Open carrier at batman movie

This is a discussion on Open carrier at batman movie within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Badey I like this story, except for the part where the police make the guys put their guns in their cars (and ...

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Thread: Open carrier at batman movie

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badey View Post
    I like this story, except for the part where the police make the guys put their guns in their cars (and the stopping the movie part)...
    Quote Originally Posted by barstoolguru View Post
    another movie fail... I loved when the cops says who has a gun and three people stand up
    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    There's an interesting conundrum, for those living in a state that requires notification upon demand, if concealing and failing to notify in such a case.

    Agreed, on the flying under the radar, though. One of the benefits of going concealed, in a place that doesn't openly support lawful carry of defensive weapons.
    Quote Originally Posted by RevolvingMag View Post
    SC is a "must inform" state. But, unless I've horribly misread the laws on that, you only have to inform in an 'official' encounter. License check, traffic stop, etc. In a situation where they're asking for people to volunteer information without checking people's IDs, you don't really have to tell them.

    Of course, if you want more information/ask a legal opinion, don't ask an officer- they'll of course tell you that you HAVE to tell them no matter what. Ask a 'gun friendly' lawyer.
    Quote Originally Posted by fox2102 View Post
    Makes me wonder how many CCers didn't stand up....
    I will be happy when cops ask, "How many are not carrying?" And three guys have to go to their cars and get their weapons....
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  3. #77
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    Oh...I understand that but, it's never about what makes sense or what is logical or even about what is right or wrong. It's all about what makes political hay and what scores the maximum amount of points with an uneducated,disinterested majority of the general public.


    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    The ludicrous thing is, every corner market, busy crosswalk at lunch hour, and traffic jam is the same sort of thing: fish in a barrel for any predator who opts to attack at that moment. Heavily-secured "clear" areas can work. But publicly-accessible spaces are something else entirely. Bans don't work in crowded places because they can't stop a predator who simply chooses to ignore the ban. Hell, murder's already "banned," and that hasn't stopped a damned thing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcbridebr View Post
    Part of being a responsible open carrier is knowing when its not appropriate to OC. In this case, not appropriate at all. I also think the cops in this case were using good judgement and I am glad the three guys did not resist.

    If you are going to open carry...be smart about it. If open carry is legal where you are then you should not be hindered from OCing. But, if you want to take a gun with you in a situation like a Dark Knight Rises showing then you should just get your CWP and carry that way. Remember your rights END when you infringe on the rights of others. Others have the right to feel safe in their surroundings. Open Carry when it is the responsible thing to do, not in a theater full of people seeing a movie that has been associated with a mass killing.
    This bold is an absurd statement. True, no one has a right to interfere with the rights of others. But the right to feel safe is a consumer right, not a civil right. Many feel safe carrying or being with those who do moreso than being in a posted environment.
    Welcome to the forum, BTW.
    Americans understood the right of self-preservation as permitting a citizen to repel force by force
    when the intervention of society... may be too late to prevent an injury.
    -Blackstone’s Commentaries 145–146, n. 42 (1803) in District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008)

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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    It's all about what makes political hay and what scores the maximum amount of points with an uneducated,disinterested majority of the general public.
    Until citizens get interested in their survival, "making hay" will continue to happen. One would think "prey" animals would understand that much. The political hacks sure do.
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    I have to disagree with thoes saying he should have CC'ed, for two reasons:

    Granted the sign was unnoticeable to the point that even the officer said to fix it, its still posted property. If the sign meets the states requirements its illegal to carry CC or OC. Period!

    Secondly, whether he knows about Aurora or not why should he have to change his ways? Considering that he cooperated and stayed for the movie, I would say he had NO intent of creating a panic. This isnt even in the same theater let alone same state as the shootings. If the sheep want to panic over every gun they see then let them. If no laws are being broken (not the case here of course) then he should be able to OC if he wants. Giving in to the comfort of the sheep? We may as well just hand over our 2A rights.

    Dont get me wrong. I try to be aware of how I make others feel but if I am not in the wrong, generaly I dont care.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ionracas View Post
    Granted the sign was unnoticeable to the point that even the officer said to fix it, its still posted property. If the sign meets the states requirements its illegal to carry CC or OC. Period!
    It's only unlawful if the signage has the force of law in the state where one is carrying. The ethical question of obeying signage is something else.

    Secondly, whether he knows about Aurora or not why should he have to change his ways?
    I'm all for taking a stand, to change things. But what's the goal of being armed: to make a point, or to remain armed and capable of presenting an effective defense against predation?

