Marine get turned away from voting because of OC'ing - Page 6

Marine get turned away from voting because of OC'ing

This is a discussion on Marine get turned away from voting because of OC'ing within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; OK, since no one can seem to think of a pro active way to promote OC without the chip on your shoulder and the gun ...

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Thread: Marine get turned away from voting because of OC'ing

  1. #76
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    OK, since no one can seem to think of a pro active way to promote OC without the chip on your shoulder and the gun on your hip, let me help you.

    Start a grassroots OC organization in your home town. Appear before the members of your city council during open forums and tell them who you are and what you are about. Invite them to meetings, get to know them on a personal level.
    Also invite the Sherrif, Police Chief, Public Safety Commisioner.

    Allow them to feel a part of your movement. Ask for their assistance.
    Bring in the local press, and slowly aclimate the local population to their rights under the 2nd amend.

    Get involved in helping local charity organizations.

    Stop trying to make a statement by yourselves. The more people of affluence you have on your side, the quicker OC will become acceptable to the public.

    It starts with a small town. Then a big city, then a state...
    Hopyard, kb2wji, WHEC724 and 3 others like this.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.


  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    OK, since no one can seem to think of a pro active way to promote OC without the chip on your shoulder and the gun on your hip, let me help you.

    Start a grassroots OC organization in your home town. Appear before the members of your city council during open forums and tell them who you are and what you are about. Invite them to meetings, get to know them on a personal level.
    Also invite the Sherrif, Police Chief, Public Safety Commisioner.

    Allow them to feel a part of your movement. Ask for their assistance.
    Bring in the local press, and slowly aclimate the local population to their rights under the 2nd amend.

    Get involved in helping local charity organizations.

    Stop trying to make a statement by yourselves. The more people of affluence you have on your side, the quicker OC will become acceptable to the public.

    It starts with a small town. Then a big city, then a state...
    I don't know if these folks have chips on their shoulders or not. Clearly, some do, but until chips are illegal, OC certainly is not.
    "If I had my choice I would kill every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting reports from Hell before breakfast."
    William T. Sherman

  3. #78
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I don't know if these folks have chips on their shoulders or not. Clearly, some do, but until chips are illegal, OC certainly is not.
    If the shoe fits...until then, I do not know of one OC incident that has turned out favorably for the OC community on it's current path. How's OC in California working for you now, with the current tactics being deployed?
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  4. #79
    VIP Member Array Civil_Response's Avatar
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    In states where you can only open carry, what other choice do they have? I would get pretty annoyed if everywhere I went I got harassed for no good reason and would most likely get a chip on my shoulder eventually. Yes, some of the YouTube videos look like these guys are going out trying to get the LEO to stop them, however this may be just one day in their shoes too.

  5. #80
    Distinguished Member Array BigStick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    If the shoe fits...until then, I do not know of one OC incident that has turned out favorably for the OC community on it's current path. How's OC in California working for you now, with the current tactics being deployed?
    You don't know about them because they don't make the news. It happens all the time. Guy puts on his gun, goes to the store, buys stuff, goes home. No news coverage, no story, because it is not a big deal. Just because you haven't heard about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

    I do like your ealier suggestion for an OC movement though. If you are trying to OC to make a point and not just because, that would be a very effective and productive way to go about it.
    Walk softly ...

  6. #81
    Distinguished Member Array BigStick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    ...How's OC in California working for you now, with the current tactics being deployed?
    Actually, the OC movement might have saved the day in CA.

    What!?!?!? you might be saying? Well, the courts ruled that since OC was legal, their restrictive "may" (which really means not) issue system did not restrict the 2A. Now that OC is not legal, there is more legal grounds to force CA to actually issue CC permits to anyone not restricted.

    It may take a while to happen, but the overall longterm outcome could be possitive.
    Walk softly ...

  7. #82
    Senior Member Array hayzor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by txron View Post
    Don't know the laws in Indiana, but it is illegal in texas to CC at a polling locations
    We like guns in AZ, but it is a no no to have one in a polling place.
    The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it. Albert Einstein

    "People in Arizona carry guns," said a Chandler police spokesman. "You better be careful about who you are picking on."

  8. #83
    Senior Member Array Chesafreak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    Its not that simple Mike. I would put that in the disturbing the peace category and interference with a polling place.
    He had to know he was going to cause a fuss.
    Since when is it a disturbance of the peace to excercise your consitutional rights? Only when its not convenient for someone? Citing him for disturbing the peace would simply be using coercion to take away his rights. Something along the lines of "Give up your rights quietly or we're going to arrest you".
    DontTreadOnI likes this.
    "I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery." - Thomas Jefferson

  9. #84
    VIP Member Array Badey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    If the shoe fits...until then, I do not know of one OC incident that has turned out favorably for the OC community on it's current path. How's OC in California working for you now, with the current tactics being deployed?
    I can use a counter example of how the OC crowd in Wisconsin helped to get CC laws passed.
    jrclen likes this.
    Though defensive violence will always be a sad necessity in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men -St. Augustine

  10. #85
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    OK, since no one can seem to think of a pro active way to promote OC without the chip on your shoulder and the gun on your hip, let me help you.

    Start a grassroots OC organization in your home town. Appear before the members of your city council during open forums and tell them who you are and what you are about. Invite them to meetings, get to know them on a personal level.
    Also invite the Sherrif, Police Chief, Public Safety Commisioner.

