An OC'er looking for a confrontation!!!! Surely not. Great Officer response. - Page 6

An OC'er looking for a confrontation!!!! Surely not. Great Officer response.

This is a discussion on An OC'er looking for a confrontation!!!! Surely not. Great Officer response. within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Each time these threads come up people bring up these OC'ers are "just baiting" the cops. Somehow that's not ok, but it's perfectly fine for ...

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Thread: An OC'er looking for a confrontation!!!! Surely not. Great Officer response.

  1. #76
    VIP Member Array Bad Bob's Avatar
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    Each time these threads come up people bring up these OC'ers are "just baiting" the cops. Somehow that's not ok, but it's perfectly fine for LEO's to bait criminals with cars with keys in them, drugs, etc. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Each side is wrong when taking the bait.
    Leaving keys in a car gives a criminal an opportunity. He wouldnt know the keys were there unless he was actively looking for them. A dude walking around with a wannabe MP5, being followed by a camera crew is quite different.
    When the subject is behaving in such a manner that draws attention to himself and has his buddy along filming it, it is an obvious attempt to coerce a certain behavior from the police. That is morally wrong, and in my opinion he was looking for a fight. He did not get the fight he wanted, what he got a very professional knowledgeable officer that ate his lunch.

    I support responsible OC, but not stupid people doing stupid things to elicit an improper response.
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  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Yep, cops all lie. Were you not a cop??????



    Your calling a spade a spade, thats all well and good. However comparing a criminal to a officer of the law, is not a spade for a spade.
    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Cut the crap and keep it on topic.
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  3. #78
    Senior Member Array Spidey2011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Yep, cops all lie. Were you not a cop??????
    I don't think anyone here would say that ALL cops lie, but it is becoming more common. My hats off to the officers like the one in the video, but there are some cops that don't deserve the time of day.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Your calling a spade a spade, thats all well and good. However comparing a criminal to a officer of the law, is not a spade for a spade.
    I'm seeing a lot more cops committing crimes these days. I could tell you some stories about the drug dealing deputies and the pedophile currently on the city PD. I will agree that the analogy used was a bit off, but denying that cops commit crimes is a bit off as well.

  4. #79
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spidey2011 View Post
    I don't think anyone here would say that ALL cops lie, but it is becoming more common. My hats off to the officers like the one in the video, but there are some cops that don't deserve the time of day.

    I'm seeing a lot more cops committing crimes these days. I could tell you some stories about the drug dealing deputies and the pedophile currently on the city PD. I will agree that the analogy used was a bit off, but denying that cops commit crimes is a bit off as well.
    He said this officer did. Sorry not my words. I do not believe the officer in the video lied...

    There are bad people everywhere, cops are no exception. It happens, but comparing criminals to officers is just plan silly....
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  5. #80
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    Some are one in the same. Just because you choose to be a cop does not make you incapable of being a criminal.

    This site is notorious for being against anything that puts officers in a bad light so I'll stop there.

    Lastly, he never said the cop lied as far as I can tell.

    This officer should be the norm, not the exception. He's praised for acting accordingly while the other guy is bashed for doing nothing, and also acting accordingly and within his rights.

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  6. #81
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder71 View Post
    Some are one in the same. Just because you choose to be a cop does not make you incapable of being a criminal.

    This site is notorious for being against anything that puts officers in a bad light so I'll stop there.

    Lastly, he never said the cop lied as far as I can tell.

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    ALLEGEDLY: questionably true or of a specified kind....Might as well said the officer lied. ..There is no doubt that we have bad eggs in every profession nobody is questioning that. What happened was this officer won the battle that the OCer was looking for.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

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  7. #82
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    Great video. Need more LEO's like this around: direct, professional, respectful, and informative.
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  8. #83
    Distinguished Member Array ericb327's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedrgr21 View Post
    Each time these threads come up people bring up these OC'ers are "just baiting" the cops. Somehow that's not ok, but it's perfectly fine for LEO's to bait criminals with cars with keys in them, drugs, etc. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Each side is wrong when taking the bait.
    Wrong is wrong! Does not matter who does is.
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  9. #84
    Distinguished Member Array ericb327's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    I really couldn't care less that the guy is open carrying or even that he's open carrying a rifle. Ehh.. whatever, dude.

    But what makes me raise my eyebrows and not want to share a lunch table with someone like this is that there is something..... off about it all.

    Okay, if you feel you need to walk around with your rifle strapped to you.. go for it, dude! I won't even get into the why. "Because I can," is fine enough for me.

    What is weird is that, in watching these videos, it's like some perverted narcissism. Carrying a handgun just wasn't edgy enough.. wasn't attention grabbing enough..

    "Look at me, everyone! I'm carrying a rifle! That's right. I'm bad ass. Go ahead, ask me about it. Come on, ask me!"

    He as much as says so in his videos.

