Is it getting out of hand?

Is it getting out of hand?

This is a discussion on Is it getting out of hand? within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Im not sure if this question has been asked. Sorry to step on or over anyone elses toes if I missed it, I looked for ...

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Thread: Is it getting out of hand?

  1. #1
    Member Array norb5150's Avatar
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    Is it getting out of hand?

    Im not sure if this question has been asked. Sorry to step on or over anyone elses toes if I missed it, I looked for this and could not pin point what I wanted to find out. So here goes,

    Open carry as I understand it was not an issue in Pennsylvania when it came to the transport of long guns from point A to point B as long as the firearm was unloaded. Basically this meant you could walk from your house to your car with a long gun (rifle, legal length shot gun, etc.) unloaded to transport it to a shooting range or for hunting purposes, going to LGS etc. I could be way wrong on this, but I never had problems for doing as so.

    I live in Erie, PA where absolute "blanking" retards will do anything imaginable and or unimaginable to get on TV. I like the option of open carry simply for the fact that while Im cc if My shirt happens to come un-tucked or my jacket rides up and my edc happens to become visible, I am in no way now breaking a LAW.

    Open Carry for attention? Jesus man!

    The reason for this is so:
    A group of attention getters decide they are going to go to the Center of the city and march in the park Open Carry all day just to say hey I can do this. It was hands down the most utter act of stupidity I have ever witnessed in my life. Where they chose to march and protest was the least likely spot you would ever bump into a criminal who was in the act of or participating in a crime because the park where they were marching is across the street from the police station to the south the county courthouse to the west the federal court house to the east and several college type atmosphere taverns to the north.

    Of course the media singled out the most retarded looking individual they could find and verbally interviewed him on live camera and tape recording to put this clown in the spot light. The guy didnt even know the calibre of the pistol he had holstered. This same idiot two days later decides he is going to march his "Bad Don't Screw w Me I got a GUN on my HIP" attitude into a Bank to cash a check yes while OC. Why he is not in jail for being stupid is beyond me.

    So back to the title: IS IT GETTING OUT OF HAND? In my opinion it is.
    I understand that there are states in which OC is the only allowed option. But in places where cc is allowed, Why let a potential BG know you got a means of defending yourself from his/her actions?
    K.I.S.S. (keep it simple Stupid)


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
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    My how times change. There was a time, particularly in NC, where gentlemen OC'd and criminals CC'd. It's even commented on in our case law. The problem with freedom is that some people get to be free to be idiots so the rest of us can be free to do what we want. Restrict the idiots, and you loose your freedom in the process.
    I prefer to live dangerously free than safely caged!

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  3. #3
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    Remember:

    When we originally opened this forum, I added a notation that this was not the place to "debate the virtues of open carry", essentially making it a protected forum. I have, since then, debated whether this was the right thing to do since we did not place any restrictions on other forums.

    Open carry is a controversial subject, particularly when those that do OC do so specifically to garner attention to the practice. While we still discourage arguments over this topic, we will no longer offer "protection" for those who's practices invoke controversy. We now all stand on even ground but we will not hesitate to issue infractions for those that cross the line in comments and rebuttals.

    If you can accept these changes, we will continue to welcome you to this forum. If not, there is another forum out there that may be more to your liking....

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array blitzburgh's Avatar
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    A group of attention getters decide they are going to go to the Center of the city and march in the park Open Carry all day just to say hey I can do this.
    So what? What makes them a group of "attention getters" instead of a group exercising their right and doing so during a demonstration?

    It was hands down the most utter act of stupidity I have ever witnessed in my life. Where they chose to march and protest was the least likely spot you would ever bump into a criminal who was in the act of or participating in a crime because the park where they were marching is across the street from the police station to the south the county courthouse to the west the federal court house to the east and several college type atmosphere taverns to the north.
    Why does that location make it "hands down the most utter act of stupidity you've ever witnessed in your life"? What better place to do it than right outside the doors of the powers that may be. IMO, sounds like the perfect place to do so, especially if they've been getting hassled by the LEO's there.

    Of course the media singled out the most retarded looking individual they could find and verbally interviewed him on live camera and tape recording to put this clown in the spot light. The guy didnt even know the calibre of the pistol he had holstered. This same idiot two days later decides he is going to march his "Bad Don't Screw w Me I got a GUN on my HIP" attitude into a Bank to cash a check yes while OC. Why he is not in jail for being stupid is beyond me.
    No surprise there. Of course the media will choose that guy every day of the week (and twice on Sunday) as opposed tI'o an "every day guy" who's knowledgeable and well presented.