    Allow them to feel a part of your movement. Ask for their assistance.
    Bring in the local press, and slowly aclimate the local population to their rights under the 2nd amend.

    Get involved in helping local charity organizations.

    Stop trying to make a statement by yourselves. The more people of affluence you have on your side, the quicker OC will become acceptable to the public.

    It starts with a small town. Then a big city, then a state...
    The problem is I am not trying to get something legal or something that is a right. My problem is it already is LEGAL and a RIGHT. Most folks that OC (myself included) do not do it to make a point or a statement. I do it because sometimes it is convenient for me. Why on earth do I have to prove to a local community and especially LE about what the laws are. My biggest problem is not with the scared soccer mom that does a MWAG call.
    My biggest problem is the lack of support from folks that CC on this issue and the complete ignorance or apathy by LEO's.
    You should not have to hold a group meeting to explaing to a community what your rights are. If there is a MWAG call then it is up to the LEO to explain to the complaintant what the law is.

  11. #86
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    The problem is I am not trying to get something legal or something that is a right. My problem is it already is LEGAL and a RIGHT. Most folks that OC (myself included) do not do it to make a point or a statement. I do it because sometimes it is convenient for me. Why on earth do I have to prove to a local community and especially LE about what the laws are. My biggest problem is not with the scared soccer mom that does a MWAG call.
    My biggest problem is the lack of support from folks that CC on this issue and the complete ignorance or apathy by LEO's.
    You should not have to hold a group meeting to explaing to a community what your rights are. If there is a MWAG call then it is up to the LEO to explain to the complaintant what the law is.
    Sun, I understand your point. However, we here know its a right. How many in the general public know its a right to OC. That is the problem. And was the problem for this guy in Indiana. Thats why G-man suggested a specific course of action. Most folks outside of the gun community no nothing about guns or gun laws....
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

    Never be ashamed of a scar. It simply means, that you were stronger than whatever tried to hurt you......

  12. #87
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Sun, I understand your point. However, we here know its a right. How many in the general public know its a right to OC. That is the problem. And was the problem for this guy in Indiana. Thats why G-man suggested a specific course of action. Most folks outside of the gun community no nothing about guns or gun laws....
    And like I stated in my previous post. Government officials did not know the law in IN. I said I am not bothered so much by the scared soccer mom. But is it so hard to expect civil servants to know their job and for them to educate the soccer moms

    BTW: I just got back from the range. I OC'ed not to make a point. I did it because it was convenient for ME. And unlike Hopyard and what a lot of other folks think, very few OC to make a point (not that it matters). Thet OC becasue they like to for whatever reason.

  13. #88
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Is owning a gun a right, or is carrying a gun a right?

    If unfavorable publicity persists from the OC crowd, then it could be argued that while it may be legal to own the gun, it is not necessarily a right to " carry" the gun.

    This is not my personal belief, however, I do not interpret the law. Just food for thought.
    Hell, I don't have a dog in the fight really. Just trying to make some people take the blinders off and look at the overall picture.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by MisterAvis View Post
    How's this for pragmatism: You leave your gun in your car in Philadelphia. The local Black Panther Party thugs are standing outside of the polling place openly displaying blunt force arms. WHERE HAS THIS HAPPENED BEFORE? "Security" patrols stationed at polling places in Philly - YouTube

    This is a political group. A RADICAL KNOWN TERRORIST POLITICAL FRONT. Not security.

    So, given this scenario, should someone openly carrying be refused the right to vote??? If you think so, explain. And if you DO think openly displayed arms should be refused in a polling place, give you pragmatic, philosophical, honest, genuine, unbiased, and OBJECTIVE (as in, not subjective) opinion as to why.
    Ah, but that example shows precisely why our OC er was wrong.

    Those "thugs" you speak of were not arrested because they broke no law. None were charged if memory serves. A few folks got their panties in a knot over nothing.

    Their presence however was seen by some as threatening to people who chose to participate in the voting process at that precinct.

    Do you not think a man with a gun presents a similar appearance of a threat?

    Many people posted here regarding Phila incident hat they would have simply proceeded to vote and not been intimidated. I'm sure there are many at the polling place where this man was carrying who also simply proceeded to vote and did not feel intimidated.

    But, neither of these examples of poor judgment, what was done in Phila and what this OC er did, can honestly be
    said were done without some intent to intimidate; even if the latter was perhaps "softer" intimidation--- and it was softer intimidation only because of his appearance and politeness--which mean nothing when someone is flaunting a gun at a polling station or other government sanctioned activity. Since no one is a mind reader, the true intentions were
    certainly unclear and intimidating. That of course is why the officials called the cops in the first place.

    I think the Phila example is quite the proper parallel for understanding what this man did was wrong.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
    Andrew Jackson

  15. #90
    Distinguished Member Array BigStick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Is owning a gun a right, or is carrying a gun a right?

    If unfavorable publicity persists from the OC crowd, then it could be argued that while it may be legal to own the gun, it is not necessarily a right to " carry" the gun.

    This is not my personal belief, however, I do not interpret the law. Just food for thought.
    Hell, I don't have a dog in the fight really. Just trying to make some people take the blinders off and look at the overall picture.
    Right so keep AND BEAR arms. Almost as clear as "shall not be infringed". Yes it is a right to carry.

    And it sounds to me like what you are wanting everyone to do is put the blinders on, not take them off.
    Walk softly ...

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