some of you should actually go to a Denny's open carrying and see what happens. Nothing, in my case. I enjoyed breakfast. A group of us went to Moxie Java for coffee. We spent money and enjoyed talking about football. Nobody went screaming out the door. No one called the police.
Not getting mad here, just wondering why so many here come to the "Open Carry" portion of the forum and then bash the open carriers.
What have you (all of you) done to promote OC today?
My wife also thought carrying was silly, dangerous and confrontational. "Why are you taking a gun to the...(whatever). She now has a carry permit and Charter Arms "Pink Lady of her own. Just a matter of getting used to it and hearing the testimonials of defense form others.
Instead of those coming in here and insulting or bashing the meetings and carriers, why don't we have a meeting to discuss what we can do to help the cause and promote open carry. You are all invited to Wild Bills BBQ in Meridian Id this monday at 6:30 pm. 15% discount for open carriers.
If Bigfoot shows up I'll buy him dinner!
Carracer. I understand "those people" are the minority but they get the majority of the attention and that is what the general public bases us all on. I am not bashing brother just stating my opinion.
I open carry everyday of the week and truly wish I could come to a meeting I am sure I would enjoy it, might even buy breakfast.