Open Carry for newbies

This is a discussion on Open Carry for newbies within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Pythius increasing folks with CC, decreases crime-rates. Statistics show violent crimes down since passage of concealed carry law There is literally living ...

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  1. #46
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    Array DaveWorkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pythius View Post
    increasing folks with CC, decreases crime-rates.

    Statistics show violent crimes down since passage of concealed carry law

    There is literally living proof in Florida that its concealed carry and other pro-gun laws save lives.

    From 1987, when the concealed carry law was passed, until 2006, murder and non-negligent manslaughter rates in Florida plunged 45 percent, to 6.2 per 100,000 persons from 11.4, according to crime rate statistics compiled annually by the Federal Bureau of Investigation.

    Pythius:

    you got a link for this?

    It's always a good idea to provide a link (gets around copyright problems) and it helps those of us who want to see the original

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  3. #47
    Member Array LkWd_Don's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdBro View Post
    I'm impressed it doesn't happen more often. If I OCed in Milwaukee, it would start total chaos.
    I can't say how long OC has been accepted, but it has slowly gotten to where most of the citizenry no longer freak at the sight of an openly carried/properly holstered firearm, it does still happen, just not very often. Where I live, within 5 miles of the Army Base and just over a mile to the Air Force Base, we get a lot of transplants from other parts of the Country that are not aware of OC, but being Military, they grow quickly accustomed to seeing it, and frequently enjoy it for themselves.
    Lets Unite and REMIND our Government that WE are the source of their authority and that WE demand our Rights be returned, Unabridged, Non-infringed, without denial or disparagement.

  4. #48
    Member Array LkWd_Don's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pythius View Post
    increasing folks with CC, decreases crime-rates.
    Statistics show violent crimes down since passage of concealed carry law

    ~~ snipped ~~

    "The mere potential for an armed citizenry deters violent crime," ~~ snipped ~~
    The data indicates that even the mere possibility that Florida citizens might be armed and therefore have the capability of protecting themselves are deterrents to criminals. ~~ snipped ~~
    I agree with Dave.

    You should post a link to where you are getting your data.

    I and I am fairly certain that Dave would agree with those quotes in your statement that I put in bold.
    Those statements alone explain why the crime rate has decreased. More armed Citizenry not specifically Carrying Concealed.

    When you go back into the FBI website, see if you can find data that gives the Crime-rate committed per capita for States like Washington, Wyoming, Colorado, Montana and then compare that to States with Extreme gun-control bills such as Illinois, Washington DC, and California. You will see an astonishing trend, with Gun-Control comes an increase in gun-related crimes per capita.

    I went to http://www.ucrdatatool.gov/Search/Cr...YearofData.cfm

    and pulled 2010 data for all states, both Violent Crime and Property Crime. here is some of the results. They are not per-capita.

    I am going to list a few states Results for Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter (does not say if by gun, knife, pencil, hatchet, etc.. )
    You would really see a big difference in the overall violent crimes, if I were to paste all of those too.
    Those area's with greater gun-control have higher rates of crime. Where those with few gun-controls have lower violent crime rates.

    First I will list a couple states with extreme gun-control.
    The State, then the population, then the number of Murders.
    Illinois - 12,830,632 - 706
    California - 37,253,956 - 1,809
    District of Collumbia - 601,723 - 132
    Now I will list a few States with few Gun-controls.