    Now, he can say he's doing it because he just wants to educate people.. Yeah... uh huh.. right. Sure. And that might be the story he tells himself when he wakes up in the morning and slings his rifle over his shoulder. And, yeah.. he might actually be educating some people in the process and I'm fine with that. But my little eye spies someone who just likes the attention. He likes the stares and the whispers and the glances out of the corner of the room. He doesn't want to be the grey man. In fact, he wants to be the neon green with flashing lights man and he's proud of it. The confrontations with officers are just by-products of getting the attention he wants. This is as close as he will get to celebrity status and he is EATING IT UP!!!

    Come on... the camera on him while he walks down the street and talks like he's someone big and important. The random comments from people who pass him by. The people stopping him to talk to him and get his opinion on things. The hundreds of thousands of comments he gets from these videos he posts online. I'm sure every hit is a little shot of dopamine straight to the pleasure center of his brain.

    I'm not saying he's wrong. There are worse things he could do for attention.

    He is legal.

    And as far as how smart or not smart it is to open carry a rifle.. whatever.. there are valid arguments on both sides. Personally I don't think it's that smart but that's just my opinion.

    I just don't like that brand of narcissism.
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  10. #85
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spidey2011 View Post
    I have to respectfully disagree. We don't have the rights that we should, and we DO need to stand up and get those rights back. the 2nd Amendment says the words "shall not be infringed," yet those rights are infringed upon every day. Would it be better if these guys broke the unconstitutional laws that are already on the books? Or is it a smarter move to simply exercise our current rights in a public manner? I think the latter is the best move, and exactly what this guy did. At no point was he disrespectful to the officer, and I certainly didn't see him as having a chip on his shoulder. I see nothing wrong with what he did or how he did it.

    I think a lot of people get caught up in the actions of a few complete idiots, so they view all of these encounters as negative. There is no reason to consider this a negative encounter. Everyone was polite and courteous, and no ones rights were violated. Sounds pretty positive to me.
    First of all I think that he was wanting an encounter. Second he seemed frustrated IMO when the LEO wouldn't lose his cool and start an inane debate with him on the side of the road. The LEO in this encounter did not need to be educated by some moron who wanted his moment of fame.
    As far as having a recording device handy..I recommend it for everybody regardless of how they are carrying.
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  11. #86
    VIP Member Array nedrgr21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Your calling a spade a spade, thats all well and good. However comparing a criminal to a officer of the law, is not a spade for a spade.
    Each is giving the other an opportunity to do something wrong, why is it ok for LEO's, but not private citizens?

    The criminal stealing a car is violating someone else's rights to retain their property, the cop stopping an OC'er for doing something legal is violating that person's rights. Or are you saying that just b/c a LEO has a badge, nothing they do amounts violating the rights of citizens?

    How many of these videos show LEO's losing their cool and being frustrated by someone who knows their rights, but the OC'er is the one being called a jerk?

  12. #87
    VIP Member Array nedrgr21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 40Bob View Post
    When the subject is behaving in such a manner that draws attention to himself and has his buddy along filming it, it is an obvious attempt to coerce a certain behavior from the police. That is morally wrong, and in my opinion he was looking for a fight. He did not get the fight he wanted, what he got a very professional knowledgeable officer that ate his lunch.

    I support responsible OC, but not stupid people doing stupid things to elicit an improper response.
    When the LEO is behaving in such a manner that draws attention to himself, it is an obvious attempt to coerce a certain behavior from the citizen. That is morally wrong, and in my opinion he was looking for a fight.

    When LEO's get a MWAG call and the citizen is observed doing nothing wrong, but a stop is initiated anyway, the LEO is the one looking for a fight. So are you the one who gets to decide where the line is drawn?
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  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedrgr21 View Post
    The criminal stealing a car is violating someone else's rights to retain their property, the cop stopping an OC'er for doing something legal is violating that person's rights. Or are you saying that just b/c a LEO has a badge, nothing they do amounts violating the rights of citizens?
    Nope, the criminal is not violating anyone's rights. Only the state (government) can do that. The cop received a call for service. He has a duty to respond and investigate. Case law in this case Terry VS Ohio (which also touches on about 20 other cases for further clarification) gives the officer constitutional authority for a brief detention for investigative purposes, which he did and let the subject walk. Before you start saying LEO's what they can and cannot do you should study the constitution and its associated case law.
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  14. #89
    VIP Member Array Bad Bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedrgr21 View Post
    When the LEO is behaving in such a manner that draws attention to himself, it is an obvious attempt to coerce a certain behavior from the citizen. That is morally wrong, and in my opinion he was looking for a fight.

    When LEO's get a MWAG call and the citizen is observed doing nothing wrong, but a stop is initiated anyway, the LEO is the one looking for a fight. So are you the one who gets to decide where the line is drawn?
    I do not understand why you edited my statement to suit your agenda. I think I answered your question in my previous post.
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  15. #90
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    The view of an active leo...
    1. That kid is an idiot. I believe in open carry but that kid does not represent me.
    2. The officer couldn't have been more professional. The kid was being purposefully confrontational and the officer still was calm and kept control of the situation.
    3. I'm guessing that state has no common law concerning going armed to the terror of the public? In my state I would have explained that to him, advised him why he was doing something that was ill advised, and if he still didn't get it I would have arrested him.
    Bad Bob, Bubbiesdad and 357and40 like this.

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