For those opposed to open carry, I have a question for you.

This is a discussion on For those opposed to open carry, I have a question for you. within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by mlr1m Yes, in a free society you are free to petition the government to take away your freedom. Michael Or to get ...

View Poll Results: Would you support a law that did not allow for open carry?

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  • Yes

    15 3.65%
  • No

    301 73.24%
  • I'm against open carry but support those who do so.

    87 21.17%
  • Yes, but with exceptions for handicapped or those unable to carry otherwise.

    8 1.95%
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Thread: For those opposed to open carry, I have a question for you.

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlr1m View Post
    Yes, in a free society you are free to petition the government to take away your freedom.

    Michael
    Or to get it back, as the case may be.

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  3. #92
    VIP Member Array Thunder71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gene83 View Post
    Just curious why you say "if nobody paid attention to these attention seekers" and then want to draw attention to the issue by educating the public? Like MitchellCT said, if people quit trying to make a big deal out of open carry, the vast majority of people are too busy doing their thing to even notice.
    The attention seekers feed off the uneducated... if you educate people then those numbers drop, making life pretty boring for Mr. Attention Seeker as he walks around doing nothing all day, then has nothing to edit and upload at night.

  4. #93
    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    Confrontational?

    For those who keep bringing up folks who are just looking for a confrontation. What exactly qualifies as confrontational?
    Is everyone who open carries asking to be stopped? If so why doesn't Arizona have this problem?
    For me, if I were to open carry into a group of anti-gun protesters that would be confrontational. I would be asking for trouble.
    If I were just walking down the street breaking no laws on my way to the store how am I harming anyone. If someone confronts me aren't they the ones being confrontational?

    Michael
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  5. #94
    eb
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    The confrontation question... The problem as I see it isn't the OC'er minding his own business, its the average person that instantly thinks he's "crazy" when they see the gun. Nobody will ever make me believe that OC furthers the pro-gun cause. There are far too many people on the opposing side to believe that to be true. Even if the anti doesn't approach you in a confrontational manner (which, he probably won't, you have a damn gun), what you don't see is when he's at home later writing a letter to his congressman full of anti-gun sentiment because he saw you basically brandishing the thing in his eyes earlier that day.

    I lived in Arizona for 6 years, so I think I'm somewhat qualified to comment on this. I rarely ever saw anyone OC'ing is the real answer. There are anti's everywhere my friends, they outnumber us. Its important for all of us to consider our actions when it comes to maintaining our rights on the whole.
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  6. #95
    VIP Member Array Thunder71's Avatar
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    So in short, don't do something that is completely legal because it upsets some people.

    In my opinion, that is why this country is in such bad shape - it's been molded to cater to those who's feelings get hurt, for no valid reason. Leave no child behind, pay the way for those too lazy to work themselves, give to those who will take otherwise.

    I do see valid points by both sides of the argument, however I don't believe that you should have to stop doing something that is 100% legal just because someone else doesn't like it. If that were the approach that is recommended across the board then we'd all be driving economy cars, not eating meat, and watching variations of PBS on every channel.

    If the two sides can't meet in the middle on a gun forum, I guess it can't be expected to happen anywhere else either.

    Divided we stand, together we fall.

  7. #96
    VIP Member Array gottabkiddin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eb View Post
    The confrontation question... The problem as I see it isn't the OC'er minding his own business, its the average person that instantly thinks he's "crazy" when they see the gun. Nobody will ever make me believe that OC furthers the pro-gun cause. There are far too many people on the opposing side to believe that to be true. Even if the anti doesn't approach you in a confrontational manner (which, he probably won't, you have a damn gun), what you don't see is when he's at home later writing a letter to his congressman full of anti-gun sentiment because he saw you basically brandishing the thing in his eyes earlier that day.

    I lived in Arizona for 6 years, so I think I'm somewhat qualified to comment on this. I rarely ever saw anyone OC'ing is the real answer. There are anti's everywhere my friends, they outnumber us. Its important for all of us to consider our actions when it comes to maintaining our rights on the whole.

    This IMO, was perfectly stated... The folks in bold that you speak of are the ones that stir the pot with a negative spin..
    "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luke 22:36

    "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." Thomas Jefferson

  8. #97
    VIP Member Array Gene83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlr1m View Post
    For those who keep bringing up folks who are just looking for a confrontation. What exactly qualifies as confrontational?
    Is everyone who open carries asking to be stopped? If so why doesn't Arizona have this problem?
    For me, if I were to open carry into a group of anti-gun protesters that would be confrontational. I would be asking for trouble.
    If I were just walking down the street breaking no laws on my way to the store how am I harming anyone. If someone confronts me aren't they the ones being confrontational?

    Michael
    This qualifies as confrontational behavior in my opinion. Your opinion may vary.

    Gunman vows to continue carrying AK-47 to parks | Nashville City Paper
    "The superior man, when resting in safety, does not forget that danger may come." ~ Confucius

  9. #98
    Distinguished Member Array TerriLi's Avatar
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    Running count for positive encounters with random people 5, in under a year of ocing. Number of negative.....still waiting for one. These are people that have stopped and talked to me because I was ocing. Most just asked me how they could carry too, one was a older gentleman thanking me for carrying.
    I know not what this "overkill" means.