    Washington State - 6,724,540 - 152 (6 million 100 thousand more residents but only 20 additional murders over DC - even if you doubled this population and doubled the murders, you would still be half of the Illinois murder rate)

    Wyoming - 563,626 - 8 (roughly 38,000 fewer residents than DC, but .06% of the Murders committed in DC)

    Montana - 989,415 - 26
    Colorado - 5,029,196 - 120

    You will also have to understand that most of the states give data on if a crime listed in one collumn is also listed in another so that only the most severe will be counted, Illinois does not do that, the the FBI has to extrapolate the results.
    So in reality, Illinois could be considerably higher than stated.
    Illinois -
    The state UCR Program was unable to provide 1985-current forcible rape figures in accordance with national UCR Program guidelines. The rape totals were estimated using national rates per 100,000 inhabitants within the eight population groups and assigning the forcible rape volumes proportionally to the state. Rockford, Illinois, has provided valid forcible rape counts as of 2006.
    For 1993 state NIBRS conversion efforts resulted in estimation for Illinois. Since valid annual totals were available for approximately 60 Illinois agencies, those counts were maintained. The counts for the remaining jurisdictions were replaced with the most recent valid annual totals or were generated using standard estimaton procedures. The results of all sources were then combined to arrive at the 1993 state total for Illinois.
    For 1994 state NIBRS conversion efforts resulted in estimation for Illinois. Illinois totals were generated using only the valid crime rates for the East North Central Division. Within each population group, the state's offense totals were estimated based on the rate per 100,000 inhabitants within the remainder of the division.
    For 1996-current, the state UCR Program was unable to provide complete offense figures in accordance with UCR guidelines. Valid Part I counts were available for most of the largest cities (100,000 and over in population). For other agencies, the only available counts generated by the Illinois State Program were state totals based upon an incident-level system without indication of multiple offenses recorded within single incidents. Therefore, the UCR Hierarchy Rule could not be applied in order to convert the state's data to Summary Reporting System data. (The Hierarchy Rule requires that only the most serious offense in a multiple-offense criminal incident is counted.) To arrive at a comparable stae estimate to be included in national compilations, the Illinois State Program's state totals (which were inflated because of the nonapplication of the Hierarchy Rule) were reduced by the proportion of multiple offenses reported within single incidents in the NIBRS database. Valid totals for the large cities were excluded from the reduction process.
    Lets Unite and REMIND our Government that WE are the source of their authority and that WE demand our Rights be returned, Unabridged, Non-infringed, without denial or disparagement.

  5. #49
    Member Array R.C.BG.380's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SmokinFool View Post
    ^^^This^^^

    I won't go into my whole dissertation, as I have articulated my position on this in several similar threads. I will boil it down to this concise statement:

    I encourage all who are legally eligible to carry to do so, whether concealed or openly, when and where it is legal. I would ask all the ninjas to stay home, as they are not doing us any good whatsoever.
    Ninjas? never herd that. whats it mean?

  6. #50
    Ex Member Array AdBro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.C.BG.380 View Post
    Ninjas? never herd that. whats it mean?
    apparently he doesn't like stealth martial arts peeps

  7. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by RightsEroding View Post
    Quite simple..and as others have said, I too have posted several responses.


    If you don't exercise your rights; they will disappear.
    There's more truth in that statement than most understand. I'm a ham radio operator. It is common knowledge in that hobby that we need to keep a close eye on all frequencies inside all the bands and make sure there is a limited amount of none use across the board. If the governing body (The FCC) notices a certain section inside any band with a noticable lack of traffic, it will be only a matter of time till it is confiscated and taken from the amateur use and assigned another.

    The same will happen with our gun rights with each guard dropped. And there hard enough to come by now adays, and going to get a lot harder in the future. We need to hold tight to each one we have while grabbing with the other hand for another grip on the next.
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  8. #52
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    I will admit that I use both forms of carry, generally leaning more with OC. Once in a while I will get a strange look at a grocery store or gas station but I do not showboat that I am armed. It seems if you are polite to people around you and don't look like you are there to cause trouble it is pretty well accepted here in Montana. Someone else said it perfectly, responsibility is key to carry regardless of how you do it
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  9. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesis76 View Post
    I will admit that I use both forms of carry, generally leaning more with OC. Once in a while I will get a strange look at a grocery store or gas station but I do not showboat that I am armed. It seems if you are polite to people around you and don't look like you are there to cause trouble it is pretty well accepted here in Montana. Someone else said it perfectly, responsibility is key to carry regardless of how you do it
    yea...but montana is MUCH different that most states (and beautiful)

