City says No Open Carry

This is a discussion on City says No Open Carry within the Open Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Each to their own.Unless i had no choice,i wouldn't ever open carry...

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Thread: City says No Open Carry

  1. #31
    Ex Member Array gregnsc's Avatar
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    Each to their own.Unless i had no choice,i wouldn't ever open carry

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  3. #32
    Member Array keboostman's Avatar
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    Open carry is legal where I live (VA). However, I live in a metropolitan area with more than one million people in the county. Open carry around here is problematic because of confrontations, 911 calls, being mistaken for a police officer, etc. To me, open carry in an urban area is not worth the hassle and i carry concealed. I do open carry, but only when I am in a more rural setting and don't have to deal with the issues associated with being around lots of people. In the original poster's case my opinion is that he should obey the law in his city and, if and when the ban on open carry is overturned, open carry as he wishes.
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  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by MJClark View Post
    A friend has informed me that there is already a lawsuit forming. Apparently the way the language is written, if you CC and have to pull your gun, you will be prosecuted under this Ordinance.
    I wonder what the "tactical advantage" farts think about this one. Do they openly object or coceal their disagreement like sheepskin. I will keep on carrying ad I see fit in my free state but will be triple sure to open carry my middle finger to any local ordinance or idiots who think they know what's best for me.

  5. #34
    Member Array Mdauben's Avatar
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    City says No Open Carry

    Quote Originally Posted by keboostman View Post
    I would obey the law. Open carry scares lots of folks. In almost every situation concealed carry is better.
    I prefer CC for any number of reasons but I still think OC should be legal. For one thing I don't need to worry about being hassled for "brandishing" if I accidentally flash my CC. For another I'm not convinced it is in our best interest to cater to the irrational fears of hoplophobic sheeple.
    Mike

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  6. #35
    Senior Member Array zamboni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    From our friend Gary at US Gunlaw: "123.1102 Regulation of Pistols or Other Firearms. Sec. 2. A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.
    History: 1990, Act 319, Eff. Mar. 28, 1991."
    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Not true... You've missed this part of MI Regs...No local unit of government may regulate firearms or ammunition unless it is expressly declared in state law. That includes HOW it is carried.
    If I'm understanding this correctly no Michigan County, City, or Municipality can over-ride any of Michigan's State Laws, as they pertain to firearms?

    This is becoming commonplace within the boarders of may States as they < a County, City, or Municipality > can not "supersede" any State Law, so as to standardize laws within their borders, and so as to not become too fuzzy as; one person's travels take them from one areas jurisdictions' to an-others within their States Boarder.

    Which here in Michigan's case also seems to include the "Transportation" of any said firearms.

    So, I would think that while anyone is carrying a firearm, it would now be in "Transportation" while being "Transported" from one place to another, by being carried by someone to-&-fro, whether or while, being concealed <CCW> or, carried out in the open <OC>?

  7. #36
    VIP Member Array Crowman's Avatar
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    I know that open carry is not a favorite subject on this forum, however we all need to fight against any anti 2nd amendment laws. We need to stop with are division and become one in the battle to preserve our 2nd amendment rights for all.
    Last edited by Crowman; February 12th, 2013 at 04:01 AM. Reason: Whoops---- worded original wrong
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  8. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by keboostman View Post
    Open carry is legal where I live (VA). However, I live in a metropolitan area with more than one million people in the county. Open carry around here is problematic because of confrontations, 911 calls, being mistaken for a police officer, etc. To me, open carry in an urban area is not worth the hassle and i carry concealed. I do open carry, but only when I am in a more rural setting and don't have to deal with the issues associated with being around lots of people.
    In the original poster's case my opinion is that he should obey the law in his city and, if and when the ban on open carry is overturned, open carry as he wishes
    .

    I also live in VA. Although the Richmond area is smaller than the NoVA area (pop. approx 250,000) I OC probably 99% of the time. Even when I travel to the NoVA area I continue to OC. I have never had a problem, no MWAG calls, no hassles by LE, no little old ladies having a stroke. IMO one of the biggest problems with NoVA is too many people who want to be Marylanders.

    If the city passes a law saying blacks should once again have to ride in the back of the bus, should they do it, even though it is unlawful.
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  9. #38
    VIP Member Array Ksgunner's Avatar
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    If I read it right this is the open carry forum..
    Kansas is a open carry state but each town has its own rules about open carry. I don't open carry myself but then I don't have anything against it either.
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  10. #39
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    Based on the problem you have encountered, the laws there, and the attitudes so many people have on OC, glad I live in Ga and belong to GeorgiaCarry.org. They have squashed this kind of BS like a Texas roach. Regardless of my daily carry mode I still want to be ABLE to open carry. Open carry legal also loosens up the law enforcement and the anal tendencies of having to lay on the sidewalk or take a ride because some sheeple saw your gun peeking out of your coat, or some cop with little training or tolerance sees you slightly printing in Walmart. Criminals dont OC folks and when you make comments like the ones I read it sounds like antigun propaganda more than an experienced group of shooters. Just my opinion but I've evolved to understand just how important your right to OC actually is by watching other states.

    Watch and learn. This kind of thing doesn't happen in Georgia because we dont have these idiotic laws on OC, and we dont have to notify every cop we encounter, and we cant be stopped and frisked.
    Man arrested for having concealed weapon despite legally carrying gun in Florida - YouTube

    Thanks GeorgiaCarry.org for doing such an amazing job. Best $16 dollars a year I've ever spent.

