My thoughts on interaction with LEO in a MWAG call

This is a discussion on My thoughts on interaction with LEO in a MWAG call within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I live in West Tennessee. Near Memphis but in a small town out in Shelby County. Open carry is no uncommon here. It is fairly ...

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Thread: My thoughts on interaction with LEO in a MWAG call

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array TN_Mike's Avatar
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    My thoughts on interaction with LEO in a MWAG call

    I live in West Tennessee. Near Memphis but in a small town out in Shelby County. Open carry is no uncommon here. It is fairly common in fact. (Tennessee is a 100% open carry OK state. Anyplace it is legal to carry, it is legal to open carry) The Shelby County Sheriffs Department is pretty well trained when it comes to interacting with legally armed and openly carrying civilians. Never had a problem.

    I have never been the subject of a MWAG call but if I was, and a Deputy asked for my ID I don't think I would refuse to give it to them. I will hand over my permit because I am legally obligated to do so in Tennessee. Now, I will still record the interaction and I would expect and hope that the deputy would not mind this. Regardless, I'm still going to record it.

    Now, why I personally do not get too terribly bent out of shape about cops not being 100% knowledgeable about the laws as it pertains to open carry or even concealed carry in a lot of places. Cops tend to know the laws that they are called on to enforce the most often. LEO's have to deal with drunks drivers, drunks being disorderly, shop lifters, speeders, reckless drivers, domestic abuse, drug abusers, meth cookers, burglers, and all manner of other offenders far more often than they are called upon to deal with someone open carrying or someone who is concealed carrying and happens to let his gun be seen by some jumpy sheeple idiot. So it stands to reason that they may not know that particular law or set of laws governing that action as well as all those others. So, I for one am not going to give the cop a hard time.

    That being said, as I stated, I am going to record any interaction with LEO and, if the LEO gets the big bad "I AM THE LAW" attitude, I'm not completely sure how it will all shake out but I am don't think it would go to smooth. I hate that attitude but would try to keep my own in check.

    Anyway, just wanted to throw that out there so some of us might think about it. We can't expect the police to know the letter of every law. Even the pin heads who write and pass the laws don't know the letter of all of the crap they pass. It is unrealistic to expect the cops to know them all. The fact that they know the ones they deal with most often is understandable.
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    VIP Member Array rammerjammer's Avatar
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    Always be polite and reasonable with LEO and most interactions will be a non-incident.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rammerjammer View Post
    Always be polite and reasonable with LEO and most interactions will be a non-incident.
    I will second that opinion; courtesy and respect have gotten me out of a ticket on occasion.
    When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rammerjammer View Post
    Always be polite and reasonable with LEO and most interactions will be a non-incident.
    Pucker up with a yes sir no sir and all will be well.


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    Senior Member Array Sig35seven's Avatar
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    Good common sense approach. Cool heads prevail.
    "Confidence is food for the wise man but liquor for the fool"

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    VIP Member Array TN_Mike's Avatar
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    I want to clarify one thing, I was not saying I would simply just bend over and take anything for LEO, but I will be polite. I will point out that I am not breaking any law. I will ask if I am being detained. I will ask why I am being detained. That kind of thing....
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    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    I always try to be courteous when dealing with others. Be they LEO's or the folks working at walmart. Just how I was raised.
    On the issue of police not being expected to know every law. I agree with that statement as well. They do not need to know all the laws. They do need to know each and every law they attempt to enforce though.

    Michael

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rammerjammer View Post
    Always be polite and reasonable with LEO and most interactions will be a non-incident.
    That goes both ways.
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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    That goes both ways.
    +! More often than not folks keep saying to be polite and courteous. But almost never say that about LEO's. Not LEO bashing but they are humans too and have good and bad days. I have seen LEO's with attitudes. They get the same respect in kind. And I always have an iphone handy to record if needed. If a LEO don't like it too bad. It is not to make anyone look bad. But too record the actual incident. A judge can decide.