    At the end of the day, the choice to go into that theatre with that mode of carry and to reenter after being disarmed meant one thing only: he was disarmed.
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  8. #82
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    If the sinage does have force of the law then does it not go beyond ethical? If you stop an attack or murder with your firearm in a legally posted area will ethics matter?

    I ask more for gain in knowledge than to question you or say your wrong. I honestly dont know.

    As far as him returning unarmed, unfortunatley thats a choice he made for himself, whether any of us agree with that action or not. Frankly I would not have returned and would do my best to get a refund. I do not see how his choice of OC'ing being wrong for the comfort of others should matter though.
    "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you can not confirm their validity."
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    This thread is a good example of why there needs to be sign standards as in some states, TX comes to mind. In OH, the only standard is that there is a sign somewhere on the premesis. We have a theater - Springdale 18 - that is posted, but in such a poor manner as to make the signs virtually unnoticable. I had been there many times before I saw the signs. They are in about a 6 point font, at ankle level and not on every door.

    After I saw the signs, I went back the next day to confirm what I had seen. To read the sign, actually be able to discern what it says, I had to get on my knees in front of the door. Obviously, I did this in the morning before they opened. In addition to the size of the sign, it is light text on a clear background and tends to blend in with the surroundings. Most people looking for these signs will fail to see them - BUT, they still have the force of law.

    I do not go to that theater anymore and have not since the day I saw the sign 4 years ago (before getting my CCW). We have other options in town, but my point is if someone were carrying at the Springdale 18, they would be in violation of the law, but it would be totally understandable as management has not effectively posted their premesis. I would hope if management called the cops that the cops would act as the one in the OPs story and not arrest the CCer/OCer because they were unaware of the signage.

    I have contacted my state reps and senators about this in the past, and they have no appetite for homogenizing no carry signs in the state. It seems to me that if you are going to hold people responsible for following sign laws, that the signs should be uniform in size, placement and content so that carriers have a chance. Just my $0.02.

    Here are pics I took when I returned to see what the sign said. The last one is a pretty significant blow-up of the sign.

    3.jpg4.jpg5.jpg6.jpg
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    I wouldn't have stood up. I would have kept my mouth shut and my gun on my person. But I live in a state where these signs do not carry the force of law.

    While the original shooting occurred in CO, where these signs do not carry the force of law, OP's story occurred in TN, where these signs do carry the force of law.

    IMO these laws and signs are unconstitutional and must be banned by federal law. Gun-free zones are public hazards.

    Bad call on the state's part. Bad call on the employee's part. Bad call on the policeman's part. Bad call on the CCWs who made themselves known.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    IMO these laws and signs are unconstitutional and must be banned by federal law. Gun-free zones are public hazards.
    They are, I agree. The mere fact murders, robberies, rapes and other heinous violent crimes continue to exist isn't helped in the least by citizens who find themselves incapable of surviving the encounters.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    IMO these laws and signs are unconstitutional and must be banned by federal law.
    I completely disagree. A property owner should be able to restrict/enforce just about anything on his or her property. Appropriate attire, language, outside food and drink, loud noises, cell phones, or even public displays of affection. If the theater owner wants to post the property against the carriage of firearms and make it mandatory that all patrons wear nothing but clear plastic body condoms, orange reflective safety vests, surgical masks and bicycle helmets, that's fine with me. Any one of those conditions, however, will convince me to take my business elsewhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    Gun-free zones are public hazards.
    I completely agree.

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    Ksholder:

    The sign says "Unless otherwise authorized by law.........". Is a permit/license "authorization" e.g. your concealed carry license or permit "authorization" by law?
    Last edited by Rock and Glock; August 2nd, 2012 at 12:54 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock and Glock View Post
    Ksholder:

    The sign says "Unless otherwise authorized by law.........". Is a permit/license "authorization" e.g. your concealed carry license or permit "authorization" by law?
    No. Good thought, but that is the AG's preferred language in OH to bar weapons. Cops are the otherwise authorized class in that sign.
    It's the Land of Opportunity, not the Land of Entitlements - Vote America!!!

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  16. #90
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    No. Good thought, but that is the AG's preferred language in OH to bar weapons. Cops are the otherwise authorized class in that sign.
    Understood, and that clarifies the matter. Colorado has some weird signage with respect to OC that uses the "authorized under the law" blah blah blah.............
    Richard

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