    To answer your question: In general, yes, this is getting out of hand. Those who OC to "bait" are just giving gun owners in general (IMO) a bad name. However, in this particular instance, I can see why they chose and did what they did. I'm born and raised in Pittsburgh, PA and have spent the majority of my life in Allegheny County and surrounding counties. OC is legal, but you can pretty much bet your ass that'll you harassed for doing so. That's the problem. Why should one be hassled for abiding by the laws?

    What's really getting out of the hand is how OC'ers get treated in most parts of PA. Many have been charged with disorderly conduct, breach of peace, etc. Look into it and THEN tell me who's getting out of hand. I'd suggest you start with http://www.pafoa.org/ and go from there to see how OC'ers get treated.
    RT and atctimmy like this.
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  5. #5
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    I have never open carried. I can see a point in it sometimes, I suppose, but I don't EVER want ANYONE to know what firearms I have and when I am armed (at least outside of my own family). It is a last resort tool for me and it can't stay as such unless it is kept hidden.

    I will, however, be quite ready to defend and even advance any law abiding person's right to carry (open or concealed) if I have the opportunity to do so. If they were making a political statement by doing so, they should be even more protected, not less. It isn't something I would choose to do or be involved in, but if they are being harrassed there I don't blame them for pushing back.

    I don't hold with stupid people carrying either, but what is the alternative? An intelligence test for being able to exercise your rights? Slippery slope there no matter how you propose to deal with it.
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  6. #6
    VIP Member Array blitzburgh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GraySkies View Post
    I have never open carried. I can see a point in it sometimes, I suppose, but I don't EVER want ANYONE to know what firearms I have and when I am armed (at least outside of my own family). It is a last resort tool for me and it can't stay as such unless it is kept hidden.

    I will, however, be quite ready to defend and even advance any law abiding person's right to carry (open or concealed) if I have the opportunity to do so.
    I agree. Though I personally choose to CC, I respect the rights and choices of those who wish to OC. We're all the same. Carry methods shouldn't divide us.
    msc8127, d2jlking and carracer like this.
    "Rebellion against tyrants is obedience to God." - Benjamin Franklin
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    Quote Originally Posted by norb5150 View Post
    ...
    Of course the media singled out the most retarded looking individual they could find and verbally interviewed him on live camera and tape recording to put this clown in the spot light. The guy didnt even know the calibre of the pistol he had holstered. This same idiot two days later decides he is going to march his "Bad Don't Screw w Me I got a GUN on my HIP" attitude into a Bank to cash a check yes while OC. Why he is not in jail for being stupid is beyond me.
    Is it against the law in Pennsylvania to OC in a bank? (Not being a smarty pants, I'm just not familiar with the OC/CC laws of Pennsylvania.

  8. #8
    Member Array minimalbrat's Avatar
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    For states that are very sticky on printing open carry is another way to carry. Depending on how a person dresses it can be very hard to keep the gun completely not showing. I open carry in my house, in the yard and going to my mail box. I am not going to put something on when it is hot out just to cover my firearm. I haven't, so far, open carried out in public but that doesn't mean I won't decide to do so depending on where I am. For example, if I am at a friends house and they don't care about the gun why not open carry and not have to choose my clothes to cover the gun. Much easier to open carry in a pair of shorts and snug t shirt at the family bbq than to have to wear clothes in the hot summer sun to cover the gun. How about at the park in the summer when the family goes to cook out and enjoy the day with other family members? Why should I have to be hot and sticky with a cover shirt on instead of sitting around in a sleeveless shirt with a pair of shorts?

    How about the police start informing people when they call about someone who is open carrying that it isn't against the law and they can't just stop everyone who open carries. How would people like it if every time they walked out of a bar a cop stopped them to see if they were drunk? I don't think they would like it at all. People would be yelling they were only drinking coke and there was no reason for the officer to stop them.
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    Member Array Ogre's Avatar
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    I understand that there are states in which OC is the only allowed option. But in places where cc is allowed, Why let a potential BG know you got a means of defending yourself from his/her actions?

    So that the casual/BG of opportunity will be deterred from assaulting my person. If BG KNOWS he can be shot/killed, perhaps survival instinct will prevent him even attempting anything. As far as those who say that they fear drawing potential thieves to their house etc. ; do you not wear or allow your significant other to wear jewelry? Nice clothes? Do you drive a hunk-o-junk rust bucket? Purposefully live in a run down house/apartment? IMHO those things (jewelry, nice clothes, nice vehicle, nice house) are more likely to attract thief type BGs than an oc'd firearm. They scream "rob me I have STUFF". The oc'd gun says "TRY to rob me and I WILL shoot you"
    tcox4freedom likes this.