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    Distinguished Member Array ericb327's Avatar
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    I agree for the most part but I would not start off with recording unless the officers attitude dictated it. I can barely get the video feature on my phone to work. I live in Kentucky/Cincinnati where OC is completely legal. There are some places off limits though. I was carrying a Glock 19 in a Galco Paddle at 3:00 with my shirt pulled over on a quick trip to the convenience store. I was printing pretty bad but that shouldn't matter. I was approached by a local LEO that was there. The LEO asked if I had a permit for my gun. I said yes. He never asked to see my permit which I am required to do in KY if asked. The LEO then told me I should conceal my weapon better; I then informed him OC was legal in KY. He said "It Is?". Yes sir. "Well we could get some MWAG calls so it would be cool if you concealed it better". I told him politely it would be cool if they educated the callers about OC and the law. Most of the other LEOs in my town know about and accept OC, this was a younger officer. I'm not sure about protocol for MWAG calls to dispatch. I think they have to send a car to investigate.
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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Follow up on my first post:

    As I said before:LEO's need to be courteous and polite also if they expect the same from folks. But I will say that I have had two MWAG calls on me (stupid MA transplant who moved to the woods in NH!) and both went fine. First time (was walking my dog down a rural road) the LEO's did not get out of the vehicle. Just asked if I was the one hat moved in up the road and I said yes. They said they had to investigate because it was a MWAG call. I said no prob and I understand. Second time from the same idiot they just slowed and said hey, looks like rain or something LOL. I have no problmes with LEO's doing what is their protocol.
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    Senior Member Array acepilot's Avatar
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    I assume that in TN, since OC is legal, you do NOT need a permit to OC? If that's the case, the LEO shouldn't really even be entitled to ask for any sort of ID or permit, no?
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    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acepilot View Post
    I assume that in TN, since OC is legal, you do NOT need a permit to OC? If that's the case, the LEO shouldn't really even be entitled to ask for any sort of ID or permit, no?
    In many cases police can ask most anything. Its just that they cannot demand you participate in the conversation.

    Michael
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    Ex Member Array MNgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TN_Mike View Post
    We can't expect the police to know the letter of every law.
    Excuse me, but then they ought not to be sworn officers enforcing those laws they know nothing about! People get killed in that manner every day all around the US. Yep, lets not "give the cops hard time."

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    Senior Member Array Sig35seven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ericb327 View Post
    I agree for the most part but I would not start off with recording unless the officers attitude dictated it. I can barely get the video feature on my phone to work. I live in Kentucky/Cincinnati where OC is completely legal. There are some places off limits though. I was carrying a Glock 19 in a Galco Paddle at 3:00 with my shirt pulled over on a quick trip to the convenience store. I was printing pretty bad but that shouldn't matter. I was approached by a local LEO that was there. The LEO asked if I had a permit for my gun. I said yes. He never asked to see my permit which I am required to do in KY if asked. The LEO then told me I should conceal my weapon better; I then informed him OC was legal in KY. He said "It Is?". Yes sir. "Well we could get some MWAG calls so it would be cool if you concealed it better". I told him politely it would be cool if they educated the callers about OC and the law. Most of the other LEOs in my town know about and accept OC, this was a younger officer. I'm not sure about protocol for MWAG calls to dispatch. I think they have to send a car to investigate.
    I've always wondered if these 'incidents' that occur between OC'ers and Police are caused by a lack of knowledge on the part of the LEO. They certainly should be educated in all areas of the law they set out to uphold but apparently is not the case. However, I don't think a confrontational attitude gets the message across very well. You seem to handle it the proper way and helped to educated the officer. Hopefully he goes back and tells the others.

    If never been stopped for OC but if I was I'd be tempted to simply show my permit and be on my way instead of being confrontational and going through all the aggravation I see these guys video recording and going on and on trying to prove a point. However, after being stopped, I would probably drive over to the police station and try to politely educate the chief on what the OC laws are that his officers seem to be unaware of. I think this method may yield longer lasting results for everyone involved.
    "Confidence is food for the wise man but liquor for the fool"

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