This is a discussion on "See That Man? He's Going To Shoot You!" within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by wmhawth The lady was an idiot of course. As for me I see no need to try to educate idiots in a ...
I can actually conceal the 1911 well enough when I need to. I have a nice IWB holster that makes it disappear under a tee shirt. But as I was wearing a coat, I wasn't anticipating needing to use it, so I used a Gould & Godrich leather pancake holster with a thumbsnap. Had I'd know Walmart was gonna crank the heat up to tropical levels, I would have used the other one, or gone to Target instead.
I never worry about carrying in a Wallmart, either open or cc. It's the parking lots that concern me!
I don't see this as an OC issue either. It would be the equivalent of someone saying, "If you don't behave, I'm going to have that lady run you over with her car." It's inappropriate and I would say something as well.
Parents who threaten their children with outrageous violence or neglect get absolutely NO respect from me. All they are doing is teaching their child that they are a liar and have no better way to control the situation but come up with some fantastical fallacy. They don't even think about how it might actually effect their child's perception of life.
I once saw a mother threaten her child with a monster who would come and kidnap him and kill him if he didn't follow her into a store.
It also annoys the living crap out of me when parents say, "Fine, then I'm just going to leave you here," when their kids don't come when told... NO you are not going to leave your child.
If someone were to use me as a threat to their children I would say something as well. It doesn't matter if it's because I have a gun or anything else. I won't let myself be used to frighten or threaten...especially not by some stranger.
I might have considered reporting her to Child Protective Services. I certainly would have said something, if not to the mom, then to the kid. When I was a kid, I was threatened a number of times with weapons.... knives, guns. It's scary. I definitely would have made it clear that she was completely out of line to threaten to make someone else shoot her kid. To me, that's not escalating a situation.... it might be diffusing it, as far as the kid is concerned.
To the OP's original question, I would not have engaged. Yes, it was bad parenting. However, any situation can escalate out of your control. I always de-escalate, doubly so when I'm carrying - here, just walk on by.
I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."
My Mother probably felt like shooting me a time or two, but she never threatened to have someone else do it. Incredibly ignorant!
I agree the OC factor here is a non-issue. I'm no expert on parenting, since my son is only 20 months, but I don't see anything too wrong with what the lady said.
There are such things as sarcasm, comedic exaggeration etc. Maybe we've been living in "Zero-tolerance" America when a comment obviously said in jest is taken as a "threat." Depending on the child they may be capable of understanding the difference between a joke and a real threat, knowing when and how to use such humor is at the discretion of the parent.
When I was a kid I often told my friends "Oh, I can't eat all the christmas cookies from the cookie jar, my mom will Kill me!" Thank goodness there were no internet forums back then otherwise someone would surely have called children's services. :)
If I were me I'd have tried to use the situation in a positive manner. I'd say to the lady and the child "oh no, I'd never hurt anyone. I'm just here to protect folks from bad people" or something along those lines. I think it would have conveyed the message without turning people off to OC. Remember we are all ambassadors of goodwill towards the general public.
I JEST with my children when I have tickle fights with them and say, "Ohhh, I'm going to tickle you to pieces." Or when I let my son tackle me and say, "Oh, my goodness, you're too big and strong for mommy."
THOSE are jests.. done in a light, fun tone and environment.
Call me a little old fashioned when I comes to discipline but when my child hears, "You do xyz right now or you get abc," I want them to know that I am deadly serious and it's no joking matter. That way when I say, "Don't run into the road or you might be hit by a car," or "Don't play with fire or you could burn the house down," they know it's serious and not a "jest."
Trying to discipline your child with empty threats is dangerous (in my finite opinion) because it sets your child up for not being fully prepared to believe you are serious about anything.
You weren't serious about your threat to leave him at the store if he didn't come why should you be serious about him possibly getting hit by a car if he plays in the street? Nothing bad happened to him when you threatened to kill him for stealing cookies why should he believe you when you said something bad could happen to him if he gets into a car with strangers?
I'm all for having fun and being playful with my kids but using empty threats, ESPECIALLY when it comes to discipline is very very irresponsible in my eyes.
My kids need to know they can trust what I say and when I say something is dangerous it REALLY is dangerous and that when I say a certain consequence is coming for a particular behavior it IS coming.
Yes, kids should know what is said as a joke and what is serious, but those distinctions should come at distinct times. Telling a joke to a child in the air of correction is sending major mixed signals to the child. And what kind of a mother would tell a joke to a kindergartner where the punch line is that he is shot by a stranger? How the heck is that considered funny?!? Obviously she wasn't serious but I certainly hope to God it wasn't a joke or jest.
Yes, there are plenty of times I've said, "If I did that my father would have killed me," and, yes, most of the time it was an exaggeration but after watching some of the abuse handed out by my father I couldn't say for 100% certain it would have been an exaggeration in some cases.
If there's anyone who NEEDS your Yea to be Yea and your Nay to be Nay, it's your kids.. especially when they are as young as the child represented in this story.
You did Ok, but as Mr. White said, "You can't fix stupid"
About the parenting issue, I tell folks "Show me a messed up kid, and I'll show you messed up parents." It's accurate into the high 90%'s. They may not be intentionally bad, but they are not doing something right. If you threaten your children with punishment and don't follow through, you are teaching them to ignore and disrespect you. Don't complain when they do it later. If you threaten punishment and follow through, they learn to respect you. That and setting a good example go a long way towards raising good kids. But it's just too much work for some folks.
I prefer to live dangerously free than safely caged!
"Our houses are protected by the good Lord and a gun. And you might meet 'em both if you show up here not welcome son." Josh Thompson "Way Out Here"