  10. #10
    VIP Member Array SmokinFool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blitzburgh View Post
    I agree. Though I personally choose to CC, I respect the rights and choices of those who wish to OC. We're all the same. Carry methods shouldn't divide us.
    ^^^THIS^^^

    Whether one can see any advantage to OC or not, we should all be able to agree that we all have the right, where allowable by law, to carry openly. It's as simple as that. As law abiding gun owners/carriers we have too many uphill battles to fight to allow ourselves to be divided by an issue that, in the overall scheme of things, is rather trivial.
    Eagleks likes this.

  11. #11
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    I have OC'd for the past 2 weeks:)
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  12. #12
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    The OC 'do gooders' in CA screwed the rest of the hunters and normal citizens trying to just transport a legal firearm to the point of use. LEARN FROM IT!

    Not to mention how much they hurt the fight for a change from 'May Issue' to 'Shall Issue' in CA.

    If you really want attention, go OC in a Walmart and make sure to blow your own brains out, instead of ruining it for the greater cause.

    My opinion. Please IM me if you do not agree. I will offer a very Civil discussion on my feelings on this issue.
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    Hey; kinda like those damned attention hound blacks that wouldn't leave the Woolworth's lunch counter or sit in the back of the buss where they belonged!!

    Maybe it's just here on the western slope of Colorado, but I OC every day everywhere including the bank, county annex (license plates), county clerk (voters office), city building (question on water bill) Dept of Wildlife (questions on boating on the Colorado River) and down main Street during special events (farmers market, art festival) ya know what kind of reaction I get from LEO? I had a couple city cops pass on the magazine side at a farmers market, change course and walk up to me, older guy with 2 stripes and a "kid" i wasn't sure even shaved yet (probably FTO and rookie)...

    older cop} Are you open carrying, I see your magazines
    me hands raised to mid chest and rotating so he can see the sidearm} yea it's right here
    older cop} That's fine, it's your right and I support it. In fact I wish there were more guys like you, there'd be less crime, thank you for open carrying.
    He offered his hand, I shook hands with the rookie as well, we talked guns for a bit and they went on their way. I suspect it was the FTO's way of introducing the rookie to OC in western Colorado.

  14. #14
    RT
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    Quote Originally Posted by norb5150 View Post
    Of course the media singled out the most retarded looking individual they could find and verbally interviewed him on live camera and tape recording to put this clown in the spot light. The guy didnt even know the calibre of the pistol he had holstered. This same idiot two days later decides he is going to march his "Bad Don't Screw w Me I got a GUN on my HIP" attitude into a Bank to cash a check yes while OC. Why he is not in jail for being stupid is beyond me.
    You mean to tell me that this "idiot" had the audacity to walk into a bank to cash a check while performing the legal act of carrying a firearm, and he wasn't arrested? What is this world coming to? Shame on him for doing something that appears to be perfectly legal (as long as the bank wasn't posted), and shame on those bank employees for neglecting their duties to freak out at the sight of his gun and summon the police. It looks like PA has a rather short list of places that are "gun-free", and, as far as I can tell, banks are not on that list.

    So back to the title: IS IT GETTING OUT OF HAND? In my opinion it is.
    I understand that there are states in which OC is the only allowed option. But in places where cc is allowed, Why let a potential BG know you got a means of defending yourself from his/her actions?
    K.I.S.S. (keep it simple Stupid)
    Why not? Are you trying to say that openly carrying a firearm makes someone more of a target? Sorry, but there is very little evidence to support that idea. If you look hard enough, you will find that there are only a few reports of people being targeted solely because they were OC, and if you combine that with the already very low probability of being in a SD encounter in the first place, the odds of it occuring are almost nonexistent. People can throw out the, "If I were a BG, I wouldn't be deterred by an OCer because I would get the drop on him and take him out first," all day long, but based on reports (or the lack thereof), it appears that most criminals don't utilize that mindset. Otherwise, we probably would have heard about a lot more OCers being gunned down.

  15. #15
    VIP Member Array blitzburgh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    Hey; kinda like those damned attention hound blacks that wouldn't leave the Woolworth's lunch counter or sit in the back of the buss where they belonged!!
    WHOA, DUDE. What the hell is wrong with you?
    "Rebellion against tyrants is obedience to God." - Benjamin Franklin
    "Experience: that most brutal of teachers. But you learn, my God do you learn." - C.S. Lewis

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