    By the way I still support our CHOICE to conceal carry which I think makes sense in most cases.
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  11. #40
    Member Array Metalman's Avatar
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    So, which city in Michigan is this? I'm near Holland and I have not heard about this. I've been to a couple of Michigan OC meetings and they really seem to know their stuff. I think if they are on the trail this will be resolved in their favor.

  12. #41
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    And here I was coming in to say a city here in MI was doing the same, but alas we're speaking of the same city.

    Keep up the fight over there. Don't let them push you around!
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  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgiaShooter View Post
    Watch and learn. This kind of thing doesn't happen in Georgia because we dont have these idiotic laws on OC, and we dont have to notify every cop we encounter, and we cant be stopped and frisked.
    Man arrested for having concealed weapon despite legally carrying gun in Florida - YouTube
    It's misleading to post old videos, stories, etc. that do not present current laws, statutes, etc., as what it's like today.

    Accidental exposure of a concealed firearm is not illegal, by statute never was, and is now specifically stated so in the FSs. Nor is there a duty to inform an LEO until asked. All charges against the individual in the video were subsequently dropped, and the LEO in it has since "moved on."

    I'm sure all GA LEOs are perfect gentlemen/ladies, but not from what I see on Cops. I'm sure that's an accurate portrayal also.
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  14. #43
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    Well, from what I've read from the posts, it sounds like at best they are exploiting or interpreting an aspect of the existing state law. At worst, they are violating the established law outright.

    What would I do if it were me? Fight it. Intelligently. Don't go around brandishing (not that I'm assuming you would) a firearm to make a point, or bait cops. But maybe try to support whatever organization is working to repeal their unjust law. Don't be afraid to get involved, and to have some potential exposure because of it. If you believe in your rights, then the potential of some media or similar exposure is a small price to pay. Realistically no one will notice or care expect those in the know, ie: the lawmakers you are fighting and the people you are fighting with.

    As you said, a move against OCing is a move against CCing, it's just one of the first obvious roadblocks they need to tackle.

    So again: help fight it, if you care to. Otherwise keep on CCing, and wait for the supposed tactical advantage to save you when they sweep for your CC rights next.

  15. #44
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnsc View Post
    Each to their own.Unless i had no choice,i wouldn't ever open carry
    And you don't care if someone takes their "right" to ???? So, why would anyone care if they take away your right to conceal carry, to buy ammo, to own a gun, to ... ??? Any move by any Govt entity to try to take away anyone's "rights" on anything , effects everyone, because you are then enpowering them to decide what other "rights" they don't think you need.

    If you don't understand that, then you have become part of the problem rather than part of the solution.

    We are going thru a similar thing here where State Law pre-empts now any Cities , etc. from prohibiting open carry. Some cities, don't like that .... they want the "power" in their hands to decide what's good for you and what isn't ..... however that is the reason for the pre-emption at the State Level. The hodge podge of laws in one spot vs another made it impossible for a person to know when and where they were legal, and when / where they weren't, and too many "gotcha" type laws. Some cities,.... resisted and whined and complained a lot, and argued all the same old junk...... the streets will run with blood, it will be the "old West again" ... blah blah blah. But, once they changed it .... nothing happened. Big Surprise.

    However, there are some cities flat refusing to do it....... and they are being "sued" ..... and it will be costly for them, and they will lose. They do it solely hoping no one can come up with the money to pay an attorney to fight the city, and they get their way by default. It's been a common practice for a long long time. One reason over time, we've ended up with so many stupid and idiotic laws in so many different places. Well, they found out..... ooops, they were serious.... they did sue us. It only takes winning 1 lawsuit, to pay for the next 10.

    The Dema-Gods in the city council, need to be reminded who they work for and that they are mere mortal humans.... who can also be voted out of office...... and can be made to look very politically un-viable as a candidate if they cost the city $$$$$$$$$$$ for a lawsuit that was ignorant to cause in the first place..... and had more to do with them wanting "control" than any real benefit to the citizens of the city.

    Keep getting the press out .... why it's "dumb" to have a hodge podge of laws, why it's the city creating the problem ... since they are pre-empted..... it's more about them wanting "power" than what is right or wrong. Keep arguing (letters , editorials, rally's, etc) that their arguments don't hold water.... there are plently of examples out here across the USA.


    A BIG BIG BIG thing ......

    1. if someone wants to be the test case and some attorney is willing to take it on .... to prove the pre-emption exist and therefore it was illegal for them to try to enforce their city ordinance, which then also if found to be true, the city knowingly did it ..... opens the city to a BIG personal based lawsuit they'll have to pay, plus all legal expenses, and it will amount to a lot of tax payer money wasted by them.

    2. Remind the press, if that occurs........ every single "case" the city brought against 'anyone' , opens them up to them all being over-turned and lawsuits, or even a class action lawsuit ...... so, they better open up the checkbook, get their pen out, and be ready to start writing some really big checks.
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  16. #45
    Ex Member Array F350's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AK_Brian View Post
    Well, from what I've read from the posts, it sounds like at best they are exploiting or interpreting an aspect of the existing state law. At worst, they are violating the established law outright.

    What would I do if it were me? Fight it. Intelligently. Don't go around brandishing (not that I'm assuming you would) a firearm to make a point, or bait cops.
    Well you and I differ! I would consult an attorney to make sure of the law; then if the ordnance were illegal I would take my attorney with me as I OCed in front of police HQ!!!!

    Hell it's just a piss-@ city ordnance; what's the fine?

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