    Honing the knives, Cleaning the longguns, Stocking up ammo.

  10. #99
    eb
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder71 View Post
    So in short, don't do something that is completely legal because it upsets some people.

    In my opinion, that is why this country is in such bad shape - it's been molded to cater to those who's feelings get hurt, for no valid reason. Leave no child behind, pay the way for those too lazy to work themselves, give to those who will take otherwise.

    I do see valid points by both sides of the argument, however I don't believe that you should have to stop doing something that is 100% legal just because someone else doesn't like it. If that were the approach that is recommended across the board then we'd all be driving economy cars, not eating meat, and watching variations of PBS on every channel.
    Look I don't disagree with you my friend, but there are some facts to be faced.

    Anti's "hate" guns, they are afraid of them. They are afraid of people who have them. They think guns kill people, they are evil, "bad", etc etc. Criminals carry guns in the anti's estimation.

    Anti's outnumber us by a large majority.

    Enter you, legally open carrying and exercising your rights. Now enter you, and 10 to 1 anti's around you out in public. You go about your business legally open carrying, nobody says anything to you. Nobody gives you any trouble. You go home and think "Hey, another uneventual open carry day. Whats the problem?"

    Now stop and think for a minute how many people you encountered that day. How many of them will vote for the next anti-gun piece of legislation because you "scared" them that day, unbeknownst to you? How many will write a letter to their lawmakers demanding action be taken because there are "crazies" out there with guns?

    Your actions, legal or not, have a ripple effect. The only point I am trying to make about open carry is to THINK about those actions. I truly believe while you are not doing anything technically "wrong" when you legally open carry, you are contributing the destruction of the same rights you are exercising.

    This isn't "fair", this isn't "right", but its the way the world works. When I see these pro-OC events on TV, I get very irritated. Why? Because I know damn well that hordes of anti-gun people have now been incited when they wouldn't have been otherwise. OC hurts our cause, that is my opinion.

    Be safe out there...

  11. #100
    VIP Member Array Thunder71's Avatar
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    Yeah, I understand - and I think that's kind of where I was going with the education issue. Most of these people don't understand that millions of people legally carry every and and nothing happens.

    Bad guys carry every day, and will continue to do so regardless of any laws that are in their way - and they typically do so concealed.

    I agree that the AK-47 guy is over the top, but where's the line? A gun that 'looks evil'? Now we're really getting into gray area... help us all!

  12. #101
    Distinguished Member Array TerriLi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gene83 View Post
    This qualifies as confrontational behavior in my opinion. Your opinion may vary.

    Gunman vows to continue carrying AK-47 to parks | Nashville City Paper
    This guy is a selfish jerk, he has been banned on every forum he has been on because of his grandstanding.
    I know not what this "overkill" means.

    Honing the knives, Cleaning the longguns, Stocking up ammo.

  13. #102
    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    So in short, don't do something that is completely legal because it upsets some people.
    Agree that if your intent is to upset and provoke a reaction it is morally wrong in most cases.
    In my opinion, that is why this country is in such bad shape - it's been molded to cater to those who's feelings get hurt, for no valid reason. Leave no child behind, pay the way for those too lazy to work themselves, give to those who will take otherwise.
    Agree again. And somehow these people have developed the idea that the government should have the power to prevent others from doing anything that may offend them.
    I do see valid points by both sides of the argument, however I don't believe that you should have to stop doing something that is 100% legal just because someone else doesn't like it. If that were the approach that is recommended across the board then we'd all be driving economy cars, not eating meat, and watching variations of PBS on every channel.
    Can we ban fat folks wearing spandex and keep our other freedoms? Just kidding. We all see things that offend us. Some of us just realize that its a part of being free and accept it.
    Others are willing to give up that freedom in an effort to not see offensive sights.

    Michael
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  14. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerriLi View Post
    This guy is a selfish jerk, he has been banned on every forum he has been on because of his grandstanding.
    I know. He eventually lost his permit and I understand he lost the lawsuit against the state to have it reinstated. Apparently, even the co-founder of OpenCarry.org didn't have kind things to say about him.
    "The superior man, when resting in safety, does not forget that danger may come." ~ Confucius

  15. #104
    eb
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    Its never "us" I'm worried about guys. We are outnumbered tremendously when it comes to "us" vs them, the anti's. Never give the anti's another reason to complain or to vote for laws that take away our rights. Openly carrying is one of the most blatant pieces of "ammunition" so to speak, that you can give to them. I wish it weren't so.

    We aren't going to "educate" anyone by simply walking around openly carrying a firearm. We are going to scare most of them, even if we don't realize it. IMHO, the best thing all of us can do, is contribute to organizations like the NRA/ILA and the like that fight for us every day... support lawmakers that are pro-gun... and above all, be responsible, and exercise our rights in a thoughtful way that does not add fuel to the wrong fire.
    Thunder71, Mike1956 and wmhawth like this.

  16. #105
    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gene83 View Post
    This qualifies as confrontational behavior in my opinion. Your opinion may vary.

    Gunman vows to continue carrying AK-47 to parks | Nashville City Paper
    I would say it is, yes.
    Now lets say he is carrying his rifle to the local indoor range for target practice? What then? Before my health failed I would on occasion throw my rifle over my shoulder and walk to the outskirts of town for some plinking.

    Michael

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