  10. #54
    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesis76 View Post
    I will admit that I use both forms of carry, generally leaning more with OC. Once in a while I will get a strange look at a grocery store or gas station but I do not showboat that I am armed. It seems if you are polite to people around you and don't look like you are there to cause trouble it is pretty well accepted here in Montana. Someone else said it perfectly, responsibility is key to carry regardless of how you do it
    About the same here in Arizona.
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  11. #55
    Member Array ttyndall's Avatar
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    Everyone has an opinion of why you should or should not Open Carry. A lot of the comments are against Opn Carry because it is Show Boating.
    However, I am in Florida and we cannot Open Carry. I am 66 and have no desrie to "Show Boat".
    But, it is also harder to pick clothes that hide a concealed weapon. You either wear you shirt out or have to wear a coat.
    It would be nice to wear my shirt tucked in and not wear a coat in a warm climate.
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  12. #56
    Member Array shadow247's Avatar
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    I open carry for 2 reasons.

    1. It is my right to do so. - This is fundamental to me.
    2. It is the only way I can currently legally carry a firearm.

    I abhor the idea of asking "permission" to carry a concealed weapon. The bad guys don't ask permission to rob me, so why should I have to ask permission to conceal my weapon to protect myself from bad guys. I will get my CHP eventually, but only because I don't want to be at risk of arrest for "accidental concealment." Even once I have my CHP, I will continue to open carry. As long as you carry yourself like a professional, dress nicely, and don't have an attitude, your chances of actually be confronted over it are pretty slim.
    Truth is treason in an empire of lies - Ron Paul
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  13. #57
    Member Array FUZZ's Avatar
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    Lets just be clear. Carrying a firearm is not a right. It's a privilege. A 'right', by definition, cannot be taken away. You're ability to carry a firearm legally CAN be taken away. (i.e.: convicted felon, multiple DUIs, domestic violence, etc.) Therefore, it is a legal privilege. I say be thankful you/we/I have this privilege, those of us that do, and fly under the radar. Carrying a firearm is largely about responsibility as much as its about protection. Lets do so responsibly. Carrying a firearm openly with the intention of engaging law enforcement in a civil rights debate is irresponsible. On top of it being a stupid waste of time for everyone involved. just my two cents.
    -You know Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocketship underpants don't help.

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  14. #58
    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FUZZ View Post
    Lets just be clear. Carrying a firearm is not a right. It's a privilege. A 'right', by definition, cannot be taken away. You're ability to carry a firearm legally CAN be taken away. (i.e.: convicted felon, multiple DUIs, domestic violence, etc.) Therefore, it is a legal privilege. I say be thankful you/we/I have this privilege, those of us that do, and fly under the radar. Carrying a firearm is largely about responsibility as much as its about protection. Lets do so responsibly. Carrying a firearm openly with the intention of engaging law enforcement in a civil rights debate is irresponsible. On top of it being a stupid waste of time for everyone involved. just my two cents.
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  15. #59
    VIP Member Array SmokinFool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.C.BG.380 View Post
    Ninjas? never herd that. whats it mean?
    Sorry I'm late coming back to this thread. "Ninja" or "Open Carry Ninja" are terms I coined to describe those people who go out their door armed to the teeth (and with a video camera), with a chip on their shoulders, acting in as obnoxious a way as possible, with the express intent of causing a reaction from other citizens and in particular, law enforcement, so they can put up a video about how "the man" is (figuratively) beating them down. Most of them are only after their fifteen minutes of fame, but some of them actually feel they are doing us gun owners a service. I disagree with the latter assertion, and I wish they would just stay home, or at least take it down several notches.

  16. #60
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    Gah! Let's not play necromancer with Pythius threads. For a brief moment, I thought he had come back!
    Brad426 and Rock and Glock like this.
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